Speculation: Sharks Roster Discussion Part 2

[Juxtaposer]

I don't think we can get Landy or Duchene. I hope that DW pursues them (and assume that he's made inquiries since he's a notorious tire kicker) but, unless the reports of what Sakic wants are wrong or unless Sakic is replaced and the new GM still wants to trade Landeskog or Duchene but for different type players/assets, I think the Sharks are pretty far down on the list of likely destinations for either of them. Even without Marleau, can we afford Thornton and Shattenkirk? And if we let Marleau and Thornton walk, who realistically replaces them?

Meier replaces Marleau. Thornton isn't replaceable but as much as I love Marleau he is.

Assuming a flat-cap for 2017-2018: Re-sign Joe to his $6Mx3, Donskoi at $2.5Mx2 (a lesser Hertl deal), trade Braun for JVR @50% (Leafs fans are cool with this), call-up Goldobin, sign Shattenkirk to a $7Mx7 deal, re-up Carpenter cheap, do whatever with Tierney


Van Riemsdyk, James - Thornton, Joe - Pavelski, Joe
$2,125,000..................$6,000,000......$6,000,000

Donskoi, Joonas - Couture, Logan - Meier, Timo
$2,500,000..........$6,000,000........$894,167

Goldobin, Nikolay - Hertl, Tomas - Labanc, Kevin
$863,333..............$3,000,000.....$717,500

Boedker, Mikkel - Carpenter, Ryan - Ward, Joel
$4,000,000.........$1,000,000..........$3,275,000

Karlsson, Melker
$1,000,000


Vlasic, Marc-Edouard- Shattenkirk, Kevin
$4,250,000................$7,000,000

Martin, Paul - Burns, Brent
$4,850,000....$8,000,000

Schlemko, David - Dillon, Brenden
$2,100,000...........$3,270,000

DeMelo, Dylan
$650,000

Jones, Martin
$3,000,000

Dell, Aaron
$625,000



Puts us at $1.8M in cap space with a full 22 man roster. It's workable. But I haven't even taken into consideration that one of Dillon, Martin, Schlemko, Ward, or Boedker could be taken by LV. So we could have room for Marleau after all.

 

[Lebanezer]

Meier replaces Marleau. Thornton isn't replaceable but as much as I love Marleau he is.

Assuming a flat-cap for 2017-2018: Re-sign Joe to his $6Mx3, Donskoi at $2.5Mx2 (a lesser Hertl deal), trade Braun for JVR @50% (Leafs fans are cool with this), call-up Goldobin, sign Shattenkirk to a $7Mx7 deal, re-up Carpenter cheap, do whatever with Tierney


Van Riemsdyk, James - Thornton, Joe - Pavelski, Joe
$2,125,000..................$6,000,000......$6,000,000

Donskoi, Joonas - Couture, Logan - Meier, Timo
$2,500,000..........$6,000,000........$894,167

Goldobin, Nikolay - Hertl, Tomas - Labanc, Kevin
$863,333..............$3,000,000.....$717,500

Boedker, Mikkel - Carpenter, Ryan - Ward, Joel
$4,000,000.........$1,000,000..........$3,275,000

Karlsson, Melker
$1,000,000


Vlasic, Marc-Edouard- Shattenkirk, Kevin
$4,250,000................$7,000,000

Martin, Paul - Burns, Brent
$4,850,000....$8,000,000

Schlemko, David - Dillon, Brenden
$2,100,000...........$3,270,000

DeMelo, Dylan
$650,000

Jones, Martin
$3,000,000

Dell, Aaron
$625,000



Puts us at $1.8M in cap space with a full 22 man roster. It's workable. But I haven't even taken into consideration that one of Dillon, Martin, Schlemko, Ward, or Boedker could be taken by LV. So we could have room for Marleau after all.

I'm on board. We could keep Marleau, and we could insert Heed into the lineup if Dillon, Martin or Schlemko are the ones taken by LV. Or if LV takes Boedker then great.

 

[CrypTic]

I'm on board. We could keep Marleau, and we could insert Heed into the lineup if Dillon, Martin or Schlemko are the ones taken by LV. Or if LV takes Boedker then great.

Looks good to me too. If we can get Shatty and trade Braun for JVR, we'd be in good shape. I'd like to see Goldobin and Carpenter play anyway so those are plusses for me. Heed or Ryan work for the defense (depending on side). I'd like to see them in the NHL so that's a plus too.

 

[AgentCooper]

The beauty of 3 ELCs in the top 9. We can afford an $8 million fourth line.

 

[Juxtaposer]

The beauty of 3 ELCs in the top 9. We can afford an $8 million fourth line.

But also, I'm 100% certain we could move Ward if we really needed too. He only has one year left on his contract.

If there were any way whatsoever to get rid of Boedker, I'd be all over it.

 

[Gilligans Island]

The beauty of 3 ELCs in the top 9. We can afford an $8 million fourth line.

It's the Hawks model without Bowman f-ing up on re-signing his RFAs...

 

[Celly4Celebrini]

The more I think about it, the more I feel trading Braun could be very beneficial in the sense that we'd acquire a top line player, and he'd be "replaceable"

I'd offer Braun + for Duchene before just Braun for JVR though

 

[Gilligans Island]

But also, I'm 100% certain we could move Ward if we really needed too. He only has one year left on his contract.

If there were any way whatsoever to get rid of Boedker, I'd be all over it.

Jux, that's a beautiful lineup - especially the D.

What are we giving up for Shatty?

 

[CrypTic]

The more I think about it, the more I feel trading Braun could be very beneficial in the sense that we'd acquire a top line player, and he'd be "replaceable"

I'd offer Braun + for Duchene before just Braun for JVR though

Me too. If Sakic is interested in Braun for Duchene, I hope DW is all over that. I wouldn't have done that a year or two ago but we have quite a few potential replacements now. They may not end up as good with Vlasic as Braun but the upgrade to Duchene would be worth it IMO.

 

[Juxtaposer]

The more I think about it, the more I feel trading Braun could be very beneficial in the sense that we'd acquire a top line player, and he'd be "replaceable"

I'd offer Braun + for Duchene before just Braun for JVR though

Well duh, but why would Colorado want Braun? Prime-aged RHD are literally their only strength.

I'm getting the feeling that Braun could moved. Not that he's on the block or anything, but that he is available.

Jux, that's a beautiful lineup - especially the D.

What are we giving up for Shatty?

Blues fans on the Trade Forums were amenable to O'Regan and a 1st if no one offered a better prospect.

 

[Gilligans Island]

Blues fans on the Trade Forums were amenable to O'Regan and a 1st if no one offered a better prospect.

Good deal - though I'd make the 1st conditional. We could add another decent prospect to balance it out.

Regan + good prospect + conditional 1st (only if Shatty re-signs)

 

[Juxtaposer]

Good deal - though I'd make the 1st conditional. We could add another decent prospect to balance it out.

Regan + good prospect + conditional 1st (only if Shatty re-signs)

Without the non-conditional 1st, that deal doesn't happen.

 

[Gilligans Island]

Without the non-conditional 1st, that deal doesn't happen.

Maybe they add a conditional 2nd if Shatty walks. Tough call. It's like the Soupy deal all over.

 

[hockeyball]

Maybe they add a conditional 2nd if Shatty walks. Tough call. It's like the Soupy deal all over.

Except this time we get a cup...

 

[Juxtaposer]

Except this time we get a cup...

That's the idea.


Honestly, I think our team is good as it is but going into the playoffs without adding a legit scorer would be a huge mistake.

 

[WTFetus]

Maybe they add a conditional 2nd if Shatty walks. Tough call. It's like the Soupy deal all over.

Agree with Jux that the conditional would probably be a no deal. If anything, they might consider a conditional 1st if the Sharks make the SCF (and like a 2nd if they don't). Condition based on re-signing is probably worthless since they have to have a feeling that he's going to shop around during FA.

 

[Gilligans Island]

Agree with Jux that the conditional would probably be a no deal. If anything, they might consider a conditional 1st if the Sharks make the SCF (and like a 2nd if they don't). Condition based on re-signing is probably worthless since they have to have a feeling that he's going to shop around during FA.

Yeah- maybe it's a 1st / 2nd but trouble is we don't have a 2nd.

Agree with Jux that higher priority is a scoring fwd. Shatty (in lieu of Braun) is a luxury.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

I don't think he'd necessarily be that expensive to acquire, though a relative lack of sellers (if many teams stay in the race) may raise it. Ppl on the trade boards seem to think a first plus mid level prospect (though it's just a guess but it's based on prior rentals). But I don't see how we keep Shattenkirk (~7M AAV?) and I don't want to spend a lot for a rental. I'm fine with our first and 4th liners like Wingels. I'd also consider third liners excluding Hertl and Donskoi for someone who really put us over the top.

Shattenkirk is going to cost the team someone like Goldobin or Roy and a 1st. This is going to be the most sought after defenseman on the trade market at the deadline and it's not really close. To add to that, we already have six solid defensemen on the roster so it seems rather pointless to render someone like Schlemko or Dillon or Martin essentially useless. And I really doubt that the Sharks are going to be willing to move any of the six we play because that's pretty much the basis of this team's success this season. Add that to the unlikelihood of spending the 7.5 million per season for the next seven or eight years to keep him and it's just not a wise choice to make.

 

[Juxtaposer]

Yeah- maybe it's a 1st / 2nd but trouble is we don't have a 2nd.

Agree with Jux that higher priority is a scoring fwd. Shatty (in lieu of Braun) is a luxury.

I think a forward is more important, but Shattenkirk would add a lot of offense in lieu of Braun.

 

[Gilligans Island]

Shattenkirk is going to cost the team someone like Goldobin or Roy and a 1st. This is going to be the most sought after defenseman on the trade market at the deadline and it's not really close. To add to that, we already have six solid defensemen on the roster so it seems rather pointless to render someone like Schlemko or Dillon or Martin essentially useless. And I really doubt that the Sharks are going to be willing to move any of the six we play because that's pretty much the basis of this team's success this season. Add that to the unlikelihood of spending the 7.5 million per season for the next seven or eight years to keep him and it's just not a wise choice to make.

It's totally beyond a long shot but Sharks only would land Shatty if they are willing to deal Braun for someone like JvR. Both of these types of deals (Shatty + top 6 scoring fwd) have to go together.

The simpler route is to just get some depth scoring like Vrbata or someone akin.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

It's totally beyond a long shot but Sharks only would land Shatty if they are willing to deal Braun for someone like JvR. Both of these types of deals (Shatty + top 6 scoring fwd) have to go together.

The simpler route is to just get some depth scoring like Vrbata or someone akin.

Which I think makes no sense unless Hertl is out longer than anticipated in terms of trading Braun for JVR to open up for a Shattenkirk rental. Vrbata makes a lot of sense simply because his contract doesn't prevent them from making other moves if they think it makes sense.

 

[CrypTic]

Shattenkirk is going to cost the team someone like Goldobin or Roy and a 1st. This is going to be the most sought after defenseman on the trade market at the deadline and it's not really close. To add to that, we already have six solid defensemen on the roster so it seems rather pointless to render someone like Schlemko or Dillon or Martin essentially useless. And I really doubt that the Sharks are going to be willing to move any of the six we play because that's pretty much the basis of this team's success this season. Add that to the unlikelihood of spending the 7.5 million per season for the next seven or eight years to keep him and it's just not a wise choice to make.

I wouldn't want to spend a first and Goldobin for a rental. (I'm unsure about Roy's status bc of the injury.) I'd be ok with spending 7M or so to keep him but I think he'd likely walk if he could get a similar deal with the Rangers or other NE USA team. I don't think we'd be able to re-sign him so I don't want to pay a lot.

[Re: Dealing Braun for JVR or similar then acquiring Shattenkirk] Which I think makes no sense unless Hertl is out longer than anticipated in terms of trading Braun for JVR to open up for a Shattenkirk rental. Vrbata makes a lot of sense simply because his contract doesn't prevent them from making other moves if they think it makes sense.

IMO it makes sense if you can re-sign Shatty. So it's a risk, regardless of how you structure the trade. If you get Shatty first and try to work out a deal with him, what happens if you can't? You're in the scenario you describe above for the rest of the season until Shatty leaves. If you get someone like JVR first, you're hoping that the Blues will trade Shatty (knowing that you need him so what happens to the price?) and that he'll re-sign. IMO it really only makes sense if you'd be ok trading Braun for JVR (or similar) regardless of whether you can trade for Shatty.

A rental forward is easier and safer. Less fun to think about though.

 

[Juxtaposer]

It's totally beyond a long shot but Sharks only would land Shatty if they are willing to deal Braun for someone like JvR. Both of these types of deals (Shatty + top 6 scoring fwd) have to go together.

The simpler route is to just get some depth scoring like Vrbata or someone akin.

Not Vrbata (he can't seem to do anything outside of Arizona), but someone like Parenteau would be fine by me.

IMO it makes sense if you can re-sign Shatty. So it's a risk, regardless of how you structure the trade. If you get Shatty first and try to work out a deal with him, what happens if you can't? You're in the scenario you describe above for the rest of the season until Shatty leaves. If you get someone like JVR first, you're hoping that the Blues will trade Shatty (knowing that you need him so what happens to the price?) and that he'll re-sign. IMO it really only makes sense if you'd be ok trading Braun for JVR (or similar) regardless of whether you can trade for Shatty.

A rental forward is easier and safer. Less fun to think about though.

If the Sharks truly want to get Shatty, I truly think it will happen. We have the pieces, we can make the cap room, and Shattenkirk supposedly would be willing to sign here.

I just don't know if he's high on DW's priority list since our D is already so good.

Slightly off-topic, but is there some DW-Shattenkirk connection I'm not remembering? Like a rumor we were interested in him or something? For some reason I feel like there's some connection but I can't think of what it is. Maybe it's just that he's an American defenseman from the Northeast.

 

[Gilligans Island]

Not Vrbata (he can't seem to do anything outside of Arizona), but someone like Parenteau would be fine by me.

Or Stempniak, too. I'd be fine with him as well as Paranteau

 

[Juxtaposer]

Or Stempniak, too. I'd be fine with him as well as Paranteau

Agreed, I love Stempniak.