Post-Game Talk: Sharks 3 - Jets 2 in OT

[gojetsgo]

 

[ecolad]

This is an issue, definitely. 0/2, and creating chances, okay. 0/3, starting to think it's time to mix things up. 0/4, wholesale changes. 0/5, anything goes.

It isn't like this is a new thing -- the PP has been static and inefficient for a long time now and running out largely the same personnel and strategies means it's dead easy to game-plan for.

Perfetti in the bumper?

KFC setting up in exactly the same place for the same pass 10x each PP?

Your second-best shooter in 55 stuck along the wall with no room to move into the middle and snipe one?

Back to JMo, over to KFC, into 55, and over and over again. It's a simple triangle against a 4-man (sometimes 3-man) D. Bless you, Pythagorus. There's movement, but no threat.

A solid PP likely adds 4-8 points this stretch. That's a crucial cushion.

And forget the EN glory. Seal the win. A smart, soft puck flip up the middle like we see 20x a game, and an important 2 points is in the bag.

Oh so true. Really hate the single triangle attack that they use to generate a scoring attempt. This is obviously some version of the 1:3:1 that they are trying to run, but they seem oblivious to the notion that such a formation creates 4 possible attacking triangles. Of course, players to the outside like Connor/Scheifele must be prepared to actually carry the puck towards the net and work with Neidereitter and/or Dubois to pressure the net, force movement and ultimate breakdown of the box. I think that both are capable of doing this but, given their aversion to physical play, are they willing?

 

[SensibleGuy]

they are 6-3-1 in their past 10, 0-3 against playoff teams and 6-0-1 against non playoff teams in this stretch, and they have 14 games remaining vs playoff teams

otoh, we have 18 games left. Probably need to go at least 11-7 (97pts) to get in. I'm not super confident myself...but hopefully right? 10-8 might get it done...with maximum clenchitude. lol

(Considering how things were looking about 6 weeks ago, I just can't really even believe we're having these discussions with 18 games left. It's remarkable...and a bummer)

 

[gojetsgo]

I got an idea to fix our pp, it may be too unconventional for our team though, we should try and put someone in front of the net to take the goalies vision away... I know I know it may be a crazy idea that's never been tried before but I really think it could work...

 

[GeorgeJETson]

Sounds like rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic...

 

[BoneDocUK]

Argh.

The old Stanley coming in for the Central Division "heavy game" ruse.

Or, we could play the best D pairings.

 

[WolfHouse]

Thats the only adjustment...?

 

[Huffer]

I got an idea to fix our pp, it may be too unconventional for our team though, we should try and put someone in front of the net to take the goalies vision away... I know I know it may be a crazy idea that's never been tried before but I really think it could work...

I'd take Avery standing in front and facing the goalie at this point.... (well, maybe not that far, but give me someone willing to stand in front of the goalie!)

 

[ecolad]

Looking for another shake up for the next game -

I agree - especially with the point on the players wanting to over pass - or go for that low percentage seam.
Bones has already mentioned that he wants the guys to move and he wants pucks on net - he's stated that a few times.
But we continue to do what we have been doing (or resort to doing) over the past few yrs.
This is not a coached PP - this is certain players doing it the way they want to do - as usual, it's the message and the players ability to translate that in the game.

Nothing to do with your post but we're starting to hear the same fan analysis on the PP that would have you think that Bones wants these guys to stand around.
The guys on the walls will never get opportunities if they don't don't start moving - they are getting pushed out to the perimeter by the defending box.
It's incredibly easy to defend when you can take both shooters out of their shooting positions by simply giving them less space. You'd think they'd move around the box rather than simply backing into the wall -

Scheif and KC are both setting up where they feel they have room to take a pass - and that spot is almost always out of a shooting position.
JoMo is sliding it over to both of them but in most cases, there is no play other than to send it back.
The guys on the perimeter need to move - and it's up to them to make that happen - there is no way the coach is pushing for this stagnant set up.
JoMo, Scheif and KC are all very capable of moving with the puck - and those are the 3 that needs to get things moving.

Good post. But the most troubling thought is that there is little to no actual coaching going on and the players just continue to do their own thing. There simply has to be more of a response than switching player positions, and then throwing out the ol` " more pucks to the net/ more guys to the net"fluff. What is needed is a clear revisit of what they are trying to accomplish and the specifics of how they will go about the challenge. This is absolutely a matter of strategies/tactics and Xand O`s as Bones likes to call them - and he should not be allowed to casually dismiss the coaching side of the issue as he did with the lack of scoring 5v5.

 

[KingBogo]

Looking for another shake up for the next game -

I agree - especially with the point on the players wanting to over pass - or go for that low percentage seam.
Bones has already mentioned that he wants the guys to move and he wants pucks on net - he's stated that a few times.
But we continue to do what we have been doing (or resort to doing) over the past few yrs.
This is not a coached PP - this is certain players doing it the way they want to do - as usual, it's the message and the players ability to translate that in the game.

Nothing to do with your post but we're starting to hear the same fan analysis on the PP that would have you think that Bones wants these guys to stand around.
The guys on the walls will never get opportunities if they don't don't start moving - they are getting pushed out to the perimeter by the defending box.
It's incredibly easy to defend when you can take both shooters out of their shooting positions by simply giving them less space. You'd think they'd move around the box rather than simply backing into the wall -

Scheif and KC are both setting up where they feel they have room to take a pass - and that spot is almost always out of a shooting position.
JoMo is sliding it over to both of them but in most cases, there is no play other than to send it back.
The guys on the perimeter need to move - and it's up to them to make that happen - there is no way the coach is pushing for this stagnant set up.
JoMo, Scheif and KC are all very capable of moving with the puck - and those are the 3 that needs to get things moving.

While agree with most of what you said, I wouldn't let the coaching staff off that easy. I think as currently designed our PP is easy to box out and make static. When our PP was at its very best in the early years of Laine. Wheeler was the QB from the right, but there was 3 options for him, Laine cross seem, Scheifele bumper and Buff with his heavy shot from the point. The way the PP is designed now is Morrissey QBs from the left point and we go around and around through him as our options are all around the outside. Morrissey, Scheifele and Connor being more active is only a partial solution as it is still easy enough for a good PK to box out since we don't have that heavy point shot as the 3rd option, and really Scheifele and Connor are playing the same role on opposite sides of the ice. I think Nino will help as a bumper, but with Morrissey being the distributor we rarely have that 3rd option we had with Buff.

 

[gojetsgo]

 

[surixon]

Good post. But the most troubling thought is that there is little to no actual coaching going on and the players just continue to do their own thing. There simply has to be more of a response than switching player positions, and then throwing out the ol` " more pucks to the net/ more guys to the net"fluff. What is needed is a clear revisit of what they are trying to accomplish and the specifics of how they will go about the challenge. This is absolutely a matter of strategies/tactics and Xand O`s as Bones likes to call them - and he should not be allowed to casually dismiss the coaching side of the issue as he did with the lack of scoring 5v5.

Agreed. I have been a proponent of having a very diverse set of coaches on staff. You need expertise across the board. The two coaches that are predominantly in charge in Bones and Arniel are defensive first coaches. They deserve a lot of credit for improving the teams defensive and PK play. But we need coaches that can and are given the latitude to do the same with our offensive and pp schemes. I'm sure Lauer being out has hurt things a bit and replacing him with yet another d first coach in Dubois is likely not leading to different ideas in the room.

 

[KingBogo]

Good post. But the most troubling thought is that there is little to no actual coaching going on and the players just continue to do their own thing. There simply has to be more of a response than switching player positions, and then throwing out the ol` " more pucks to the net/ more guys to the net"fluff. What is needed is a clear revisit of what they are trying to accomplish and the specifics of how they will go about the challenge. This is absolutely a matter of strategies/tactics and Xand O`s as Bones likes to call them - and he should not be allowed to casually dismiss the coaching side of the issue as he did with the lack of scoring 5v5.

Agreed. I lay it mostly on coaching. The PP is not designed well for our current top offensive players. If anything bring Morrissey to the half wall to QB from there and have a shooting option from the point and more emphasis on someone being a consistent bumper option.

 

[Atoyot]

Ah yes, having them switch sides will help them break into the zone. Getting real tired of watching that unit stay on for 1:30-2 minutes straight going up and down the rink not being able to get set in the zone, then the 2nd unit coming out and being able to do it in a fraction of the time. I understand the pressure to get your top guys out there but having them on for the entire powerplay and failing over and over again, becoming more tired and less effective the longer they stay out, killing any momentum the team might have, isn't a winning strategy.

I want the 2nd unit to start the powerplays, not because I think they'll automatically be better but because it'll force the 1st unit to share the time.

 

[KingBogo]

Ah yes, having them switch sides will help them break into the zone. Getting real tired of watching that unit stay on for 1:30-2 minutes straight going up and down the rink not being able to get set in the zone, then the 2nd unit coming out and being able to do it in a fraction of the time. I understand the pressure to get your top guys out there but having them on for the entire powerplay and failing over and over again, becoming more tired and less effective the longer they stay out, killing any momentum the team might have, isn't a winning strategy.

I want the 2nd unit to start the powerplays, not because I think they'll automatically be better but because it'll force the 1st unit to share the time.

This is just stop gap. Top teams take advantage of their most skilled players. Bones and crew need to get to work and help set up a PP design that can be effective using our best offensive talent. Connor and Scheifele switching sides is window dressing.

 

[Jets 31]

This is just stop gap. Top teams take advantage of their most skilled players. Bones and crew need to get to work and help set up a PP design that can be effective using our best offensive talent. Connor and Scheifele switching sides is window dressing.

One other thing that is a little frustrating about the PP is when Morrissey passes to either Connor or Scheifele his passes seem a little slow. It's giving the goalie time to get over for the one timer . Hate to complain about Morrissey because he's been great this season but i think if he put some mustard on those passes it would help.

 

[surixon]

One other thing that is a little frustrating about the PP is when Morrissey passes to either Connor or Scheifele his passes seem a little slow. It's giving the goalie time to get over for the one timer . Hate to complain about Morrissey because he's been great this season but i think if he put some mustard on those passes it would help.

The slow pass from the dmen on the pp has been a hallmark going back years now. To me it seems like another coaching issue as I have seen JoMo zip passes with mustard at ES pretty consistiently this season.

 

[SensibleGuy]

One other thing that is a little frustrating about the PP is when Morrissey passes to either Connor or Scheifele his passes seem a little slow. It's giving the goalie time to get over for the one timer . Hate to complain about Morrissey because he's been great this season but i think if he put some mustard on those passes it would help.

I've noticed the same...as well as the passes being just slightly off the mark in terms of where they need to be for a one timer or quick shot. Just slightly behind the sweet spot.

 

[Jets 31]

Scheifele is taking some abuse on here and besides staying out too long in OT i think he's playing pretty good. Our prime goal scorer Connor needs to pick it up. We need him scoring goals and he's not been doing enough of that for my liking.

 

[Jets 31]

The slow pass from the dmen on the pp has been a hallmark going back years now. To me it seems like another coaching issue as I have seen JoMo zip passes with mustard at ES pretty consistiently this season.

Yes exactly, Morrissey has done that slap pass quite a bit this season but never on the PP, weird.

 

[surixon]

Yes exactly, Morrissey has done that slap pass quite a bit this season but never on the PP, weird.

I think the slow pass started with Laine as he liked to one time the puck back across the grain a bunch. So the play was designed to have the goalie over when the shot came as he would be going for the part of the net the goalie just vacated. It serves little purpose now as we don't have players who can make that across the grain shot with regularity.

We need quicker puck and player movement.

 

[Jets 31]

I think the slow pass started with Laine as he liked to one time the puck back across the grain a bunch. So the play was designed to have the goalie over when the shot came as he would be going for the part of the net the goalie just vacated. It serves little purpose now as we don't have players who can make that across the grain shot with regularity.

We need quicker puck and player movement.

All our coaches have to do is show them the game tape from the Edmonton games to show how fast you need to move a puck on a PP . It is night and day compared to ours and i believe we have enough talent that we could easily be doing the same. Very frustrating to watch.

 

[GeorgeJETson]

All our coaches have to do is show them the game tape from the Edmonton games to show how fast you need to move a puck on a PP . It is night and day compared to ours and i believe we have enough talent that we could easily be doing the same. Very frustrating to watch.

I agree. But they probably just watch funny YouTube videos instead

 

[Jets 31]

On a positive note i was happy with Neo and Namestnikov's games once again. Lets move Namestnikov up to the second line and Wheeler to the 3rd.

 

[LowLefty]

While agree with most of what you said, I wouldn't let the coaching staff off that easy. I think as currently designed our PP is easy to box out and make static. When our PP was at its very best in the early years of Laine. Wheeler was the QB from the right, but there was 3 options for him, Laine cross seem, Scheifele bumper and Buff with his heavy shot from the point. The way the PP is designed now is Morrissey QBs from the left point and we go around and around through him as our options are all around the outside. Morrissey, Scheifele and Connor being more active is only a partial solution as it is still easy enough for a good PK to box out since we don't have that heavy point shot as the 3rd option, and really Scheifele and Connor are playing the same role on opposite sides of the ice. I think Nino will help as a bumper, but with Morrissey being the distributor we rarely have that 3rd option we had with Buff.

We don't have that heavy shot - but JoMo has shown that he can get it through to the net. That said, I still wish we had the heavy shot.

IMO, the guys that can get this PP moving are the three I mentioned - and the rest should follow. KC and Scheif need to step into the center ice area once in awhile (ala Ehlers) - that gets Nino moving. JoMo is trying to walk the blueline but he's not getting much movement from 55/81 - they stick to their walls when they should be either swapping positions with 44 or following him. This may not solve all our problems but it would be a step in the right direction.

I agree that I did simplify the solution - there's more to it - but I do think it's where it needs to start.