Confirmed with Link: Sharks claim Goodrow from NYR

STL Shark

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Mar 6, 2013
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The only reason they'd have a handshake agreement to claim him prior to the process playing out is if both teams knew and worked together on it. Goodrow would have every right to be upset at the Sharks for their part in it regardless of whether it can be proven through some sort of arbitration or grievance process. Both teams knew Goodrow had the Sharks on the list and went around it. Yes, through legal means but that technicality isn't going to assuage a player's anger over it and isn't going to change how he'll decide to be on a team that pulled this over on him.
Again, the Sharks did quite literally nothing wrong. Their job is to make their team better and any player with a brain that knows this business understands that.

The whole "Goodrow is mad" deal has spun into something that it isn't. His anger is less that he's in SJ or the circumventing of his no trade list as much as it is that he's upset with NYR for not allowing him and his agent to shop some deals for a few days with teams that he'd rather be on and not informing him until day of that he'd be placed on waivers. It's the relative blind siding of the situation that upset him rather than being pissed off about some conspiracy between NYR and SJ. That is literally the entirety of the issue and none of that has anything to do with the Sharks.
 

STL Shark

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Mar 6, 2013
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I'm not convinced that Goodrow is better than any of those (save Smith).
I think anyone getting into that discussion is missing the entirety of the point in that it's not just about on-ice ability/potential right now at this stage of the rebuild. It's about getting pros in here that can teach and mentor. Guys that command respect for being on winners and knowing how winning teams operate and passing those traits along. Guys that aren't going to allow this team to quit and give up double digit goals repeatedly and lose by 5+ once a week.

We're not trying to be a playoff team this year or probably even next year. We're trying to get Celebrini, Smith, Eklund, and others to develop to their full potential to successfully lead this team from 2027 to 2037. You don't do that by letting the blind lead the blind. You do that by insulating them with good pros that teach good habits.

Last thing I want is to be in Buffalo's position where a guy like Byram comes over and is appalled at how poorly they practice and how poorly guys are coached. Having a veteran like Goodrow that knows what winning is supposed to look like is a good thing right now with our young group of players in addition to our 36 year old head coach.
 
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Alaskanice

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Sep 23, 2009
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It's sad that this was clear from the beginning yet people really wanted to shit on Grier instead. Sometimes that stretches people make really make me question why they are making the stretch with Grier specifically....
It’s the world today. Way back when, it was that guy at the end of the bar, spouting off and cursing everyone.
 

Pinkfloyd

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Oct 29, 2006
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Again, the Sharks did quite literally nothing wrong. Their job is to make their team better and any player with a brain that knows this business understands that.

The whole "Goodrow is mad" deal has spun into something that it isn't. His anger is less that he's in SJ or the circumventing of his no trade list as much as it is that he's upset with NYR for not allowing him and his agent to shop some deals for a few days with teams that he'd rather be on and not informing him until day of that he'd be placed on waivers. It's the relative blind siding of the situation that upset him rather than being pissed off about some conspiracy between NYR and SJ. That is literally the entirety of the issue and none of that has anything to do with the Sharks.
If all there is to this handshake agreement between the two teams is the Sharks claiming Goodrow then no they didn't do anything wrong. If there ends up being more to it than that which is typical of these sorts of arrangements then there is blame to be given to Grier for likely knowing about the Sharks being on his no-trade list and making deals to get around it. Yes, Grier's job is to make the team better. Acquiring Goodrow at his cap hit on his own doesn't do that. I agree that Goodrow is going to be more mad at the Rangers for blindsiding him but to pretend like he can't be mad at the Sharks for assisting them in getting around it just seems like it's putting blinders on.

It's okay to criticize our own team for things.
 

coooldude

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If all there is to this handshake agreement between the two teams is the Sharks claiming Goodrow then no they didn't do anything wrong. If there ends up being more to it than that which is typical of these sorts of arrangements then there is blame to be given to Grier for likely knowing about the Sharks being on his no-trade list and making deals to get around it. Yes, Grier's job is to make the team better. Acquiring Goodrow at his cap hit on his own doesn't do that. I agree that Goodrow is going to be more mad at the Rangers for blindsiding him but to pretend like he can't be mad at the Sharks for assisting them in getting around it just seems like it's putting blinders on.

It's okay to criticize our own team for things.
The way these bold sections are worded leaves no room for other interpretations, but none of these are facts yet they are stated as facts or extremely obvious.

I don't think it's typical to see this sort of arrangement and I don't think we know the nature of the arrangement.

I don't think it is fact that this move makes the team worse (my opinion is it is slightly negative but other reasonable people disagree).

And I don't think it's reasonable to assume that Goodrow is mad at the Sharks for making a waiver claim which inadvertently protects him from a buyout which might have cost him millions. He might be mad at going to a non playoff team - that's a different and more reasonable assumption to make than assuming it is obvious he's mad at the Sharks Organization.
 

gaucholoco3

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Jun 22, 2015
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still not a fan of this
Would you be a fan if he cap hit was 1.6 instead of 3.6?

If the question is still no I think you are understating Goodrow’s ability as a 4th line FW that can play C or W.

If you say yes then you are not understanding that the Sharks will not spend to the cap for at minimum 2 years and likely all 3 years of Goodrow’s deal. So his cap hit could be even $5 million and it would be the same as his $3.6 million cap hit.
 

Pinkfloyd

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Oct 29, 2006
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The way these bold sections are worded leaves no room for other interpretations, but none of these are facts yet they are stated as facts or extremely obvious.

I don't think it's typical to see this sort of arrangement and I don't think we know the nature of the arrangement.

I don't think it is fact that this move makes the team worse (my opinion is it is slightly negative but other reasonable people disagree).

And I don't think it's reasonable to assume that Goodrow is mad at the Sharks for making a waiver claim which inadvertently protects him from a buyout which might have cost him millions. He might be mad at going to a non playoff team - that's a different and more reasonable assumption to make than assuming it is obvious he's mad at the Sharks Organization.
You shouldn't just bold them and cut them out then because that's going to take it out of context then. Literally, the first line of the post you're quoting is leaving open the possibility of it just being a stupid waiver claim by Grier.

Waivers has been a fairly routine threat for players that teams want to get rid of for the sake of flexibility. One recent example of this was Ryan McDonagh. For our team, it was Dan Boyle when he was in Tampa. It shouldn't just be ignored that this handshake agreement was reported on before the claim even transpired.

I don't think it's fact that it makes the team worse either. I think it's a pretty obvious subjective opinion based on reasoning. Better is subjective. The only thing objective about it is that Goodrow has a high cap hit, low production rate for his role, and tends to be on the losing end of play at evens...where most of a player's impact is going to be. It's still hockey and anything can happen but the odds don't exactly look great for someone who looks to be in decline as a bottom six forward that was getting cut.

I'm not assuming that Goodrow is mad at the Sharks. The bolded is exactly what I meant to say. It's silly to pretend like he can't be mad at the team for helping the Rangers get around it. He can if he wants and would likely have reason. He doesn't have to be and he might not be but why are we continuing to pretend like a guy who had us on his no-trade list couldn't be upset at the team for acquiring him when they knew he didn't want to be there because of his no-trade list. Like, even if the Sharks were completely innocent in all of this, he can still be mad at us for claiming him. Now, he may not have any real recourse to that and we can think he's still worth having in the short term (even though he probably isn't), but he can still be mad at us for making him play where he didn't want to play and potentially not giving him any options elsewhere.

There's still more to this for us to unpack and none of what's been talked about is some hard and fast steadfast belief. They are scenario-based beliefs and opinions based off incomplete information with the intent of refining such beliefs and opinions when new information pops up.

But if all there is to this transaction is claiming a waived Goodrow, I have no beef with the Sharks' part in that whether Goodrow is mad or not. I would only be upset with Grier for thinking Goodrow is worth his contract to our team.
 

Cas

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I think anyone getting into that discussion is missing the entirety of the point in that it's not just about on-ice ability/potential right now at this stage of the rebuild. It's about getting pros in here that can teach and mentor. Guys that command respect for being on winners and knowing how winning teams operate and passing those traits along. Guys that aren't going to allow this team to quit and give up double digit goals repeatedly and lose by 5+ once a week.

We're not trying to be a playoff team this year or probably even next year. We're trying to get Celebrini, Smith, Eklund, and others to develop to their full potential to successfully lead this team from 2027 to 2037. You don't do that by letting the blind lead the blind. You do that by insulating them with good pros that teach good habits.

Last thing I want is to be in Buffalo's position where a guy like Byram comes over and is appalled at how poorly they practice and how poorly guys are coached. Having a veteran like Goodrow that knows what winning is supposed to look like is a good thing right now with our young group of players in addition to our 36 year old head coach.
Quite honestly, I largely don't buy this argument. I think it's a common argument, but one that falls into stereotype and tautology a whole lot. Guys like Goodrow keep jobs long after their expiration date because they're "pros," even if they're just outright bad players. Why are they "pros?" Because they keep getting jobs, and because they're tough guys who hit people.

Because they're "pros," they teach kids good habits. Why? Because that's the explanation necessary to justify their continued employment. Of course, why can't we simply employ coaches who can do that? Are the young players not professional enough to listen to coaches? Do they not know "what winning looks like?"

I just don't buy it. I'm not convinced picking up Goodrow is an actually bad move - but it'll have to be determined whether Warsofsky actually benches Goodrow when (almost certainly not "if") he underperforms an NHL standard of play, and holds him to account for being bad. Goodrow is just not much of an NHL player anymore - maybe we can make him work, and yes, we're going to suck. I would prefer that we're making an honest effort to not suck as much as possible, though.
 

one2gamble

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Dec 24, 2007
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Quite honestly, I largely don't buy this argument. I think it's a common argument, but one that falls into stereotype and tautology a whole lot. Guys like Goodrow keep jobs long after their expiration date because they're "pros," even if they're just outright bad players. Why are they "pros?" Because they keep getting jobs, and because they're tough guys who hit people.

Because they're "pros," they teach kids good habits. Why? Because that's the explanation necessary to justify their continued employment. Of course, why can't we simply employ coaches who can do that? Are the young players not professional enough to listen to coaches? Do they not know "what winning looks like?"

I just don't buy it. I'm not convinced picking up Goodrow is an actually bad move - but it'll have to be determined whether Warsofsky actually benches Goodrow when (almost certainly not "if") he underperforms an NHL standard of play, and holds him to account for being bad. Goodrow is just not much of an NHL player anymore - maybe we can make him work, and yes, we're going to suck. I would prefer that we're making an honest effort to not suck as much as possible, though.
I 100% dont buy the "leadership" qualities of players like Goodrow being worth keeping around past their use by date.

I 100% believe that the "leadership" qualities of players like Pavs are worth keeping around a bit past their use by date.

I 100% believe that neither are useful if you dont have the right staff to surround your young players wtih.

I 100% believe the staff is more important than either of those players.

I 100% believe that having good players surround your young players in addition to the staff is the best.
 

themelkman

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I 100% dont buy the "leadership" qualities of players like Goodrow being worth keeping around past their use by date.

I 100% believe that the "leadership" qualities of players like Pavs are worth keeping around a bit past their use by date.

I 100% believe that neither are useful if you dont have the right staff to surround your young players wtih.

I 100% believe the staff is more important than either of those players.

I 100% believe that having good players surround your young players in addition to the staff is the best.
Exactly, the best leaders can lead by example on the ice. I’m not worried about Celebrini learning how to work out in the gym because he’s been doing it for 15 years and we have professionals hired to teach that. What he needs is guys who can nurture their skills on the ice and show them the tricks of being a great player.

We hear this kind of justification all the time for keeping liabilities around to mentor young players, and often without any real results.
 
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Alaskanice

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Exactly, the best leaders can lead by example on the ice. I’m not worried about Celebrini learning how to work out in the gym because he’s been doing it for 15 years and we have professionals hired to teach that. What he needs is guys who can nurture their skills on the ice and show them the tricks of being a great player.

We hear this kind of justification all the time for keeping liabilities around to mentor young players, and often without any real results.
I believe the results are more real than you think.
 

one2gamble

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Dec 24, 2007
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Nah, the HFBoards posters know more about internal team dynamics than NHL management.
Youre telling me that the NHL old boys club doesnt get stuck in their ways?

A bit of an appeal to authority no.....


The reality is that players today are much more professional than they ever have been. They have likely been part of pro like programs since they entered their teen years. They are mostly regimented already. You dont need to teach them that part of the game.
 
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landshark

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As a Sharks fans I'm feeling weird about this whole thing. The Sharks are rebuilding, which is a nice way of saying "suck". Sharks are suck right now and will for the next year or so at the very least. Probably not as badly as last year...

Things are looking up, Celly pending and Smith signing. But, when I hear that Goody has the Sharks on his no trade list, I'm not exactly shocked, but when he winds up coming here anyway... do I now boo that man? He doesn't want to be here. I root for the sweater, not the player so much. So this is pretty weird.

I do get attached to players occasionally, but that always hurts when they get traded away or go sign somewhere else as a free agent. This is the weird ass bizzarro version of that somehow.

Goody comes back to help with the rebuild? Nope, Goody got shafted into going someplace he specifically listed as someplace he doesn't want to be. Boo f***ing hoo... just plug your ears with your cup rings, Mr. Millionaire.

I say Goody should GTFO then, let's terminate that contract! He can then get signed again as a free agent on whatever team he'd like to play for.
 
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gaucholoco3

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Jun 22, 2015
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Youre telling me that the NHL old boys club doesnt get stuck in their ways?

A bit of an appeal to authority no.....


The reality is that players today are much more professional than they ever have been. They have likely been part of pro like programs since they entered their teen years. They are mostly regimented already. You dont need to teach them that part of the game.
So they know how to navigate being a young millionaire and all the distractions that come with that before they are drafted?
 
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TheBigDrunkPanda

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Oct 19, 2021
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These takes are absolute nonsense. I can't believe i'm reading these galaxy brain opinions.

Goodrow is a professional athlete who has demonstrated over his entire life that he is a competitor and dissatisfied with status quo. He's been on a playoff team every year of his NHL career except the first year in SJ; he went undrafted and attended multiple camps before getting signed; he demonstrably elevates his game when it matters most.

And despite all of that, you think he's gonna sulk and abandon his entire mantra and personal ethos? Really? Do you also expect Couture to just roll over and quit? Burns to decide fitness doesnt matter? Mackinnon to start housing soda and cookies?

Actually I expect this from you. You hate grier and will absolutely avoid reality to put him down. Statements like this indicate you intentionally are putting your head in the sand.
I don’t hate Grier I just think he’s the absolute atrocious when it comes to making trades and free agent signings , I actually like his drafting which in this part of a rebuild is important. The problem with all of the Grier apologist on this board is that you refuse to see fault in any of his moves and will constantly make excuses for him, if you replaced Griers name with Wilson on any of these trades are signings you’d all be screaming bloody murder plain and simple the hypocrisy is off the charts with the Grier fan bass
 
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TheBigDrunkPanda

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Oct 19, 2021
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Why does Grier “need” to get value for the cap space.

Everyone needs to wake up.

THE FLAT CAP ERA IS DONE!

Getting first or second round picks to take on cap is just not an option anymore. PLD got moved with no retention and without the Kings having to pay to move him.
Your proof is one trade between 2 teams desperately trying to off load contracts? That’s piss poor at best. There are a lot of teams that are going to need to be cap compliant in a couple of months if the trend were to continue I’d say your opinion might have some merit but as it stands right now you’re desperately grabbing at straws trying to validate your point
 

Alaskanice

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Your proof is one trade between 2 teams desperately trying to off load contracts? That’s piss poor at best. There are a lot of teams that are going to need to be cap compliant in a couple of months if the trend were to continue I’d say your opinion might have some merit but as it stands right now you’re desperately grabbing at straws trying to validate your point
Enjoy your weekend.
 

ChompChomp

Can't wait for Sharks hockey to return someday
Jan 8, 2007
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do I now boo that man? He doesn't want to be here. I root for the sweater, not the player so much. So this is pretty weird.

We haven't even heard a direct quote from him. Before anyone decides that he should be booed by Sharks fans, wait until he actually comments.
 

TheBeard

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Jul 12, 2019
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I think anyone getting into that discussion is missing the entirety of the point in that it's not just about on-ice ability/potential right now at this stage of the rebuild. It's about getting pros in here that can teach and mentor. Guys that command respect for being on winners and knowing how winning teams operate and passing those traits along. Guys that aren't going to allow this team to quit and give up double digit goals repeatedly and lose by 5+ once a week.

We're not trying to be a playoff team this year or probably even next year. We're trying to get Celebrini, Smith, Eklund, and others to develop to their full potential to successfully lead this team from 2027 to 2037. You don't do that by letting the blind lead the blind. You do that by insulating them with good pros that teach good habits.

Last thing I want is to be in Buffalo's position where a guy like Byram comes over and is appalled at how poorly they practice and how poorly guys are coached. Having a veteran like Goodrow that knows what winning is supposed to look like is a good thing right now with our young group of players in addition to our 36 year old head coach.
Seriously.

Sharks fans: “we should continue t drafting top 5 for another couple years. It’s best for the team.”

Same Sharks fans: “Why the hell did we pick up Goodrow???? He doesn’t make us better!!”
I don’t hate Grier I just think he’s the absolute atrocious when it comes to making trades and free agent signings , I actually like his drafting which in this part of a rebuild is important. The problem with all of the Grier apologist on this board is that you refuse to see fault in any of his moves and will constantly make excuses for him, if you replaced Griers name with Wilson on any of these trades are signings you’d all be screaming bloody murder plain and simple the hypocrisy is off the charts with the Grier fan bass
i went on a week long rant about him after the Hertl trade and I’m one of his biggest apologists here.
 
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coooldude

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Nobody is saying Goody is going to turn this team around, and unless he has a rebound he's probably a negative player on our fourth line (honestly just like any of our fourth line is going to be, so I don't care much).

But it's wild to me that someone would think 18-20 year old kids can't learn something from guys who have won cups and navigated life as a pro in the top league in the world for 10 years. Especially when young players talk all the time about looking up to players like Sturm (or Goodrow) re: how to be a professional. The quotes from the young pros themselves are public for all to see - from Marleau living with Kelley Hrudey through last year's team and I'm sure there will be more.
 

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