Value of: SJ Timo Meier

[Zacha37]

I read this as Holtz would be a top 6er if Lindy put him in the top 6 at first and I was like well yeah I would be a top 6er if Lindy put me in the top 6 too.

With Holtz right now, I think it’s very hard to pin down his value. This year has been wasted whether Devils fans admit it or not. This would be a crucial year of development.

It’s a fair point but I don’t think his value has cratered as much as some Sharks fans say it has. He still should be considered a top 25 prospect across the league and as someone said before is less than a year removed from a PPG AHL season in his D+2.

 

[TheBeard]

Man, you are funny. I'll give you that

Hall had one big season and for the most part has underachieved. There’s a reason that he’s been on 5 teams in 13 seasons and has only made the playoffs 4 times.

 

[Gecklund]

It’s a fair point but I don’t think his value has cratered as much as some Sharks fans say it has. He still should be considered a top 25 prospect across the league and as someone said before is less than a year removed from a PPG AHL season in his D+2.

No it hasn’t but you can’t fault anyone for wanting a more sure thing over a situational winger.

 

[hidek91]

Just once I want a devils fan to talk about how tough it would be to give up Holtz and how it would be a mistake. With every other prospect it’s “they’re too big a piece of the future to risk it” but every time with Holtz it’s, “we’ll you gotta give to get a stud like Timo”.

Well, Holtz isn't living up to the draft expectations (all-around game is really bad, at least in NHL, he may have a lethal shot but he sometimes look totally lost) but if #7 overall draft pick would fulfill his potential, while still being very young, you wouldn't get him in a return for Meier (e. g. you wouldn't be getting Cozens or Q. Hughes, previous #7 picks before Holtz, in a return for Meier).

 

[Sharkz4Fun]

Taylor Hall literally won league MVP at 26 years old, same age as Meier now. Saying Meier has "way more value" than him or whatever it was you said, is insane.

It is absolutely HILARIOUS that you put that in quotes but never once did I say that. I said Meier is a better player than Hall. Toodles.

 

[Zacha37]

No it hasn’t but you can’t fault anyone for wanting a more sure thing over a situational winger.

I def understand but who potentially available would you consider a more sure thing?

 

[TheBeard]

Well, Holtz isn't living up to the draft expectations (all-around game is really bad, at least in NHL, he may have a lethal shot but he sometimes look totally lost) but if #7 overall draft pick would fulfill his potential, while still being very young, you wouldn't get him in a return for Meier (e. g. you wouldn't be getting Cozens or Q. Hughes, previous #7 picks before Holtz, in a return for Meier).

So the sharks may get him because… he’s looking like a bust?

 

[Gecklund]

I def understand but who potentially available would you consider a more sure thing?

Morrow is probably the one for me. I’d also prefer a higher first and a lesser prospect than Holtz and NJD 1st.

 

[Zacha37]

It is absolutely HILARIOUS that you put that in quotes but never once did I say that. I said Meier is a better player than Hall. Toodles.

Which also isn’t at all true.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

It is absolutely HILARIOUS that you put that in quotes but never once did I say that. I said Meier is a better player than Hall. Toodles.

right now, sure absolutely.

the year when Hall won the MVP? no shot.

 

[Alaskanice]

For those who are saying, “ if the trade pieces were accepted, the deal would be done.”
No one here knows. They could conceivably be discussing the players you don’t want to lose. Join the club, we don’t want to lose Timo either. That’s not up to us.

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

This thread gets hijacked by the same 2 Sharks fans daily bemoaning about Holtz

 

[hidek91]

Nemec, Mercer, and a 1st I realize is a hilarious ask now, but I do think *fair* value is one of those two plus the 1st. It's really just simple if you're Grier. If that were to get offered, even with something added with Timo (other than any 1st round pick swaps, hilariously stupid), you take it. If Timo MUST get traded in Grier's eyes, you settle for a 1 for 1 with one of the players. If he isn't sure and that horrible package with the b prospects is the final offer, you move on to another team or keep him. I imagine, or at least would hope, that's what Grier is doing now since its been this long.

You're going to be very disappointed with a return for Meier (doesn't matter if he's sent to NJ or not), you're not getting an asset of Nemec's or Mercer's value at all, that would be a fireable offense on Fitzgerald's part, Meier would have this value if you could somehow put him in a time machine, make him 21 y. o. again and turn back his contract into an ELC.

 

[EastVillageBlues]

Hall had one big season and for the most part has underachieved. There’s a reason that he’s been on 5 teams in 13 seasons and has only made the playoffs 4 times.

Timo has had maybe 1.5 good seasons, out of six seasons he has been full time in the league. He has not had an actual PPG season yet (although came close last year). And mostly floats around 40-60 points region. That's mostly a complementary 2nd line scorer.

To say that he is superior to Hall at the same age is not only insane, but is a reflection of the amount of delusion that permeates the SJS fanbase.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Morrow is way better than him? Bigger, I guess.

Anyway, Holtz is a great prospect and it’s hilarious how downplayed he’s been by some of these sharks fans. Especially when there’s multiple other high level pieces in these proposals.

 

[PacificOceanPotion]

he had a ppg season in the AHL 6-8 months ago, as a 20 year old

He hasnt been given a fair shot this year, point blank

He has a lethal shot and if put in the right situations, he will score goals

Aka on Eklunds hip. I’m tracking Bud

 

[TheBeard]

Timo has had maybe 1.5 good seasons, out of six seasons he has been full time in the league. He has not had an actual PPG season yet (although came close last year). And mostly floats around 40-60 points region. That's mostly a complementary 2nd line scorer.

To say that he is superior to Hall at the same age is not only insane, but is a reflection of the amount of delusion that permeates the SJS fanbase.

Timo has three times as many 30
Goal seasons in 6 seasons as Hall has had in 13

 

[Devil made me do it]

So according to you, even though Holtz is your best forward prospect by a mile, you’d still rather give him up than a defense prospect of which you are loaded with others?

Again; not exactly a glowing review for Holtz.

Holtz sucks which is why the Devils wanna offload him.
Nemec is untouchable. Nevermind the fact that he was a 2nd overall pick. The kid has an elite hockey sense and is poised beyond his years. An RD at that which don't grow on trees. Wheeler touted him as the best defenseman to come out of Slovakia since Zdeno Chara.
Nemec and Mercer are simply untouchable. If Sharks GM insists on one of those two as part of a trade package, best of luck to him with offers from other teams.

 

[megajake]

Trading Nemec is borderline stupidity.

It makes the Devils a way better team now and in the future.

 

[hidek91]

So the sharks may get him because… he’s looking like a bust?

As a part of the package (I don't think that any of Nemec/L. Hughes/Mercer is realistic) and with the hope that a change of scenery may turn him into something useful, his shot is really lethal but the red flags are so big that I'd be very suprised if he becomes a bonafide top 6 forward.

 

[Sharkz4Fun]

Holtz sucks which is why the Devils wanna offload him.
Nemec is untouchable. Nevermind the fact that he was a 2nd overall pick. The kid has an elite hockey sense and is poised beyond his years. An RD at that which don't grow on trees. Wheeler touted him as the best defenseman to come out of Slovakia since Zdeno Chara.
Nemec and Mercer are simply untouchable. If Sharks GM insists on one of those two as part of a trade package, best of luck to him with offers from other teams.

Thank you for at least being a reasonable devils fan. If your fellow Devilers' just said "Holtz sucks, I wanna laugh when we get Meier for him!" I'd be so much more game for that trade. Trying to pretend like he's going to be good is just brutal.

 

[PacificOceanPotion]

can anyone with knowledge and an objective opinion give their run down of these “red flags“ on Holtz? I’m not being a smart ass I’m genuinely curious.

 

[themelkman]

Well, Holtz isn't living up to the draft expectations (all-around game is really bad, at least in NHL, he may have a lethal shot but he sometimes look totally lost) but if #7 overall draft pick would fulfill his potential, while still being very young, you wouldn't get him in a return for Meier (e. g. you wouldn't be getting Cozens or Q. Hughes, previous #7 picks before Holtz, in a return for Meier).

Yeah but guys who have years this bad tend to look more like Lias Anderson or Pavel Zacha than Cozens or Hughes.

Im not saying hes a ruined player, but these things do effect players in confidence and other impacts that can lead them to not getting to where they couldve.

 

[TheBeard]

Holtz sucks which is why the Devils wanna offload him.
Nemec is untouchable. Nevermind the fact that he was a 2nd overall pick. The kid has an elite hockey sense and is poised beyond his years. An RD at that which don't grow on trees. Wheeler touted him as the best defenseman to come out of Slovakia since Zdeno Chara.
Nemec and Mercer are simply untouchable. If Sharks GM insists on one of those two as part of a trade package, best of luck to him with offers from other teams.

I get that and understand, and I also appreciate the honesty regarding Holtz. Everyone else seems to want to make all sorts of excuses for why Holtz hasn’t looked good but the reality is it appears as if the fans know his value will never be as high as it is now and they don’t want to wait say another year of unknown because by then he’ll end up just being traded either as a change of scenery or because he’s tired of not getting the opportunities he’s clearly not earned.

can anyone with knowledge and an objective opinion give their run down of these “red flags“ on Holtz? I’m not being a smart ass I’m genuinely curious.

Think Merkley as a European forward.

 

[themelkman]

This thread gets hijacked by the same 2 Sharks fans daily bemoaning about Holtz

And the same two devils fans responding and saying the sharks wont get anything other than that. How do you still only see a one way street here when you respond to every single post about the guy.

This is the Timo Meier trade thread, if you dont want to see sharks fans dont enter it.