Sign Marner and Tavares before playoffs?

[Confucius]

Even you said no more than 11. It won't be but it needs not to be close to 13 for me.

I wouldn’t give more than 11, so I already know I won’t be a happy camper no matter what happens. lol! I’ll just have to grin and bear it and carry on. GLG!

 

[Evilhomer]

sign Mitch , let Tavares walk

JT has been in the league 16 yrs and has only had one good playoff series , that's should be a large enough sample size for people to realize we shouldn't bring him back .

without Marner we probably don't even make the playoffs next year

I don't get the desire to keep an aging player for several more years. Again, if the team could sign him for two years, no problem I'm on board. But anything longer than that wouldn't make sense to me.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

Never wrestle in the mud with a pig because you’ll get dirty and the pig will enjoy it.

That's why they should just give them both what they want now. Why bother waiting to see if they do anything in the playoffs. We all know they won't.

Despite that they'll demand to be paid like champions.

This organization epitomizes a losing culture. The only person of significance held accountable for poor performance has been Keefe. The players are continually rewarded with raises regardless.

Lack of accountability breeds a culture where results aren't important.

They should make the postseason every year with this core and that's all that matters. In their eyes so long as they're in the playoffs they can continue to call themselves a contender. Dressing up the failure in attempt to hide the stink.

Putting wings on a pig won't turn it into an eagle.

 

[Maple Leaf]

Never wrestle in the mud with a pig because you’ll get dirty and the pig will enjoy it.

That's why they should just give them both what they want now. Why bother waiting to see if they do anything in the playoffs. We all know they won't.

Despite that they'll demand to be paid like champions.

This organization epitomizes a losing culture. The only person of significance held accountable for poor performance has been Keefe. The players are continually rewarded with raises regardless.

Lack of accountability breeds a culture where results aren't important.

They should make the postseason every year with this core and that's all that matters. In their eyes so long as they're in the playoffs they can continue to call themselves a contender. Dressing up the failure in attempt to hide the stink.

Putting wings on a pig won't turn into an eagle.

They just keep the cash flowin it is all profit run it back

 

[Community]

It 100% depends on what they're asking for now.

If JT is asking for market value, then it's a no now and will stay that way. I dont think he's brought back unless it's a good deal for the Leafs and they should therefore be fine to wait it out if that's not an option. It'll be a less severe version of the Stamkos/TBay discussion where he'll definitely be able to get a higher avg somewhere else if he wants to leave.

For Marner, it also depends on the ask; however, he likely has more power the longer this drags out given there will be no shortage of teams offering him a truckload of money if he becomes a UFA. Another poor playoff showing might dissuade the Leafs from offering him top dollar, but there will be plenty of other teams still eager to pay him thinking it's a collective Leaf team issue rather than just him.

 

[ToneDog]

I don't get the desire to keep an aging player for several more years. Again, if the team could sign him for two years, no problem I'm on board. But anything longer than that wouldn't make sense to me.

Could be a Tanev LTIR contract that keeps the cap hit down. If he hits 35 goals, he probably can get $6+m on the open market. I'd offer $7m+6m+5m, spread it over 6 years and hope to get two good years before he goes LTIR. Like some keep saying, the cap is going up as well.

 

[Gary Nylund]

It 100% depends on what they're asking for now.

If JT is asking for market value, then it's a no now and will stay that way. I dont think he's brought back unless it's a good deal for the Leafs and they should therefore be fine to wait it out if that's not an option. It'll be a less severe version of the Stamkos/TBay discussion where he'll definitely be able to get a higher avg somewhere else if he wants to leave.

For Marner, it also depends on the ask; however, he likely has more power the longer this drags out given there will be no shortage of teams offering him a truckload of money if he becomes a UFA. Another poor playoff showing might dissuade the Leafs from offering him top dollar, but there will be plenty of other teams still eager to pay him thinking it's a collective Leaf team issue rather than just him.

Agree completely on JT, the Stamkos/TBay analogy seems like a good one. He wants to stay here, so take a bit less money. And he was so lucky to get that last contract before covid hit so hopefully he'll keep that in mind and not be greedy.

I take a similar approach with Marner. If you want to make as much money as you can, then goodbye. He like JT was super lucky to get a massive deal before covid hit, it's his home town as well plus there's all that endorsement money, time to give us a a discount or goodbye. And I'd wait until the playoffs are over because if he turns into a 40 point player again after the first 4 games of the playoffs I'm not sure I'd want keep gambling on him anyway.

 

[ToneDog]

It 100% depends on what they're asking for now.

If JT is asking for market value, then it's a no now and will stay that way. I dont think he's brought back unless it's a good deal for the Leafs and they should therefore be fine to wait it out if that's not an option. It'll be a less severe version of the Stamkos/TBay discussion where he'll definitely be able to get a higher avg somewhere else if he wants to leave.

For Marner, it also depends on the ask; however, he likely has more power the longer this drags out given there will be no shortage of teams offering him a truckload of money if he becomes a UFA. Another poor playoff showing might dissuade the Leafs from offering him top dollar, but there will be plenty of other teams still eager to pay him thinking it's a collective Leaf team issue rather than just him.

He can't get an 8th year once he becomes a UFA. Leafs are the team that can pay him the most so unless he is like JT and wants out, and is willing to leave money on the table. I doubt that is in his DNA.

 

[sunstersun]

Hell no. Don't sign anyone before playoffs.

If we lay another egg get eliminated in the first round. What will it be this time? Goaltending? Defence???

 

[Punch Drunk Loov]

This question really comes down to: are you happy with the status quo or not? The answer for a serious franchise contender should be a resounding no

 

[thewave]

Hell no. Don't sign anyone before playoffs.

If we lay another egg get eliminated in the first round. What will it be this time? Goaltending? Defence???

With you there. They need to prove it to get paid top dollar

 

[Evilhomer]

Could be a Tanev LTIR contract that keeps the cap hit down. If he hits 35 goals, he probably can get $6+m on the open market. I'd offer $7m+6m+5m, spread it over 6 years and hope to get two good years before he goes LTIR. Like some keep saying, the cap is going up as well.

Tavares is pretty durable. I can't imagine he is an LTIR risk at any point in the next few years.

 

[nuck]

He can't get an 8th year once he becomes a UFA. Leafs are the team that can pay him the most so unless he is like JT and wants out, and is willing to leave money on the table. I doubt that is in his DNA.

Will got UFA money plus the 8th year and full NM until retirement. Why would Mitch expect any less when he will be an an actual UFA ? When Shanny said everything is on the table he was referring to every dollar the club has in order to keep the band together.

If you have never held the line in a negotiation you have zero leverage with the next one and the player owns your ass. Tre has continued the Dubas strategy of getting railed, whether driven by Shanny or not. I expect it will be less than Matthews but can't say for certain since he will be "gifting" the club those extra years. Plus you know the cap is going up which no other player or agent was aware of when they signed the latest deals

Edit. $12.75M x 8

 

[BraveCanadian]

Will got UFA money plus the 8th year and full NM until retirement. Why would Mitch expect any less when he will be an an actual UFA ?

Not to mention Marner is just plain better.

 

[ZEBROA]

Never wrestle in the mud with a pig because you’ll get dirty and the pig will enjoy it.

That's why they should just give them both what they want now. Why bother waiting to see if they do anything in the playoffs. We all know they won't.

Despite that they'll demand to be paid like champions.

This organization epitomizes a losing culture. The only person of significance held accountable for poor performance has been Keefe. The players are continually rewarded with raises regardless.

Lack of accountability breeds a culture where results aren't important.

They should make the postseason every year with this core and that's all that matters. In their eyes so long as they're in the playoffs they can continue to call themselves a contender. Dressing up the failure in attempt to hide the stink.

Putting wings on a pig won't turn it into an eagle.

But if you put wings on a boar... that would be realy dangerous. To bad all we got is a piglet.

 

[Hallonbroder]

This question really comes down to: are you happy with the status quo or not? The answer for a serious franchise contender should be a resounding no

This. Oh, this.

 

[banks]

I came in here thinking "no way, jose". But I actually think it would be fine to extend them both before the playoffs.

I'd put pen to paper for Tavares any time he wants. If the number is right, then the timing doesn't matter too much to me. Sooner could actually be better, since his stock is only going up with his strong season. For Marner? What happens if he has no deal until after the playoffs? Think it through.

Sign him now and he rocks the playoffs? The deal is probably less than if they had waited.
Sign him now and he flops in the playoffs? You can still trade him.

Hold off and he rocks the playoffs? Now he has all the negotiating power in the world. You'll overpay worse.
Hold off and he flops in the playoffs? You risk losing him for nothing as a UFA.

 

[Dekes For Days]

Should have signed them (or at least Marner) 5 months ago.

 

[LeafEgo]

I don't get the desire to keep an aging player for several more years. Again, if the team could sign him for two years, no problem I'm on board. But anything longer than that wouldn't make sense to me.

I've always felt the leverage over JT is generally under appreciated. Start negotiations off with a pay by the drink approach, one year at a time, and at a discounted rate.

But if he scores 40 goals looking like Pavelski and 2C's us to the ECF we may have to roll up our sleeves planning a strategy down the middle for the near term.

Don't see why we need to go more than two years though, just maybe at a higher price point than before.

 

[Cap'n Flavour]

I'd put pen to paper for Tavares any time he wants. If the number is right, then the timing doesn't matter too much to me.

"If the number is right" but it won't be. He's not going to keep signing 5M 1Y contracts until his play falls off just as a favour to the team.

 

[thewave]

Better to make two big dollar players show off and play their asses off in the PO then give it up front. I mean that's gotta be in some management guide for dummies book

 

[Mess]

Leafs currently have 4 of the top 12 highest paid players in the game and they're tied for 20th in goals for.

TERRIBLE return on investment. This nonsense has got to stop !!!

We have all seen this Regular Season Warriors and Playoff Paper Tigers act from this Leafs core 4 for long enough.

There is no way this team should double down on former Clueless Dubas bad contracts without FIRST getting playoff return on investment. IMO

"Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me".. I'm not getting played for the fool after watching the last 8 past playoffs end in disappointment and failure.

Playoffs or bust for this core 4.

If JT cuts his current deal in 1/2 to about $5-6 mil on short term 2-3 years he can retire a Leaf as the teams future 3rd line centre.

Mitch Marner a small, soft perimeter playoff performer who has scored 11 playoff goals after 8 playoff seasons which is the equivalent of bringing a Knife to a Gun fight come playoff hockey. "A Leopard never chances its spots".

So my Wish list is that next year Leafs top line is Matthew Knies -- Auston Matthews -- Mikka Rantanen .. (as long as he remains unsigned).

I really want the Leafs to win another Stanley Cup in my lifetime as its been a long time since 1967.

 

[banks]

"If the number is right" but it won't be. He's not going to keep signing 5M 1Y contracts until his play falls off just as a favour to the team.

Sure. But the question is about timing. Do you think after the playoffs he'll suddenly decide to sign a 5M 1Y contract as a favour to the team?

The price on Tavares is probably only going up. So unless people think it's better to let him walk, then sign him now.

 

[sxvnert]

The max I would offer JT is the Tanev contract (6yr/4.5m aav), otherwise tell him to take a hike.

 

[thewave]

The max I would offer JT is the Tanev contract (6yr/4.5m aav), otherwise tell him to take a hike.

Yeah that may work. Still means we only have a 3 year window to win. The last 3 or 4 years probably look awful but we are also probably in rebuild.