Tribute Sheldon Keefe Discussion Part 2
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Sheldon Keefe joined Tim and Sid to discuss the signing of Martin Marincin and the Toronto Maple Leafs' style of play, especially with playoffs in mind.
Rogue Leader
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ShaneFalco
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But but you can never succeed with a rookie coach
"We have the ability to score goals at a high rate which is the goal of the game ultimately"
I love it!
Keefe is learning that giving offensive freedom to a young team is going to have its issues .. hence 20 goals against in 3 games .. leafs are tuning into a junior hockey team the way they play .. also has anyone noticed that they are slowly starting to play like they did under Babcock with these stretch passes and flip out breakouts ? Hard to watch
Keefe has helped unleash the offensive potential of the team, which has been great to see, fun to watch, and is finally showcasing the immense talent of some of our stars. But this rope-a-dope style hockey is going to catch up to them if they don't batten down the hatches defensively. Nice when they score 4 goals...sucks when the opposition comes right back with 6. A team like Tampa would feast on them.
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killer1980
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Dubas' inexperience and naivety is catching up with him. Anybody can see the obvious talent on this team. The challenge for the GM is creating a cohesive unit that is capable of pulling together to achieve the ultimate goal. There is no doubt this is now a more exciting group of players that is fun to watch. Time will tell if Dubas has put together a group of guys that is capable of going anywhere when it counts. I believe that I'll enjoy the regular season but do not expect too much come playoff time with this bunch.
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Pookie
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So... then you are saying talent matters.
And health matters as Hutchinson wouldn’t have been in if it were not for the injury to Andersen.
Looks like you are conceding the fact that talent, talent performing and health have more of an impact on results than coaching....
Otherwise, Keefe absolutely has to wear the 4-5-2 record.
Winning = Coach
Losing = Players
That’s just not an equation that makes sense.
Nithoniniel
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Long-term significant changes across pretty much every metric except goaltending since a coaching change = probably due to the coaching change
This leading directly to a vast increase in point percentage = probably due to the coaching change
Part of that a stretch of lesser results directly linked to abysmal goaltending performance = probably on the goaltenders
You are reaching so hard for a contrarian position here that it's quite honestly insulting to yourself.
Pookie
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Hmmmm “long term.”
As in the first 20 games but not the last 11 games?
Care to guess what the goaltending percentages were over the first 20? Probably a little helpful towards winning there.
Nithoniniel
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No, as in across the full sample, including this bad stretch. Including the one we have before.
The goaltending percentages were bad in the first 20 too. We have won despite our goaltending.
Pookie
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Actually they weren’t bad. 6th overall in the NHL over that stretch.
Wanted to also address your “contrarian” assertion on my position that Talent, Talent Performing and Health have more influence on results than Coaching.
See when the team is winning and firing on all cylinders... I point to a healthy, talented roster and above average performances. Give the boys the old credit and not some magical tactic.
When the team is losing and players are slumping, I point to key injuries to Rielly, Muzzin, Andersen and whatever alarm clock issue Kapanen is going through. A less talented roster takes their place. And some players have some really bad games.
That’s not a contrarian argument. That’s called being consistent.
Saying the coach is responsible for wins and players are responsible for losses is called a Convenient argument.
It’s also called bunk.
Nithoniniel
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It's a good thing that you are fighting imaginary arguments then, as nobody is saying that.
You live in a little bubble of your own on these boards, Pookie. The arguments others make enter it distorted, and your own echoes back to you and sound good only in your own ears.
Macallan18
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lol I see all these replies and wonder who on earth you are sending all these replies to, and then realize I have him on ignore!!
Gary Nylund
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I knew it instantly - I've seen this movie before. Many times unfortunately.
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It’s actually a very interesting exercise in cognitive dissonance.... seeking alternative explanations to things that don’t fit one’s view to minimize the discomfort caused by holding inconsistent views.
Eg.
First 20. Good record. The coach makes the difference. See the record?
Next 11. Bad record. Coach makes the difference though right? Hmmm. Inconsistent. How about .... it’s the players’ fault?
Ahhhh. Feel better.
Or a further example.
One thinks himself a great debater. One was just shown an inconsistent argument. Hmmmm. How about..... discount the messenger?
Sounds good. Will be reinforced with some likes.
——
Clear as day. You go and do the dissonance thing.
I’ll continue not blaming Keefe for this slump and chalk it up to health and talent.
And when we win again, I will chalk that up to health and talent returning.
Easy peasy.
Polaris1010
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Dallas Ekins returns to Toronto, interesting to see.
Not sure if I like this new Leafs coach Keefe now.
Ducks goes down two men short handed a 1:42 short handed situation 5 on 3 power play for the Leafs half way thru the 1st period.
The Leafs get 1 shot on goal.
What?! Where is the sense of urgency?
Under Babcock, the team did not start on time half the time, in other words no sense of urgency. At least they were a better team under him. Coach Keefe got to be harder on these guys. After two losses, a 5 on 3 in the first period, there has to be more than 1 shot on goal!
Barrie got the shot on goal from the blueline, and he missed the net on the other shot attempt. On a 5 on 3. This sucks!
Maybe I go back to not watching the games again . . .
LOL.
Not sure if I like this new Leafs coach Keefe now.
Ducks goes down two men short handed a 1:42 short handed situation 5 on 3 power play for the Leafs half way thru the 1st period.
The Leafs get 1 shot on goal.
What?! Where is the sense of urgency?
Under Babcock, the team did not start on time half the time, in other words no sense of urgency. At least they were a better team under him. Coach Keefe got to be harder on these guys. After two losses, a 5 on 3 in the first period, there has to be more than 1 shot on goal!
Barrie got the shot on goal from the blueline, and he missed the net on the other shot attempt. On a 5 on 3. This sucks!
Maybe I go back to not watching the games again . . .
LOL.
LeafsNation75
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I like him better than Babcock but question his defense combos .. especially Barrie and dermott and 3 on 3 player usage
Stephen
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I know the Internet loves Keefe for loading up the superfriends, playing stars big minutes and bravely coming up with unique and random line combinations, but kind of curious what he and Dave Hakstol are actually doing on a day to day basis to try and bring some defensive structure to the team. Or when the team is in complete disarray, what his thoughts are about taking the blender to lines? Or should he be trying to instill some stability? What about preparation? Why does the group continue to start with such low energy levels?
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He has done a remarkable job with this group. Question a few things but he has been really good. I want him as the coach for the future. I love he calls out guys in media no matter who it is.
Stephen
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He came in and said the team needs to let
The skilled players have freedom offensively .. that has now created a team that generates a lot of turnovers and people out of position , therefore leaving the goalie out to dry .. Anderson had 5 goals against after 17 shots after the second period and he didn’t stand a chance on any of the goals .. leafs are horrible positionally , feel sorry for the goalies in Toronto
The skilled players have freedom offensively .. that has now created a team that generates a lot of turnovers and people out of position , therefore leaving the goalie out to dry .. Anderson had 5 goals against after 17 shots after the second period and he didn’t stand a chance on any of the goals .. leafs are horrible positionally , feel sorry for the goalies in Toronto
BertCorbeau
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Keefe has played the team to it's strength offensively which has magnified their already existent defensive issues.
Now teams have adjusted to the Leafs and have been containing the offense a bit more frequently, and Keefe hasn't gotten the club to adjust quite to where they need to be.
Further to that I'm not a fan of his defensive swarm structure .. Looks reminiscent of Carlyle's Leafs out there at times. Difference being the current Leafs have a lot more talent up front to actually push the play back the other way. And I know what the advanced stats say about the Leafs defense but there's something else at play. Goaltending is an issue but there's something else.
Now teams have adjusted to the Leafs and have been containing the offense a bit more frequently, and Keefe hasn't gotten the club to adjust quite to where they need to be.
Further to that I'm not a fan of his defensive swarm structure .. Looks reminiscent of Carlyle's Leafs out there at times. Difference being the current Leafs have a lot more talent up front to actually push the play back the other way. And I know what the advanced stats say about the Leafs defense but there's something else at play. Goaltending is an issue but there's something else.
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