Should Cronin be fired? Yay or Nay?

[Dr Johnny Fever]

The answer Verbeek would give is the entire reason Cronin was hired (and probably the reason he won't be fired, at least until after the season). Verbeek hired Cronin to teach and develop and instill work ethic and accountability, none of which have anything to do with tactics or with being a "player's coach."

Unfortunately Cronin took that to mean he could rob Peter to pay Paul and not be accountable for an abysmal offense.

 

[JAHV]

Unfortunately Cronin took that to mean he could rob Peter to pay Paul and not be accountable for an abysmal offense.

Again, I'm not going to defend his coaching ability; he seems like a pretty terrible offensive coach. But I don't think this has anything to do with Cronin not being accountable. The only one Cronin is accountable to is Verbeek and if Verbeek thinks Cronin is doing a great job instilling work ethic and good practice habits into these guys, then Cronin's meeting the standards that were set for him.

Verbeek is ultimately accountable for the product on the ice, but he's not the one who has to answer questions after each game. As fans, it sucks to watch. But I think we just have to wear the frustration. There's no way we can test what Cronin is actually being asked to do since it's all behind the scenes.

 

[Hockey Duckie]

Again, I'm not going to defend his coaching ability; he seems like a pretty terrible offensive coach. But I don't think this has anything to do with Cronin not being accountable. The only one Cronin is accountable to is Verbeek and if Verbeek thinks Cronin is doing a great job instilling work ethic and good practice habits into these guys, then Cronin's meeting the standards that were set for him.

Verbeek is ultimately accountable for the product on the ice, but he's not the one who has to answer questions after each game. As fans, it sucks to watch. But I think we just have to wear the frustration. There's no way we can test what Cronin is actually being asked to do since it's all behind the scenes.

Cronin is just Verbeek's avatar on the bench.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

Again, I'm not going to defend his coaching ability; he seems like a pretty terrible offensive coach. But I don't think this has anything to do with Cronin not being accountable. The only one Cronin is accountable to is Verbeek and if Verbeek thinks Cronin is doing a great job instilling work ethic and good practice habits into these guys, then Cronin's meeting the standards that were set for him.

Verbeek is ultimately accountable for the product on the ice, but he's not the one who has to answer questions after each game. As fans, it sucks to watch. But I think we just have to wear the frustration. There's no way we can test what Cronin is actually being asked to do since it's all behind the scenes.

Well obviously we don’t know the details of any conversations but my point being that nobody is hired to only do half the job. Winning still has to be part of the teaching equation. Even with an emphasis on the things you outline, it’s crazy to listen to Cronin have absolutely nothing to say about how to develop the offensive skills many of these kids have. It’s almost like he doesn’t think that’s part of his job.

 

[JAHV]

Well obviously we don’t know the details of any conversations but my point being that nobody is hired to only do half the job. Winning still has to be part of the teaching equation. Even with an emphasis on the things you outline, it’s crazy to listen to Cronin have absolutely nothing to say about how to develop the offensive skills many of these kids have. It’s almost like he doesn’t think that’s part of his job.

I think Cronin might very well have been hired to do half the job. Or, at least, that was his main goal and winning was secondary. So he might not think it's part of it's job because Verbeek didn't emphasize it as part of his main goals.

I also don't think Cronin was hired to speak well to the media after games. I'm with everyone else who is annoyed at the less than stellar play on the ice and the lack of progress from some guys who are supposedly pretty talented hockey players. But I just can't bring myself to care about what he says postgame. It doesn't matter.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

I think Cronin might very well have been hired to do half the job. Or, at least, that was his main goal and winning was secondary. So he might not think it's part of it's job because Verbeek didn't emphasize it as part of his main goals.

I also don't think Cronin was hired to speak well to the media after games. I'm with everyone else who is annoyed at the less than stellar play on the ice and the lack of progress from some guys who are supposedly pretty talented hockey players. But I just can't bring myself to care about what he says postgame. It doesn't matter.

I watch every third or fourth of his post game pressers now. If he says something really stupid (based on others' comments) I'll maybe go back and watch it, otherwise I can't deal with him anymore.

 

[CrazyDuck4u]

Let's say we do can Cronin? Who do you go for? I would go after galant

 

[HanSolo]

Let's say we do can Cronin? Who do you go for? I would go after galant

I wouldn't. Would be the same shit as far as youth development is concerned.

 

[Gliff]

Let's say we do can Cronin? Who do you go for? I would go after galant

Interim coach to finish out the year.

Unless it is a homerun pick like Bruce.

 

[91Fedorov]

I have to admit, half the times I look at this site now it's to see if there's news of a Cronin firing. It feels morbid, but it's the truth.

 

[Lord Flashheart]

I think Cronin might very well have been hired to do half the job. Or, at least, that was his main goal and winning was secondary. So he might not think it's part of it's job because Verbeek didn't emphasize it as part of his main goals.

I also don't think Cronin was hired to speak well to the media after games. I'm with everyone else who is annoyed at the less than stellar play on the ice and the lack of progress from some guys who are supposedly pretty talented hockey players. But I just can't bring myself to care about what he says postgame. It doesn't matter.

Cronin was indeed hired to prepare the team to successfully navigate first part of the rebuild, there is no doubt about that, however he's not doing a good enough job at. All it would take is average goalies performance to be dead last, and this is not an exaggeration.

 

[Hockey Duckie]

I wouldn't. Would be the same shit as far as youth development is concerned.

Well... Cronin didn't coach for the last 20 games of last season. It didn't hurt us much. Helps LaCombe develop b/c Cronin wasn't going ape shit on him (LaCombe needed therapy for that). What is an additional 20 more games on top of that?

With that said, Cronin probably conferred with Verbeek about not coaching for the last 20 games last season and Verbeek was onboard. Cronin is safe for the season b/c he is Verbeek's avatar. Otherwise, we could have went after Montgomery or McLellan already.

 

[JAHV]

Cronin was indeed hired to prepare the team to successfully navigate first part of the rebuild, there is no doubt about that, however he's not doing a good enough job at. All it would take is average goalies performance to be dead last, and this is not an exaggeration.

We're certainly not seeing development. If it's happening, it's happening in the background and it's either not translating to games, or it's translating in ways that we as fans just can't see.

But again, I suspect that a large part of why Verbeek hired Cronin was for the background stuff that we'll never see - the off-ice practice habits and whatnot. Eventually, those need to translate into on-ice results, but I suspect (hope?) that Verbeek has someone else in mind for that phase of the rebuild.

 

[Hockey Duckie]

Cronin was indeed hired to prepare the team to successfully navigate first part of the rebuild, there is no doubt about that, however he's not doing a good enough job at. All it would take is average goalies performance to be dead last, and this is not an exaggeration.

Here is the stats between the two seasons with our goalies. Both Dostal and Gibby have raised their game play this season.

2023-24
Gibby: 46 games, 0.888 Sv%, and 3.54 GAA
Dostal: 44 games, 0.902 Sv%, and 3.33 GAA

2024-25
Dostal: 27 games, 0.910 Sv%, and 2.88 GAA
Gibby: 18 games, 0.906 Sv%, and 2.90 GAA
Reimer: 2 games, 0.864 Sv%, and 4.50 GAA

 

[TheDarkWingThatDucks]

We're certainly not seeing development. If it's happening, it's happening in the background and it's either not translating to games, or it's translating in ways that we as fans just can't see.

But again, I suspect that a large part of why Verbeek hired Cronin was for the background stuff that we'll never see - the off-ice practice habits and whatnot. Eventually, those need to translate into on-ice results, but I suspect (hope?) that Verbeek has someone else in mind for that phase of the rebuild.

This is what I try to say. Unless you think Verbeek is the dumbest gm ever, he is doing his plan. Is it working as fast as he hoped…. Hopefully not. But Greg Cronin’s max shelf life is starting next season….. if we start off like we did this year, fire his ass and bring someone else in. If a Montgomery (who wants to sign here !!!!!!!!) is willing to come in the offseason, yes make the change. If Cronin wasn’t doing the behind the scenes things, I’d hippie Verbeek would have canned him a while ago. So my naivety, hoping my gm isn’t awful, makes me think things are okay long term……. In terms of development, if you plant a seed and it doesn’t sprout the next day, was water the wrong choice ?

 

[12ozPapa]

Well... Cronin didn't coach for the last 20 games of last season. It didn't hurt us much. Helps LaCombe develop b/c Cronin wasn't going ape shit on him (LaCombe needed therapy for that). What is an additional 20 more games on top of that?

With that said, Cronin probably conferred with Verbeek about not coaching for the last 20 games last season and Verbeek was onboard. Cronin is safe for the season b/c he is Verbeek's avatar. Otherwise, we could have went after Montgomery or McLellan already.

Source?

 

[Johnnyduck]

Jay Woodcroft?

 

[CrazyDuck4u]

Source?

I actually think this dude is on to something.

 

[TheDarkWingThatDucks]

Source?

Zero source, Cronin said Lacombe took boxing classes cause he didn’t comfortably feel like he could initiate contact. But if you have something to say you can pretend it’s whatever you want it to mean. Similar to the fact Cronin had a better lineup last year and injuries had nothing to do with the 1 pt better performance.

 

[AngelDuck]

Firing the assistant coach to solve the power play didn’t work.

At some point you have to look at the head coach and wonder if he’s the problem with special teams as well. He’s ultimately responsible for the overall gameplan in all areas.

I think GC needs to be fired but think a lot of people are going to be disappointed when he’s still the coach in October. I hope I’m wrong but I don’t get the vibe at all that Verbeek isn’t happy about how things are going

 

[Mr Rogers]

It’s tough to tell ultimately from the outside even on player development. It could be that certain players didn’t meet or barely met offseason training goals and it has resulted in kind of uninspiring production. Obviously Pat would know about that but we’d have no idea. Just a theory of course but if that’s the case, it obviously doesn’t make Cronin look nearly as bad. And then there have been players who have even looked good like Lacombe (who we know did a lot of work) and Gauthier (didn’t he even train with Kesler or something?).

Just saying it’s entirely possible Pat doesn’t have the same gripes about Cronin as we do, or perhaps he even sees him in a positive light regarding player development.

 

[AngelDuck]

It’s tough to tell ultimately from the outside even on player development. It could be that certain players didn’t meet or barely met offseason training goals and it has resulted in kind of uninspiring production. Obviously Pat would know about that but we’d have no idea. Just a theory of course but if that’s the case, it obviously doesn’t make Cronin look nearly as bad. And then there have been players who have even looked good like Lacombe (who we know did a lot of work) and Gauthier (didn’t he even train with Kesler or something?).

Just saying it’s entirely possible Pat doesn’t have the same gripes about Cronin as we do, or perhaps he even sees him in a positive light regarding player development.

This is well put. I personally think the odds are 60/40 that he’s still the coach next season. For him to not return it’s going to take:

1) A miserable ending to the season. Finishing bottom 3 again

2) A couple more player complaints from veterans about the coaching methods. Lybuschkin style comments

3) continued horrendous special teams play. Kind of fits in with point 1

All are possible so we’ll see

 

[Mr Rogers]

This is well put. I personally think the odds are 60/40 that he’s still the coach next season. For him to not return it’s going to take:

1) A miserable ending to the season. Finishing bottom 3 again

2) A couple more player complaints from veterans about the coaching methods. Lybuschkin style comments

3) continued horrendous special teams play. Kind of fits in with point 1

All are possible so we’ll see

I agree. I also get the vibe that Pat is not unhappy with Cro just based on limited comments he’s made this year. Just a feel obviously but think he’s putting more of it on the players - but maybe he’s pretty satisfied with them too. The record isn’t really even that bad for this roster so that helps Cro too (inflated by goalies tho)

 

[ZegrassyKnoll]

I agree. I also get the vibe that Pat is not unhappy with Cro just based on limited comments he’s made this year. Just a feel obviously but think he’s putting more of it on the players - but maybe he’s pretty satisfied with them too. The record isn’t really even that bad for this roster so that helps Cro too (inflated by goalies tho)

The flip side of this is that we will almost never know a GM is unhappy with their coach until they’re fired.

You RARELY see a GM make any kind of public criticism of their coach.

 

[Mr Rogers]

The flip side of this is that we will almost never know a GM is unhappy with their coach until they’re fired.

You RARELY see a GM make any kind of public criticism of their coach.

Well sure. But after one of the trades, he praised him - or the coaching in general - somewhat I feel like. He could’ve said nothing but he chose not to do that.

We’ve been a pretty disappointing team this year I’d say( the offense and Pp especially). I think Pat could’ve cut ties a month or two ago or even in the offseason and it would’ve been justified - at least from an outsider’s POV - , but he hasn’t. I just think he’s more satisfied than we are and potentially by a lot.