Post-Game Talk: Sewart Skinner in the FLA Swamp

[TheNumber4]

Nobody ever throws the goalies under the bus to the media. Very bad idea

Okay I agree with that. But i just won’t make the assumption that the opposite of his words is what he’s thinking.

One thing I didn’t know about was a new goalie scout hire. That’s at least promising.

It is. I liked the news at the time, and I’m optimistic on new approaches to coaching outside Schwartz.

Not saying it’s going to work, or anything like that. Just saying they ARE trying things right?

 

[TheNumber4]

Maybe you can't win a Cup with average goaltending. I mean I realize that might be mind blowing to some people.

The only reason they got that far is because they have the best player since Lemieux.

We’ve seen dice roll goalies win though. That either continued being average on way to a cup (Francouz) or got hot at the right time. Im not and have never said Skinner is an elite goalie, but in the world of dice rolls he’s not bad dice roll if they are going to go with that route. And with their cap situation, roster build, Campbell f*** up, that might be all we can hope for, dice rolls.

 

[Soundwave]

Okay I agree with that. But i just won’t make the assumption that the opposite of his words is what he’s thinking.


It is. I liked the news at the time, and I’m optimistic on new approaches to coaching outside Schwartz.

Not saying it’s going to work, or anything like that. Just saying they ARE trying things right?

Yes they're trying, like the fat guy who only orders one Apple Pie instead of two Apple Pies for 1/7 McDonalds runs that includes multiple Big Macs and and full order fries.

If you want to applaud that, go ahead, I won't.

Doing bare minimum shit isn't good enough if you're claiming to be in the "Cup or nothing" window.

We’ve seen dice roll goalies win though. That either continued being average on way to a cup (Francouz) or got hot at the right time. Im not and have never said Skinner is an elite goalie, but in the world of dice rolls he’s not bad dice roll if they are going to go with that route. And with their cap situation, roster build, Campbell f*** up, that might be all we can hope for, dice rolls.

Francouz is the only one that did that and that Colorado team was loaded.

Vegas won BECAUSE they didn't just sit on their ass and do nothing with goaltending. They were proactive and took a chance on Adin Hill who had surprisingly decent numbers on bad Phoenix and San Jose teams, and that extra effort won them a Cup.

If the Oilers ran Vegas, they wouldn't have made that move. They'd have just stuck with Laurent Broissoit after giving up on Lehner.

McDavid deserves a Cup, our front offices don't. They don't out work other teams' front offices, no one can look at say Colorado, Vegas, and Florida's front offices and say with a straight face our front office did the same kind of work they did.

 

[TheNumber4]

Because STOOOOEY is the golden child. Pickard is the defacto back up. They decided this a year ago.

Besides doing that would embarrass the front office, some AHL cast off better than the golden child Edmonton boy?

Can't have that.

Pickard absolutely deserves more starts.

I don’t think so. I think there’s a reason they chose Stu over Pickard. And that can be seen in games when you dig deeper than just the stats.

 

[Soundwave]

I don’t think so. I think there’s a reason they chose Stu over Pickard. And that can be seen in games when you dig deeper than just the stats.

Yeah they're totally the smart people in the room when it comes to goaltending and have superior goaltending-vision. That must be it.

There's a (very) good reason why Team Canada avoided Skinner like the plague. You have to try too as a Canadian goalie to miss making that team coming off a Cup Final, like seriously.

 

[TheNumber4]

I don’t like Schwartz. But In the goaltending world he is respected. And the 2 new coaches on top of his work, is still a better strategy to fixing the issue than we’ve ever seen. So I’m willling to give it chance and see if it works.

 

[TheNumber4]

Yes they're trying, like the fat guy who only orders one Apple Pie instead of two Apple Pies for 1/7 McDonalds runs that includes multiple Big Macs and and full order fries.

If you want to applaud that, go ahead, I won't.

Doing bare minimum shit isn't good enough if you're claiming to be in the "Cup or nothing" window.



Francouz is the only one that did that and that Colorado team was loaded.

Vegas won BECAUSE they didn't just sit on their ass and do nothing with goaltending. They were proactive and took a chance on Adin Hill who had surprisingly decent numbers on bad Phoenix and San Jose teams, and that extra effort won them a Cup.

If the Oilers ran Vegas, they wouldn't have made that move. They'd have just stuck with Laurent Broissoit after giving up on Lehner.

McDavid deserves a Cup, our front offices don't. They don't out work other teams' front offices, no one can look at say Colorado, Vegas, and Florida's front offices and say with a straight face our front office did the same kind of work they did.

Damn you analogy is giving me the munchies. But I don’t think that’s akin to what they are doing. Cause signing 6 goalies in 6 years and trying 3 goalie coaches is about the max that an NHL team can realistically do within the time frame of seasons. And with limiting factors like cap space, goalie availability, and trade assets.


I’d say we are closer to the Avs build than other cup winning teams. Top end Elite talent and speed, than any other build. So if they are going the Francouz route, it makes sense to me.

Yes Vegas took a “chance”. Key word “chance”. They didn’t blow their load and go get an $8M guy. We are instead taking our chance with Skinner. There are other chances out there though, but how many are better than what we have? We don’t know until we spend the assets and cap space to test that theory.

 

[Soundwave]

Damn you analogy is giving me the munchies. But I don’t think that’s akin to what they are doing. Cause signing 6 goalies in 6 years and trying 3 goalie coaches is about the max that an NHL team can realistically do within the time frame of seasons. And with limiting factors like cap space, goalie availability, and trade assets.


I’d say we are closer to the Avs build than other cup winning teams. Top end Elite talent and speed, than any other build. So if they are going the Francouz route, it makes sense to me.

Yes Vegas took a “chance”. Key word “chance”. They didn’t blow their load and go get an $8M guy. We are instead taking our chance with Skinner. There are other chances out there though, but how many are better than what we have? We don’t know until we spend the assets and cap space to test that theory.

No one is saying getting an 8 million dollar guy.

You have one of the best defensive structures in the NHL and you have the best player in 30 damn years and another guy who might win the MVP and you're going to go dirt cheap in net?

How f***ing stupid is this organization?

At least get a Talbot tier goalie for f***'s sake. It isn't that hard.

 

[TheNumber4]

Yeah they're totally the smart people in the room when it comes to goaltending and have superior goaltending-vision. That must be it.

There's a (very) good reason why Team Canada avoided Skinner like the plague. You have to try too as a Canadian goalie to miss making that team coming off a Cup Final, like seriously.

I mean in this situation they only have to look at Stu and look at Picks. And look at the games they’ve played and what happened in those games. Shouldn’t take a genius to figure out.

No one is saying getting an 8 million dollar guy.

You have one of the best defensive structures in the NHL and you have the best player in 30 damn years and another guy who might win the MVP and you're going to go dirt cheap in net?

How f***ing stupid is this organization?

At least get a Talbot tier goalie for f***'s sake. It isn't that hard.

Yea. So take a dice roll goalie to replace the dice roll goalie we already have. So who’s that guy and how many trades and wasted cap space till we find him?

 

[NotAVacuumSalesman]

Any lip readers? What did Darnell even say to get an unsportsmanlike conduct?

 

[OfCorsiDid]

Pickard has better numbers than Skinner for two years running now.

If we had "better than Pickard" for any one of game 1, 2, or 3 of the Finals, yeah maybe we do eek out a 2024 Cup by the skin of our teeth and by McDavid's sheer will.

It's not what I'd recommend doing though, frankly it's a stupid risk to take.

I don’t think we do.

Pickard is far more consistent than Skinner. His best though is significantly lower than Skinner.

That’s the rub.

Bad Skinner is arguably an ECHL goalie maybe lower.
Good Skinner is as good as practically anyone in the league.
Average Skinner is meh.

The issue is he’s so wildly inconsistent that you’ll often see 3 Skinners in one game. I mean how many times do you see him make a save he has no right making and then gives up a softie. It’s happened this year at least 5 times already. It’s also reliably happened the last 3 years.

If I was to guess that’s what management is stuck on. Average and Bad Skinner are not gonna get the job done but man is Good Skinner ever addicting when he plays well. Especially at $2.6 million.

I guess to finish this off for the night, you’re going to get your wish at the end of this year either way. Basically it ends one of two ways:

1. We win the cup. Skinner stays but who cares we won.
2. We don’t win the cup. Skinner is likely gone. Pickard has another year left on his deal.

 

[Soundwave]

I mean in this situation they only have to look at Stu and look at Picks. And look at the games they’ve played and what happened in those games. Shouldn’t take a genius to figure out.


Yea. So take a dice roll goalie to replace the dice roll goalie we already have. So who’s that guy and how many trades and wasted cap space till we find him?

I'd literally take Cam Talbot even now. Or Lyon. Or like 20 other guys.

You do realize even if Skinner was having a good year (he's having a terrible) one that if he were to get hurt our tandem would be a guy 40 games removed from the AHL and a back up who has ZERO NHL experience. As in not even in a period played.

How is this even acceptable team building for a team that's in a do or die Cup window.

Stop being f***ing stupid and at least get a third NHL proven goalie. Like the amount of "cutting it thin" this team is willing to go in net is ridiculous.

 

[Oilhawks]

Okay I agree with that. But i just won’t make the assumption that the opposite of his words is what he’s thinking.


It is. I liked the news at the time, and I’m optimistic on new approaches to coaching outside Schwartz.

Not saying it’s going to work, or anything like that. Just saying they ARE trying things right?

 

[TheNumber4]

Any lip readers? What did Darnell even say to get an unsportsmanlike conduct?

Seeing that again, sure call the initial penalty. Incidental contact has been ignored before but whatever it’s also been called.

But at most 10 words were said. Before the ref flipped his lid. Seems like bs to me.

 

[OfCorsiDid]

Any lip readers? What did Darnell even say to get an unsportsmanlike conduct?

That actually just made me more mad. Nurse isn’t even yelling at him!

Kelly must’ve been bored or thought he was one of those kids in his yard I was talking about.

I don’t like Schwartz. But In the goaltending world he is respected. And the 2 new coaches on top of his work, is still a better strategy to fixing the issue than we’ve ever seen. So I’m willling to give it chance and see if it works.

I’m not sure how he’s respected considering we’ve had bottom 16 goaltending for his entire tenure. One would say it should’ve turned around from Charron by now.

 

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

At least get a Talbot tier goalie for f***'s sake. It isn't that hard.

Talbot and Skinner basically have the same career sv% and Talbot makes twice as much

Maybe we should all start eating soup with a fork just because it's different.

 

[OfCorsiDid]

Talbot and Skinner basically have the same career sv% and Talbot makes twice as much

Maybe we should all start eating soup with a fork just because it's different.

Yeah I don’t understand these half measures.

If you wanna f***, then f***!

Take a swing at a better goalie. If you can’t make a noticeable improvement at the position then make a move that makes an improvement at a different position.

 

[TheNumber4]

I'd literally take Cam Talbot even now. Or Lyon. Or like 20 other guys.

You do realize even if Skinner was having a good year (he's having a terrible) one that if he were to get hurt our tandem would be a guy 40 games removed from the AHL and a back up who has ZERO NHL experience. As in not even in a period played.

How is this even acceptable team building for a team that's in a do or die Cup window.

Stop being f***ing stupid and at least get a third NHL proven goalie. Like the amount of "cutting it thin" this team is willing to go in net is ridiculous.

2 trips to the IR this season Talbot? I mean it’s a dice roll on that front with a 39’year old goalie. And then you’re worrying about injuries in the playoffs like the Nucks, along with his mental weakness issues we’ve already seen. But sure dice roll it up and maybe it works better than the guy we already have that doesnt cost anything extra. Lyons not available, so why is he brought up.

If they want to add a 3rd goalie or think they can upgrade Picard at not much cost, sure go for it. I bet even if they did you have a 90% chance that Stu ends up being the guy anyways, but if it’s cheap why not. I take the same position on waiver wire claims, if it’s no risk, no reason not to.

 

[Soundwave]

Talbot and Skinner basically have the same career sv% and Talbot makes twice as much

Maybe we should all start eating soup with a fork just because it's different.

That's literally not even true, Talbot has a significantly higher save percentage for his career and has a significantly better save percentage the last two years on top of that.

Skinner's career save percentage is actually closer to David Riitich and that's actually the class of goalie I think he is, David Riitich tier, Riitich also had two years in Calgary where he played a ton of games and put up similar to Skinner numbers.

Stop acting like Skinner is prime Hasek, he's not a franchise goalie, so that being the case, getting a good 1A/B was always the prudent move to make.

Having any decent option as a 1B/1A is better than what we have now. Since we don't have a legit franchise type goalie we are better off having multiple options instead of just two basically.

The Oilers are basically asking McDavid and Draisaitl to win them a Cup with David Riitich essentially. That's an enormous ask, which actually begs the question why we insist on doing it that way.

 

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

That's literally not even true, Talbot has a significantly higher save percentage for his career and has a significantly better save percentage the last two years on top of that.

Skinner's career save percentage is actually closer to David Riitich and that's actually the class of goalie I think he is, David Riitich tier, Riitich also had two years in Calgary where he played a ton of games and put up similar to Skinner numbers.

Stop acting like Skinner is prime Hasek, he's not a franchise goalie, so that being the case, getting a good 1A/B was always the prudent move to make.

Having any decent option as a 1B/1A is better than what we have now. Since we don't have a legit franchise type goalie we are better off having multiple options instead of just two basically.

The Oilers are basically asking McDavid and Draisaitl to win them a Cup with David Riitich essentially. That's an enormous ask, which actually begs the question why we insist on doing it that way.

.007 difference career average isn't what I call significant.

 

[Soundwave]

.007 difference career average isn't what I call significant.

.914 is significantly better than .907 (and dropping).

Playoffs is a gap too, Talbot at .915 career, Skinner at .894.

Skinner is much closer as a comparable to David Riitich. .907 to .905 career, this year almost identical, .892 for Skinner, .890 for Riitich, Riitich had similar numbers starts to Skinner at a similar age in Calgary too previously in his career too.

Don't think there weren't some folks in Calgary (Hrudey too lol) who thought at one point Riitich was their future franchise goalie.

 

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

.914 is significantly better than .907 (and dropping).

Playoffs is a gap too, Talbot at .915 career, Skinner at .894.

Skinner is much closer as a comparable to David Riitich. .907 to .905 career, this year almost identical, .892 for Skinner, .890 for Riitich, Riitich had similar numbers starts to Skinner at a similar age in Calgary too previously in his career too.

Don't think there weren't some folks in Calgary (Hrudey too lol) who thought at one point Riitich was their future franchise goalie.

Talbot is your savior then. Better make some cap space

 

[Soundwave]

Talbot is your savior then. Better make some cap space

He's a better goalie than the Skinner/Riitich tier and doesn't make a lot of money. Probably could get some retention from Detroit.

If there's no other options, then do that at least for f***'s sake. It's not like we'll ever get these years back, on what planet is having the best player since Lemieux and then wasting prime years of his career putting in a goalie who has a .894 in the playoffs in the last two years a good idea?

It's insane.

 

[OfCorsiDid]

I'll maybe pass on this one. heh. FTR Koskinen at least improved in net and frankly he didn't have the defense Skinner has in front of him. Srivens? haha, not touching that one.

Yeah man I saw Scrivens and I was like “well I know a refined gentleman with certain opinions on that guy”

 

[Sheikyerbouti]

We need some physicality up front. Imagine 7 games like this one. Our stars would be battered and most of theirs unscathed.

100%

Maybe the Oilers have analytics that show grit isn't necessary; tough sell after losing to the Panthers.

We are playing good right now. Analytics are golden but the roster is ugly and being carried by the two best players in the world. We are not one or two players away, we need several players to get back to last year.

There is no heaviness, the d is still too small, and the goaltending is below average. Going all-in on this roster when we have no assets will be suicide imo.