Speculation: Sharks 2015-2016 Roster Talk: Rumors, Roster, Proposals. Part III ‎

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Quid Pro Clowe

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Dec 28, 2008
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Kadri would make it hard due to his cap hit.

If the Sharks want Bernier bad enough I'd do:

Bernier (50% retained)

Torres
Brown
4th or 5th in '17
 

Juxtaposer

Outro: Divina Comedia
Dec 21, 2009
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Bernier is a decent player, but he is waaaaay overpaid. I have no interest in acquiring him unless the Leafs retained 50%.
 

Pinkfloyd

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Oct 29, 2006
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Bernier is a decent player, but he is waaaaay overpaid. I have no interest in acquiring him unless the Leafs retained 50%.

Oh I agree with that but Bernier at 2 mil only getting a 4th or a 5th is still pretty low value for him even with his horrible season.
 

Vaasa

Registered User
Aug 23, 2006
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Oh I agree with that but Bernier at 2 mil only getting a 4th or a 5th is still pretty low value for him even with his horrible season.

Bernier at $2 mil is still overpaid IMO. And the fact that he signed for another year make him worth less IMO, not more. He's shown that he simply can't hack being a starter. And $2m for a "meh" backup isn't worth trading any assets for. Just wait until Price comes back and Montreal waives Scrivens if you want a guy with equal talent and a lesser cap hit (going off memory).
 

Pinkfloyd

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Bernier at $2 mil is still overpaid IMO. And the fact that he signed for another year make him worth less IMO, not more. He's shown that he simply can't hack being a starter. And $2m for a "meh" backup isn't worth trading any assets for. Just wait until Price comes back and Montreal waives Scrivens if you want a guy with equal talent and a lesser cap hit (going off memory).

I prefer not to pay any assets for a backup. I'm willing to ride it out and address it through free agency.
 

magic school bus

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Jun 4, 2010
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Why are people so down on Bernier? Up until this year he was rocking a .922, .922 & .912 sv% on a bad team. Just seems odd when those same ppl are fine with having traded a 1st for Jones, yet not interested in Bernier for free basically.
 

Pinkfloyd

Registered User
Oct 29, 2006
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Why are people so down on Bernier? Up until this year he was rocking a .922, .922 & .912 sv% on a bad team. Just seems odd when those same ppl are fine with having traded a 1st for Jones, yet not interested in Bernier for free basically.

I wouldn't take him for free just because of the salary and the position we're talking about trading for. It's a backup goalie spot. They shouldn't spend anything in terms of trade assets and they shouldn't have to spend too much in cap dollars either. Even if Toronto retains half and makes Bernier's cap hit a little over 2 million, that's still too much for a backup. Besides, if we relegate him to the backup spot, he'd probably bounce after next season anyway. Might as well just ride it out to free agency and sign one of our own.
 

Juxtaposer

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Used As A Shield

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I rarely read fearthefin after the owner/writer or whatever change happened, that article does nothing to make me want to go back......
 

magic school bus

***********
Jun 4, 2010
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San Jose, CA
I wouldn't take him for free just because of the salary and the position we're talking about trading for. It's a backup goalie spot. They shouldn't spend anything in terms of trade assets and they shouldn't have to spend too much in cap dollars either. Even if Toronto retains half and makes Bernier's cap hit a little over 2 million, that's still too much for a backup. Besides, if we relegate him to the backup spot, he'd probably bounce after next season anyway. Might as well just ride it out to free agency and sign one of our own.

Why is that still too much? This team burns money & cap on guys like Ben Smith, Torres, Burish and Havlat (Demers!!) every year without helping the roster at all. Jones makes what, $3M a season. Spending $5M total on goalies is more than reasonable.

And as for the "it's just a backup goalie spot" comment, you try and build the best team possible and there are many different ways to do that. This could be one for us to look at, especially with the dramatic dropoff between our #1 & #2.
 
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Dicdonya

Registered User
Jul 21, 2011
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PF is right. There is little, to no, reason to spend assets on a backup goaltender this year. Especially 2mil + trade assets to acquire Bernier. That also assumes Toronto would actually eat half his salary which is anyone's guess.

If they want to get a backup it should be one that's extremely cheap(contact wise), and would cost nothing more than a 5-7th round pick.

Once the playoffs start, backup goaltender is meaningless unless Jones goes down, and would anyone honestly be comfortable with a single one of the backup goaltenders talked about to replace Stalock, having any chance to win us a cup? No, is my opinion. We don't even know if jones can do it, let alone a guy like Ramo, or Bernier, or Scrivens, etc.

So seriously, what is the point with like 25 games left, maybe 5-6 of which Stalock will start for, spending time, assets, and money on a backup, who won't really help us much more if jones goes down, do for us? The short term benefit is so minuscule, and the long term benefits are basically zero, with the potential negatives (one less pick, prospect,less salary cap, etc) having greater chance to hurt us more than any benefit we would get from a backup who "might" get better results in a handful of games this year.
 

hohosaregood

Banned
Sep 1, 2011
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Well I guess the best we could hope for is try to go on a streak to clinch our playoff spot or specific seed. Then over the last 8 games, give Stalock 6 starts and get Jones an extended rest and the last two games to get ready for the playoffs.
 

KirbyDots

Registered User
May 10, 2011
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Bernier at 50% retained would be fine, he has been a very good goalie in the past. I'd be fine with taking Bernier especially if it would reduce the cost of acquiring Kadri, who would be a great fit. Though if it isn't part of a bigger deal for a player like Kadri or a dman I'd prefer to go for cheaper option for a backup.
 

Pinkfloyd

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Oct 29, 2006
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http://www.fearthefin.com/2016/2/18/11053976/making-a-patrick-marleau-for-p-k-subban-trade-work

Thoughts?

I would think it would take a bit/lot more than what they have proposed. Something like:

Marleau
Mueller
Goldobin/Timo
Cap Dump
2nd or 3rd

for

Subban

The author couldn't even justify that trade from Montreal's perspective. His rationale for the trade is desperation and stupidity based on the criticisms Subban is getting because of the color of his skin. It's just an absolutely awful piece of work.

Why is that still too much? This team burns money & cap on guys like Ben Smith, Torres, Burish and Havlat (Demers!!) every year without helping the roster at all. Jones makes what, $3M a season. Spending $5M total on goalies is more than reasonable.

And as for the "it's just a backup goalie spot" comment, you try and build the best team possible and there are many different ways to do that. This could be one for us to look at, especially with the dramatic dropoff between our #1 & #2.

I don't see wasteful spending in the past as justification for wasteful spending now or in the future. 5 mil is reasonable on goaltending but 2 mil on the backup isn't. And while the difference between that and what will likely be going rate in the market is probably only around 500k, I see that as significant when a team may look into improving its team at the deadline. You have to maintain a balance of building for now and for the future. You have to pick your spots on what to upgrade, when to upgrade it, and what to spend on it. The dramatic drop-off between Jones and Stalock now doesn't mean a whole lot. It's something that can be addressed in the off-season with a slew of decent to good available backup goalies in the free agent market. You're not going to get a lot out of Bernier this season if traded for and probably not next season either being relegated to backup duties. He's certainly not someone to get excited about acquiring.

Besides, I think getting Toronto to retain on Bernier and get him on the cheap is a pipe dream. The off-season will probably open up some trade options to places like Carolina or Calgary. Or they will give him one last kick at the can if Reimer walks.
 

Limekiller

Registered User
May 16, 2010
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PF is right. There is little, to no, reason to spend assets on a backup goaltender this year. Especially 2mil + trade assets to acquire Bernier. That also assumes Toronto would actually eat half his salary which is anyone's guess.

If they want to get a backup it should be one that's extremely cheap(contact wise), and would cost nothing more than a 5-7th round pick.

Once the playoffs start, backup goaltender is meaningless unless Jones goes down, and would anyone honestly be comfortable with a single one of the backup goaltenders talked about to replace Stalock, having any chance to win us a cup? No, is my opinion. We don't even know if jones can do it, let alone a guy like Ramo, or Bernier, or Scrivens, etc.

So seriously, what is the point with like 25 games left, maybe 5-6 of which Stalock will start for, spending time, assets, and money on a backup, who won't really help us much more if jones goes down, do for us? The short term benefit is so minuscule, and the long term benefits are basically zero, with the potential negatives (one less pick, prospect,less salary cap, etc) having greater chance to hurt us more than any benefit we would get from a backup who "might" get better results in a handful of games this year.

I'll disagree about the long term benefit being zero, depending on who we pick up. For example, Kuemper from the Wild (who Wild fans have indicated is definitely available) is only 25, has a cap hit of 1.25 mil, and is an RFA after this season, so still pretty cost controlled. I'm more than willing to spend a 4th round pick on a 25 year old backup goalie who's shown some decent skill at the NHL level, and could be with us for some time. I mean, he's only played 15 games this year, but he's got a 2.28 GAA, and a 0.918 save%. Compare that to Stalock, who is sporting a 2.94 and 0.884 in 13 games on a better team.

So yeah, I'd be willing to spend a 4th on him. Maybe even a bit more. There are other similar goalies we could look into acquiring as well. I understand entirely not wanting to pay big costs for someone like Reimer, I wouldn't do that either. But that's not the only kind of backup we could acquire. The only reason I went along with Bernier in that Leafs proposal is because it got us Kadri. I have zero interest in Bernier on his own. But Kuemper, or someone like him, now that I'd be willing to spend for.
 

Coy

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Feb 25, 2014
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I miss the old FeartheFin with Plank as the owner. It's kind of a dead community now.
 

Bizz

Slacked for Mack
Oct 17, 2007
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I miss the old FeartheFin with Plank as the owner. It's kind of a dead community now.

The new community manager is a dick. I won't ever go back.

All I did was suggest Patrick Kane is innocent until proven guilty, like everyone else in America, and he banned me from the site and blocked me on Twitter.

One of the reasons why I like it here is I don't have to worry about being banned for having the wrong opinions.
 
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