Should have kept Schenn

[Brew]

I'll sell you a Komi jersey for 5 bucks.

What do I do after he gets traded?

Keep the jersey?

 

[4evaBlue]

He seems to be in front an awful lot on this point shots

That flick was the major reason why I was excited about his acquisition, and why I made the comment I did. While he's not overly physical, he does spend considerable area in those tough areas the majority of the team seems to shy away from.

 

[SteveV*]

I won't miss one dimensional lead foot at all.

 

[Hyperglide]

A lot of people are gonna be mad that I say this but I'm just gonna be blunt and not deconstruct or provide interesting points or reasoning.

He flat out sucks.

The fact that Burke got anything decent is amazing.

Schenn was the Bargnani of the Leafs.

Flame away.

 

[LeafsRReady]

I think BB was right, and Luke should have gone back to the Rockets.

Well, if he felt that strongly, then BB could have still sent him back to junior after he was hired. Yes, Schenn was past his nine games, but he could have still been sent back.

 

[RogerRoeper*]

Well, if he felt that strongly, then BB could have still sent him back to junior after he was hired. Yes, Schenn was past his nine games, but he could have still been sent back.

It really was too late to send him back at that point. Burke did say he would have sent Schenn down if he was GM from the start of the season.

 

[RogerRoeper*]

A lot of people are gonna be mad that I say this but I'm just gonna be blunt and not deconstruct or provide interesting points or reasoning.

He flat out sucks.

The fact that Burke got anything decent is amazing.

Schenn was the Bargnani of the Leafs.

Flame away.

He was solid for 2 out of his 4 seasons and was the NHL's leading in hits by D-Men the last couple of years.

You have to keep in mind he was still just 22 last season.

 

[Larcos_Unal]

I love the assumption that Luke is going to turn into a mean defenseman, look at those blue eyes and those dimples. Does this man strike fear into anybody's heart? A teenage puck bunny maybe!

Regardless of what Schenn is able to do in Philly, he was done in Toronto. Some of those turnovers he committed last season were errors that shouldn't be done in pee wee. His puckhandling is atrocious and the more under the microscope he got, the more often they happened.

To be honest he'll probably do really well in Philly, they have a much tougher team than we do which will allow him to get away with more, and their forwards a much more skilled which will help with getting the puck out of his zone.

 

[ULF_55]

Have to laugh, I hated the pick, I wanted Filatov , what do I know ?

Filatov is 22, same age as Kadri and Colborne.

Now I wanted Collin Wilson, not Filatov, but can we say Filatov is done as a prospect? Are we saying Colborne is done as a prospect? Is Kyle Beach done as a prospect?

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/nhl2008e.html

I'm not saying he is or isn't, but do we apply the same timelines to everyone?

Mikhail Stefanovich looks to be done ...

Failed business, busted dreams always make me

 

[LeafsRReady]

It really was too late to send him back at that point. Burke did say he would have sent Schenn down if he was GM from the start of the season.

Do you mean he couldn't send him back under the CBA rules, or that because he had been with the Leafs for so many games, he didn't feel it was right to send him back. I'm assuming you mean the latter, in which case the answer remains that Burke could have overruled RW and sent him back. He didn't. I understand why, but he still played a part in that decision not to send him back to junior.

 

[ULF_55]

Do you mean he couldn't send him back under the CBA rules, or that because he had been with the Leafs for so many games, he didn't feel it was right to send him back. I'm assuming you mean the latter, in which case the answer remains that Burke could have overruled RW and sent him back. He didn't. I understand why, but he still played a part in that decision not to send him back to junior.

The year he went over to play in the world's and he was on the big ice I felt so bad for him. Seeing players scoot by him and then seeing him skating behind them trying to catch up ...

I really question his manager (Schenn's personal manager) and their strategies for improving his game. He should have been working speed improvement, not trying to add bulk. You don't have to be huge to play defense, Schenn naturally has some size, that would have taken care of itself, but quickness is another story.

Kulemin at 225 was the fastest on the Leafs in their competitions, so he can carry the weight, Schenn was (I'll use past tense) embarrassingly slow, the modern day Marsh. Brad played over 1,000 NHL games, but that was during the era when you could hogtie someone and not get a penalty.

If Schenn can come back when the season starts in 2014, a little lighter and faster he should have no problems. He has the ability to play in the NHL, with improved quickness he might approach the Adam Foote comparisions.

 

[LeafsRReady]

I really question his manager (Schenn's personal manager) and their strategies for improving his game. He should have been working speed improvement, not trying to add bulk. You don't have to be huge to play defense, Schenn naturally has some size, that would have taken care of itself, but quickness is another story.

Agreed. He was drafted as a shutdown guy and I think it was implanted in his brain that he had to be some kind of a beast. Hence his training with Weber when he bulked up.

Guys like Gunnarsson and Ranger are way lighter but way more effective. Schenn could still play a fairly physical game without being too slow at 215 to 220 pounds.

 

[thewave]

Agreed. He was drafted as a shutdown guy and I think it was implanted in his brain that he had to be some kind of a beast. Hence his training with Weber when he bulked up.

Guys like Gunnarsson and Ranger are way lighter but way more effective. Schenn could still play a fairly physical game without being too slow at 215 to 220 pounds.

Yeah not going to be missing Schenn anytime soon thats for sure. JVR was well worth it to the point of being a fleecing

 

[Hyperglide]

He was solid for 2 out of his 4 seasons and was the NHL's leading in hits by D-Men the last couple of years.

You have to keep in mind he was still just 22 last season.

He handled a puck like a live grenade, looked like he was skating with concrete boots on skating on molasses in a sandstorm, and who cares about hits, if you can't kill penalties have terrible on man d and can't skate or clear a zone.

He sucked period. I don't get the love this guy got, so damn overrated.

Sure he's young but that's no excuse. Leafs shouldn't have rushed him.

 

[sgupca]

JVR for Schenn was a deal that we just couldnt turn down. I've always been a firm believer that you don't draft a stay dman in the top 5 picks. Guys like Brayden McNabb and Nik Grossman comes to mind (solid dman - comparable to Schenn, that we're drafted in the 2nd/3rd rounds).

Skill first in the early 1st rd, you build your team around solid role players in the later rounds.

 

[ULF_55]

JVR for Schenn was a deal that we just couldnt turn down. I've always been a firm believer that you don't draft a stay dman in the top 5 picks. Guys like Brayden McNabb and Nik Grossman comes to mind (solid dman - comparable to Schenn, that we're drafted in the 2nd/3rd rounds).

Skill first in the early 1st rd, you build your team around solid role players in the later rounds.

So I'm guessing you were very happy it was Rielly not Dumba.

 

[RogerRoeper*]

JVR for Schenn was a deal that we just couldnt turn down. I've always been a firm believer that you don't draft a stay dman in the top 5 picks. Guys like Brayden McNabb and Nik Grossman comes to mind (solid dman - comparable to Schenn, that we're drafted in the 2nd/3rd rounds).

Skill first in the early 1st rd, you build your team around solid role players in the later rounds.

I agree. For all the ovehyping of "Defensive Play" nowadays, you have to draft for skill. That must be the priority.

 

[mydnyte]

Maybe I don't know enough bout JVR. Or I just really like Schenn but I kinda regret trading him. I mean we didn't give him a chance to thrive in a defensive system Carlyle will most likely bring. Plus Schenn was what I thought could be that big mean staple defense man on the second pairing. I see Reilly and Gards being our offensive 1-2 punch but it would of been nice to have Phanuef and Schenn as the mean bruiser guys. The only prospect who I think has a chance of making the nhl and being that guy is Holzer and he's more of a 3rd pairing guy. But hey who knows maybe having the main mean guy being Phanuef and then having a good 2way defenseman like Blacker will be good enough.

Do you guys think JVR could be a potential #1 winger? Or do you are him being more of a really good 2nd liner.

P. S. I know he went 2nd overall, I just have/had big expectations for Schenn.

Carlyle saw him play and he was shipped off soon afterwards ...that should tell you all you need to know

 

[charliolemieux]

Filatov is 22, same age as Kadri and Colborne.

Now I wanted Collin Wilson, not Filatov, but can we say Filatov is done as a prospect? Are we saying Colborne is done as a prospect? Is Kyle Beach done as a prospect?

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/nhl2008e.html

I'm not saying he is or isn't, but do we apply the same timelines to everyone?

Mikhail Stefanovich looks to be done ...

Failed business, busted dreams always make me

Filatov ran home. I question if he even wants to play in the NHL. To me that makes him bust material, more than his inability to make any type of impact in CLB. However his failure to make Ottawa when they were in a full "Play the kids mode" (except Mika) is a bad sign.

Atleast KAdri would have made the LEafs if not for injury last year. Then Carlyle said he would have kept him up if he had been allowed. I thnk he would get way mroe than a 3rd in return if we traded him too.

Now Colborne is a mystery but thsoe wrist injuries are hard to come back from. I said before Pronger and LEcavalier were never the same player after their inuries and Colborne is starting with far less talent.

 

[charliolemieux]

Do you mean he couldn't send him back under the CBA rules, or that because he had been with the Leafs for so many games, he didn't feel it was right to send him back. I'm assuming you mean the latter, in which case the answer remains that Burke could have overruled RW and sent him back. He didn't. I understand why, but he still played a part in that decision not to send him back to junior.

Once they play 10games it counts as one full year of their ELC's.

That could end up costing you millions in cap room a few years down the road.

 

[charliolemieux]

Carlyle saw him play and he was shipped off soon afterwards ...that should tell you all you need to know

Pretty much.

I really feel sorry for the kid. A D-man his style should never have seen the NHL in a crazy market like Toronto until he was 23 or 24.

Just goes to show how bad this team was before Burke got here. At 18yrs old Schenn was our best D-man in training camp. At 22 he can't hardly make our top 6.

 

[ULF_55]

Pretty much.

I really feel sorry for the kid. A D-man his style should never have seen the NHL in a crazy market like Toronto until he was 23 or 24.

Just goes to show how bad this team was before Burke got here. At 18yrs old Schenn was our best D-man in training camp. At 22 he can't hardly make our top 6.

Sorry, but I never thought Schenn was the best defender on the Leafs ever.

I was the grumpy goat here because I didn't fall in with the love-in crowd for Schenn. We've seen it with subsequent prospects here, where they are stars and you absolutely cannot point out any flaws or great wailing and crying arises from the masses.

There is a mob mentality here at times and a mob doesn't have to be correct, it is about numbers.

It appears, for the most part, the veil has been lifted and others see more clearly now.

 

[RogerRoeper*]

Pretty much.

I really feel sorry for the kid. A D-man his style should never have seen the NHL in a crazy market like Toronto until he was 23 or 24.

Just goes to show how bad this team was before Burke got here. At 18yrs old Schenn was our best D-man in training camp. At 22 he can't hardly make our top 6.

Well, Kadri was our best forward in preseason as a rookie, and Burke still sent him down.

 

[charliolemieux]

Well, Kadri was our best forward in preseason as a rookie, and Burke still sent him down.

TWo Words: Gilbert Brule.

Was kept up by CLB (our buddy MacLean) and proceeded to have his sternum broke. Hasn't been the same since.

Kadri was simply too small to be in the NHL.

Burke does not like 18yr olds in the NHL. If he had been here in Oct 2008, to send Schenn back down we would be all excited about this 22yr old bone crushing bruiser we got on the Marlies that's gonna come up and paste everyone 8 ways to Sunday next year.

Several things affected Schenn being up here too early. Among them is the **** kicking he took from Neil.

Burke has No problem with keeping yong guys in the minors.

 

[charliolemieux]

Sorry, but I never thought Schenn was the best defender on the Leafs ever.

I was the grumpy goat here because I didn't fall in with the love-in crowd for Schenn. We've seen it with subsequent prospects here, where they are stars and you absolutely cannot point out any flaws or great wailing and crying arises from the masses.

There is a mob mentality here at times and a mob doesn't have to be correct, it is about numbers.

It appears, for the most part, the veil has been lifted and others see more clearly now.

I'm goin by What Wilson said. http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/story/2008/10/27/nhl-mapleleafs-schenn.html

"He has been our best defenceman, defensively, in almost every game," Wilson said. "That is good enough for me."

That is why he was kept up. That is why he got ruined.