Shanahan's Plan to Restore Respectability

[LeafsNet]

The fans who want change ARE the genuine Leafs fans. 7 years of 1st rnd exits, one 2nd rnd exit where they were destroyed.

Mental health.... well..its likely the "fans" who dont want change who have the mental health issues:
"The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results"

Don’t disagree with that….the original post in this topic was talking about clawing back respect in the league…to which I responded that it’s pointless and unnecessary.

“Respect” in the league doesn’t guarantee you cups.

And this is probably Shanahan’s last year at the helm….unless the Leafs go on a miraculous run.

 

[Nineteen67]

Ridiculous.

Boy wonder’s trash will take years to flush out. His big mistake was acquiring JT.

But the new guy had opportunity’s to move players, but he hasn’t. Y’all make it sound like it’s a hard job.

You don't think the GM who signed players to immovable contracts that don't expire until next year is responsible for their still being here?

If you have four similar players taking too much cap space, what is the logical solution? I would say keep the two best and got rid of the other two as soon as possible.

Tre kept the two best (yes, overpaying somewhat), and hopefully he will get rid of the other two (in JT's case, at least free up most of the cap) as soon as possible, which is next summer.

I don't mind blaming someone for something they should do but didn't, but not for something they couldn't do.

Actually he kept all four and is paying them a greater percentage of the cap than the other guy did.

Again, how is this on Treliving exactly? That was my question. Shanny said none of the core four were moving last year and then he signed Tre.

Was Tre supposed to let Matthews and Nylander walk for nothing? That's what he was staring down.

He has not re-signed Marner or Tavares.

What exactly are you pinning on him? Why is the 53% in him?

He’s the GM.

 

[conFABulator]

But the new guy had opportunity’s to move players, but he hasn’t. Y’all make it sound like it’s a hard job.


Actually he kept all four and is paying them a greater percentage of the cap than the other guy did.


He’s the GM.

Hmmm. I don't know what to say that I haven't already said and you seemed to ignore. Treliving got here and the off-season was already underway. Shanny announced that the core four were staying and then the NMC's kicked in. I said this already.

Do you think Tre should have let Matthews and Nylander walk? What specifically should he have done. It seems like complaints without alternatives. You can't ignore the facts of the time when assessing the job he did at that time.

 

[Nineteen67]

A few things:

This isn’t mocking, this is a pest trying to win over a section of the NHL fandom who have an unhealthy obsession with despising the Leafs.

Before Shanahan, the Leafs only made the playoffs ONCE between 2005 to 2016. If you were a member of HFboards back then (or a lurker), you would know how NHL Talk would regularly poke fun at Leafs fans claiming “the Leafs haven’t made the playoffs in X years” or “make the playoffs first then talk”.

Since 2017, they have made the playoffs every year and have always finished above 3rd in the division, earning +100 points each since (except during the lockout). Now what do they say? “Oh get past the first round”.

When they got past the first round last year, it was “oh you only won a game”.

The Leafs could eventually win a cup, and they’ll start saying “oh but that’s just one cup in 60 years”.

The point is, Leafs fans shouldn’t pay too much attention to what the “reputation” of the team is.

Genuine hockey fans would love to see the Leafs finally win.
But there’s a large swath out here who are genuinely invested in watching the Leafs lose…to the point where their mental health comes into question.

And I’m not joking either….

I think most people use reason and logic when analyzing the team . And the facts tell you it’s the worst sports organization, in terms of winning, in the US and Canada. US fans look at the Leafs for what they are, a big fat nothing. Not lovable like the Cubs were, just a meaningless nothing.

All they have to go on is history.

 

[notDatsyuk]

And who hired Dubas? That’s who’s truly accountable, it doesn’t bode well, he also hired Tre and I’m not impressed with him thus far, I had hope, but as usual with the Leafs it was false hope. As for not moving on from players with NMC’s, he hasn’t even tried to do shit and will no doubt resign him mid season to a overblown contract much like he did with Styles………

True - although we don't really know how much blame belongs to Shanny and how much to Dubas.

But the idea that it's somehow Tre's fault that Mitch and JT have NMCs that don't expire until next year is odd, even for a Dubas supporter.

We don't know that Tre hasn't even tried, we only know that he hasn't succeeded, and considering the Marner camp has clearly stated that he won't waive, I'm not surprised Tre hasn't succeeded.

I don't think the Nylander contract is as bad as some think, but Marner is looking for more, and even the same amount would be even more overblown. We can only hope that Tre doesn't re-sign him, except as part of a sign-and-trade.

 

[Dreakmur]

Hmmm. I don't know what to say that I haven't already said and you seemed to ignore. Treliving got here and the off-season was already underway. Shanny announced that the core four were staying and then the NMC's kicked in. I said this already.

Do you think Tre should have let Matthews and Nylander walk? What specifically should he have done. It seems like complaints without alternatives. You can't ignore the facts of the time when assessing the job he did at that time.

Tre should have decided which one of Marner or Nylander he wanted to keep and trade the other one before their NMC kicked in. He only had a short window to do that, and my suspicion is that Shanahan made not doing it a condition of employment… but that’s still what needed to be done.

Now what needs to happen is to let Marner walk away for nothing. It sucks, but that’s what it’s going to take to finally start building a more balanced team that can actually compete in the playoffs.

 

[Nineteen67]

Hmmm. I don't know what to say that I haven't already said and you seemed to ignore. Treliving got here and the off-season was already underway. Shanny announced that the core four were staying and then the NMC's kicked in. I said this already.

Do you think Tre should have let Matthews and Nylander walk? What specifically should he have done. It seems like complaints without alternatives. You can't ignore the facts of the time when assessing the job he did at that time.

Yes, but the off-season ended. He’s had over a year. Everything was on him as soon as the season started. He re-signed Nylander and paid him as though he’s a super star.

Forget the other guy, he’s out of the picture.

 

[notDatsyuk]

But the new guy had opportunity’s to move players, but he hasn’t. Y’all make it sound like it’s a hard job.


Actually he kept all four and is paying them a greater percentage of the cap than the other guy did.


He’s the GM.

If you want to pretend that the new GM had control over events before he arrived and should be blamed for them, should we also give him credit for the Cup win in 1967? It makes as much sense.

 

[Nineteen67]

If you want to pretend that the new GM had control over events before he arrived and should be blamed for them, should we also give him credit for the Cup win in 1967? It makes as much sense.

He claims to be the GM and if he is, the roster is on him. As is the coaching.

If he isn’t the GM and doesn’t tell us, that’s even worse.

 

[Nineteen67]

Tre should have decided which one of Marner or Nylander he wanted to keep and trade the other one before their NMC kicked in. He only had a short window to do that, and my suspicion is that Shanahan made not doing it a condition of employment… but that’s still what needed to be done.

Now what needs to happen is to let Marner walk away for nothing. It sucks, but that’s what it’s going to take to finally start building a more balanced team that can actually compete in the playoffs.

If roster construction limitations was a condition of employment, why take the job? Or if you do, just say that you’re not permitted to make certain trades.

Trading players is not difficult. Look at the imbeciles that hold these GM positions around the NHL .

 

[notDatsyuk]

He claims to be the GM and if he is, the roster is on him. As is the coaching.

If he isn’t the GM and doesn’t tell us, that’s even worse.

Please tell me how he could have traded two players with full NMCs who won't waive them.

 

[conFABulator]

Tre should have decided which one of Marner or Nylander he wanted to keep and trade the other one before their NMC kicked in. He only had a short window to do that, and my suspicion is that Shanahan made not doing it a condition of employment… but that’s still what needed to be done.

Now what needs to happen is to let Marner walk away for nothing. It sucks, but that’s what it’s going to take to finally start building a more balanced team that can actually compete in the playoffs.

So, you are just going to ignore the fact that the decision was made that they were not trading any of the core four before Tre was hired? Look it up, it's a fact, Shanny said it.

Why are you pinning this on Treliving and not Shanny? If Marner walks, it is not for nothing, we get $11M in cap space which might be just as good given that our window is now. Take the savings on a JT resign and the full Marner amount and add Ekblad and Bennett?

 

[RunItBackAgain]

Ridiculous.

Boy wonder’s trash will take years to flush out. His big mistake was acquiring JT.

Probably the single biggest reason we haven’t won anything.

 

[LeafsNet]

I think most people use reason and logic when analyzing the team .

Oh that’s comedy

 

[Leaf Fans]

The fans who want change ARE the genuine Leafs fans. 7 years of 1st rnd exits, one 2nd rnd exit where they were destroyed.

Mental health.... well..its likely the "fans" who dont want change who have the mental health issues:
"The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results"

There are very few fans if any that don't want change. The team has changed a lot over the past few years. It just is not the change that some people want like a change in the "core 4". Mental health issues can affect anyone independent of their level of change to the hockey team. Every Maple Leafs fan wants change in the playoff record- change for the better.
A definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results -( Rita Mae Brown) though it contradicts the other maxim that practice makes perfect.

 

[Antropovsky]

There are very few fans if any that don't want change. The team has changed a lot over the past few years. It just is not the change that some people want like a change in the "core 4". Mental health issues can affect anyone independent of their level of change to the hockey team. Every Maple Leafs fan wants change in the playoff record- change for the better.
A definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results -( Rita Mae Brown) though it contradicts the other maxim that practice makes perfect.

Yup... problem is we arent seeing the Leafs get better in playoffs. They took Boston to 7, what 7 or 8 years ago? That boston team was much better than this past years Boston.

 

[IPS]

Yup... problem is we arent seeing the Leafs get better in playoffs. They took Boston to 7, what 7 or 8 years ago? That boston team was much better than this past years Boston.

Randy Carlyle's bare bones squad of Phaneuf/Kessel being the best players took an even better Boston team that almost won the cup to 7 games as well. Was that squad "right there" as well?

 

[tmlms13]

I think people are forgetting just how bad 2005-2016 was.

I'll take the 2017-now over that all day.

Ask Sabres or Sens fans what they prefer. Their last 8 years or our last 8 years

 

[Larcos_Unal]

Respect in the handshake line? Check
Respect from agents of their RFAs? Check

 

[HamiltonNHL]

I think people are forgetting just how bad 2005-2016 was.

I'll take the 2017-now over that all day.

Ask Sabres or Sens fans what they prefer. Their last 8 years or our last 8 years

It's Cup or Die.
and we've died a thousand times since then.

 

[Suntouchable13]

I think people are forgetting just how bad 2005-2016 was.

I'll take the 2017-now over that all day.

Ask Sabres or Sens fans what they prefer. Their last 8 years or our last 8 years

Well, sure, but anybody will get tired of the seeing the same shit over and over. I am sick of losing in the first round every year. You're basically a step up above the Sens and Sabres, that's it. Never sniffed the cup. We get 3 more playoff game victories than them every year. One year Leafs won a whole 5 playoff games, whoop de doo. I am sick of fans defending this core and Shanahan. What they have done is the bare minimum. Once the playoff start, they check out.

 

[LeafGrief]

I think people are forgetting just how bad 2005-2016 was.

I'll take the 2017-now over that all day.

Ask Sabres or Sens fans what they prefer. Their last 8 years or our last 8 years

This is better than eight years of abject futility, but it's still its own brand of futility. The regular seasons are more fun than sucking, but the playoffs have been the same rerun over and over and over. No growth, no regression, just a new supporting cast and then going out in 7 every year.

I don't think that being better than two of the worst sad-sack franchises in the league or NA sports is the measuring stick we want. I don't subscribe to "cup or bust" thinking, but half a decade of making the playoffs by Christmas and then the same result in the spring is BORING. I'd rather be a bubble team for a while because then at least the stretch is compelling to watch. There's no suspense with this team, no inherent excitement. Matthews chasing records is the only real intrigue we have, there's no point in getting excited about win streaks or loss streaks because we know they're going to get ~105 points and a divisional slot, then seven meaningful games where we pretend we don't know what's going to happen.

 

[rumman]

Respect in the handshake line? Check
Respect from agents of their RFAs? Check

Respect from the NHLPA for helping to drive salaries up? Check

 

[Racer88]

I think people are forgetting just how bad 2005-2016 was.

I'll take the 2017-now over that all day.

Ask Sabres or Sens fans what they prefer. Their last 8 years or our last 8 years

I would take the 2017……in 2017 but when we are still ground hogging 2017 in 2024, that sucks
I expect more from this organization

 

[darrylsittler27]

What's the pm s plan to improve Canada? Shanhan hired a kid who never played hockey because he wore glasses. No picks next year. Wow pure genius.