Value of: SJ Timo Meier

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ZachaFlockaFlame

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We didnt shit on him, Fitzgerald and Ruff did that.

Lol yeah I'm sure Fitz wants to go out and spend assets + extension on a top 6 winger as opposed to seeing if Holtz can be that guy for cheaper + keeping the assets. I'm sure it's not the dinosaurs head coach.
 

Eggtimer

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I completely get what Shark fans are saying and thinking right now.
When Hall was being shopped around I for sure thought the return we would get would be pretty damn good . Just came off a Hart season , best winger available in the market. Still young , cap hit was decent.
I wanted Byram from Colorado or Soderstrom from the Yotes or Harley from the Stars. At the time it made complete sense to me that Hall is worth that . He was the only reason we made the playoffs the one year. He was for sure worth an unknown commodity in a Byram etc prospect.
I remember gettig shit on by Avalanche fans thinking Byram plus their goalie propesct was fair .
In reality , it just doesn’work that way. What we wound up getting in return I thought was a steaming pile of crap
Fast forward until now…. I’m glad we got what we got and would rather have Bahl , Mercer , than Byram. It all worked out in the end.
I know right now Meier is better than any pieces being offered right now . But to expect a piece like Jarvis , Mercer , it just does not happen . I get it . Meier is a stud and SHOULD be worth a ton but no team is going to give up a 21/ 22 year old player already producing and play important roles on their respective NHL teams . Especially a cost controlled you g player that is vital havimg their contract controlled while their teams are capped out and looking to win a cup while their windows are open.
Same thing applies for Nikishkin. He is a major piece of the Canes future on D . They cannot let a player go that almost needs to be a replacemnt for a top 4 (minimum) Dman as their current players are nearing their next big raise.

I know Holtz does t sound like a sexy prospect , mainly because Devils fans have been putting him out there for trade.
It has zero to do with his ability . He is a very good prospect. It’s just that we are at the point as an organization where we need a player that is ready NOW ( Meier ). We have Haula as our winger for Jack… that’s no way to use our cornerstone piece . We have the room, need , perfect fit amd that’s Meier . We prefer to try like hell to get him now and solidify our roster instead of waiting on Holtz. We can afford to trade him , but only for the right piece . It’s not like we are trying or wanting to dump him. Other prospects like Luke and Nemec , we have earmarked for our roster omce Seversom and Graves are gone . We cannot afford to let them go .

I know I am biased, I am trying to look at thinhs as unbiased as I can . I just cannot see any prospects that are being offered that have the value as Holtz . Nikishkin is the only one I can think of and the Canes habe said that he is not available at all.
Yes Jarvis is a better piece than Holtz . But again, Canes are not going to move him.
What else has been or could realistically be available that has more value than Holtz ?
I get it that Grier might not like Holtz as much as say a D or C prospect or hulking skilled forward. But even though he might prefer that , the value of Holtz in a vacuum is pretty damn high.
Who is to say that SJ could not trade Holtz? Either right away or in the summer as part of a package to gain picks or move up in the draft or trade for a simular D or C prospect ?
 
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Forge

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can anyone with knowledge and an objective opinion give their run down of these “red flags“ on Holtz? I’m not being a smart ass I’m genuinely curious.

I'm a devils fan, but just what I'm seeing / thinking so far.

Not a great skater, which is probably less of a deal on a team that doesn't play like the Devils (I have no idea what style the Sharks play, so I have no idea if he's a good fit or not). Doesn't play with a ton of urgency. Not going to be a puck transporter. He's got an elite level shot and he's very underrated as a passer (always has been because of the shot getting the attention). Good offensive awareness.

Also, I don't anticipate it continuing....I'd guess that it's the byproduct of him sitting so much....but he whiffs on a lot of shots right now? Like one timers and the like? Its very weird. LIS, I attribute it to the rust because it's such a weird thing to just disappear.

At minimum I'd think that he would be a an excellent power play sniper. At 5 on 5, he needs a better situation and I don't know what his top is. And yes, he's a complimentary top 6 player. Someone else will do the heavy lifting with the puck. He would be great with Jack, but we won't give him the change. He'd look great with Eklund. If he were traded to St Louis as part of a Buchnevich deal, he'd look great with Robert Thomas.
 

ZachaFlockaFlame

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Which RW?

This is come up multiple times, they can go get Vrana from Detroit if the Sharks don't move from their ask. 3-4M cheaper + 2 years left + better for their roster construction. They were multiple wingers on the trade market that NJ could've gotten last offseason as well. Devils have balked at high prices before. Sharks fans aren't going to admit it but the Sharks need the Devils more in this trade than vice versa because at the worst they're upping the value from Carolina.

Set to get bounced in the first or second round longterm, that's for sure. Unless they get Meier of course.

Pretty sure Meier has history of that himself, wouldn't be in a good fit in that case.
 

Zajacs Bowl Cut

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Set to get bounced in the first or second round longterm, that's for sure. Unless they get Meier of course.

the Devils are set up to be a powerhouse for years to come. Hughes is already a superstar at 21 years old.

I love how much that angers you, to be honest
 

Gecklund

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This is come up multiple times, they can go get Vrana from Detroit if the Sharks don't move from their ask. 3-4M cheaper + 2 years left + better for their roster construction. They were multiple wingers on the trade market that NJ could've gotten last offseason as well. Devils have balked at high prices before. Sharks fans aren't going to admit it but the Sharks need the Devils more in this trade than vice versa because at the worst they're upping the value from Carolina.



Pretty sure Meier has history of that himself, wouldn't be in a good fit in that case.
If you think Vrana, Boeser or an equivalent winger is a genuine replacement for Timo then we definitely don’t need you guys because you’d be offering absolute shit in return so wouldn’t make a difference.

Timo is the best player on the market. The Sharks don’t need any team because there will always be another waiting. Worse comes to worst they qualify him and trade him next deadline or at the draft or in FA. This isn’t a need to move now scenario like some of you are claiming.
 

ZachaFlockaFlame

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I'm a devils fan, but just what I'm seeing / thinking so far.

Not a great skater, which is probably less of a deal on a team that doesn't play like the Devils (I have no idea what style the Sharks play, so I have no idea if he's a good fit or not). Doesn't play with a ton of urgency. Not going to be a puck transporter. He's got an elite level shot and he's very underrated as a passer (always has been because of the shot getting the attention). Good offensive awareness.

Also, I don't anticipate it continuing....I'd guess that it's the byproduct of him sitting so much....but he whiffs on a lot of shots right now? Like one timers and the like? Its very weird. LIS, I attribute it to the rust because it's such a weird thing to just disappear.

At minimum I'd think that he would be a an excellent power play sniper. At 5 on 5, he needs a better situation and I don't know what his top is. And yes, he's a complimentary top 6 player. Someone else will do the heavy lifting with the puck. He would be great with Jack, but we won't give him the change. He'd look great with Eklund. If he were traded to St Louis as part of a Buchnevich deal, he'd look great with Robert Thomas.

The PP1 minutes aren't even his fault because it would mean you're pulling Bratt off to get on him there. I've advocated it for at points this year but they clearly don't care Holtz's development as a coaching staff, mainly Ruff.
 
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TheBeard

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I see that you are confirming that the only thing Meier does well is shooting the puck. The rest of his game is lackluster at best.

Mercer is already a better player today, and they would be crazy to move him for a one trick pony.
Jesus, you’re not even good at trolling. At least try to be productive and not just throw out dumb opinions for attention.
 

ZachaFlockaFlame

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If you think Vrana, Boeser or an equivalent winger is a genuine replacement for Timo then we definitely don’t need you guys because you’d be offering absolute shit in return so wouldn’t make a difference.

Timo is the best player on the market. The Sharks don’t need any team because there will always be another waiting. Worse comes to worst they qualify him and trade him next deadline or at the draft or in FA. This isn’t a need to move now scenario like some of you are claiming.

Lmao, Vrana is equally as a disgusting fit in NJ. The guy has had off ice issues but he's been a 0.5 goal per game player in Detroit. You guys think Timo is the second coming of Jesus with the way you've talked him up in this thread. And I'm sure a team is going to come in and pay his QO + extension a year from UFA while also giving the Sharks what they want. Nice fantasy land you live in. His highest value is right now at 50% at 3M to a contender.
 

Gecklund

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Lmao, Vrana is equally as a disgusting fit in NJ. The guy has had off ice issues but he's been a 0.5 goal per game player in Detroit. You guys think Timo is the second coming of Jesus with the way you've talked him up in this thread. And I'm sure a team is going to come in and pay his QO + extension a year from UFA while also giving the Sharks what they want. Nice fantasy land you live in.
The guy that has played 4 NHL games this year? Man you are just as bad as the Sharks fans in this thread. You are just as unrealistic. Devils fans are just as delusional as the Sharks fans expecting Nemec, Mercer and a first.
 

ZachaFlockaFlame

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The guy that has played 4 NHL games this year? Man you are just as bad as the Sharks fans in this thread. You are just as unrealistic. Devils fans are just as delusional as the Sharks fans expecting Nemec, Mercer and a first.

I prefaced by saying he's had off ice issues, maybe read before you post. If you're asking me to overpay for Meier and considering the prices they have been floated around here or if I rather get a good deal on Vrana due his off ice issues + Detroit looking for him to find a new spot, then the answer is not even close
 
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Gecklund

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I prefaced by saying he's had off ice issues, maybe read before you post. If you're asking me to overpay for Meier and considering the prices they have been floated around here or if I rather get a good deal on Vrana due his off ice issues + Detroit looking for him to find a new spot, then the answer is not even close
You said Vrana would be just as ridiculous for NJD yet I don’t read.
 

TheBeard

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He's doing the same thing your fanbase is doing, you took the bait one Devils fan saying Holtz sucks just like he took the bait of the Sharks fan asking for that package.
If you say so. Those of us against Holtz just don’t think he’s going to pan out. Just an opinion. Spouting non-existent trade offers to prove some kind of a point is just…. Well, lying.
 

Eggtimer

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If you think Vrana, Boeser or an equivalent winger is a genuine replacement for Timo then we definitely don’t need you guys because you’d be offering absolute shit in return so wouldn’t make a difference.

Timo is the best player on the market. The Sharks don’t need any team because there will always be another waiting. Worse comes to worst they qualify him and trade him next deadline or at the draft or in FA. This isn’t a need to move now scenario like some of you are claiming.
You have a finite time frame to move Meier and there are not many teams that have the 1. Cap room 2. Assets to pay .
Plus I’m guessing the fact that teams can on,y get him as a rental if Meier refuses to extend , will hamper his return. As of now , how many real , true , legit teams are offering right now that are as serious as the Devils and Canes ? Jets ? Meier is not extending in Winnipeg .
 
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sandybridge

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Lol. This is a weird attempt to discredit a guy who’s been to the playoff three times, and made it to the second round and the conference finals.


If you mean by slinging some hush money to the refs to screw over the Knights, Avs, and the Blues in three successive rounds, then sure.

Too bad they ran out of slush funds that year. Otherwise our Timo might have made it to the finals already.
 
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