Sens Lounge: "Pleeease won't you be.....my neighbour"

[Stylizer1]

Even then...so my parents bought off des epinettes in 1988...and that dip by the ravine wasn't even paved yet... Cars were getting stuck in the mud in the dip...my dad had a jeep Cherokee and would drive by the stuck cars.. So des epinettes recieved final paving around 1989-1990. Go check Google maps. It got repaved between 2012-2018 according to google map street view.

Now go to Orleans boulevard which is busier than des epinettes avenue.

My house is one of the newer ones built off Orleans boulevard in 1993. Many houses are several years older.

Orleans boulevard hasn't been repaved since then...so it's been like 40 years since they paved it despite being busier than des epinettes.

So what you said doesn't add up with reality.

I agree the city is quick with requests like garbage bin or small services like this. Always done very quickly.

It's the issues that actually cost money, like repaving a whole neighbourhood, which get neglected.

That doesn't make sense. My house was built in 79 and it's close to there. There is no way that was a dirt road for that long.

 

[BigRig4]

It's supposed to be that.

Lol didn’t know that. I guess everyone just ignores it then, which makes it arguably more frustrating. The busses needing to merge in and out of the only moving lane during rush hour is insanity.

 

[Stylizer1]

If only we had this a few years ago. lol

'FREEDOM' CONVOY 2022? FROM THE ANNALS OF PROTESTS PAST - THE "ON-TO-OTTAWA" TREK OF AUGUST 8-22, 1935​

On a blazing hot afternoon in August 1935 four hundred dogged protesters arrived in Ottawa after a 22-day, 290-mile walk from Toronto. They were attempting to finish the earlier cross Canada “On-to-Ottawa” trek that had been smashed up by deadly police violence in Regina.



Their objective was to present Prime Minister Bennett with a 7-point manifesto demanding financial relief for unemployed workers and other benefits. He rejected their request outright and refused any federal assistance for food or shelter. The City of Ottawa was left to deal with this dilemma. The trekkers who alternated between defiance and desperation during their 15-day stay in the city remained remarkably peaceful during the whole episode.

Some pretty cool Ottawa stuff from years past. History repeats itself.

 

[Stylizer1]

1910:

2022:

 

[Golden_Jet]

View attachment 1014341


View attachment 1014346


If only we had this a few years ago. lol

'FREEDOM' CONVOY 2022? FROM THE ANNALS OF PROTESTS PAST - THE "ON-TO-OTTAWA" TREK OF AUGUST 8-22, 1935​

View attachment 1014350

View attachment 1014351

View attachment 1014353

View attachment 1014354


On a blazing hot afternoon in August 1935 four hundred dogged protesters arrived in Ottawa after a 22-day, 290-mile walk from Toronto. They were attempting to finish the earlier cross Canada “On-to-Ottawa” trek that had been smashed up by deadly police violence in Regina.



Their objective was to present Prime Minister Bennett with a 7-point manifesto demanding financial relief for unemployed workers and other benefits. He rejected their request outright and refused any federal assistance for food or shelter. The City of Ottawa was left to deal with this dilemma. The trekkers who alternated between defiance and desperation during their 15-day stay in the city remained remarkably peaceful during the whole episode.

Some pretty cool Ottawa stuff from years past. History repeats itself.

Big difference from 4 hundred walkers to thousands and 18 wheelers everywhere, blaring horns.

 

[Stylizer1]

Big difference from 4 hundred walkers to thousands and 18 wheelers everywhere, blaring horns.

Evolution is a bitch.

 

[jbeck5]

The City Bylaw people do not react to calls about neighbours' cats in my yard! Neither does my city councillor nor the mayor!

Lol thanks for this input.

 

[jbeck5]

That's a little fast. It's supposed to go 80kmh but I doubt it get half that on a sunny day.

Is it though? Going 120 in my cheap little Hyundai doesn't feel fast. You'd think a train would be faster. Maybe I'm thinking of trains wrongly.

 

[jbeck5]

A faster moving train isn't going to help, the stops are too close together. The entire line 1 is only 25 km once extended, so going 80km/hr (current top speed) to 120 would only shave off a little over 5 mins from the entire line, and that ignores the time it takes to reach those speeds would be the same between stops, and the train that hits 120 would have to start

With 18 stops over 25 kms (once construction is done) it will be an average of 1.4km per stop, at 80km max speed, about 380m of that would be accelerating and decelerating, so your only gaining additional speed for 1 km per stop,

I agree the transfer is where you can make up the most time. I wish they had invested more in park and rides on the outside of downtown, a substantial park and ride at Orleans, Trim Blair and Montreal road would do wonders imo.


Owning a car vs bus...
~$1500/yr insurance
~$1500/yr Gas @ 15000km, 8L/100km, $1.20/L, cut that in half if you don't drive a lot,
~$1500/yr Maintenance (tires, brakes, oilchange, other service, ect) less if you do it yourself.
~$900/yr Parking (assuming you are driving to work and get a killer deal of $75 a month for parking)
~$6000/yr car payment until it's paid off (that's on a 30k car not accounting for interest or tax), if you amortize that over 10 years instead of the typical 5 year loan to account for needing a new car after 10 yrs, $3000

So, a conservative estimate of about 8k on a car a year, vs $1600 on a bus pass.

That said, many people will own a car regardless of whether they bus too, so many costs are fixed liek the insurance, it's really the incremental costs that matter, so gas (to and from places you would have bused) and parking. A bit less maintenance is required too.

I agree about the speed not being a huge factor...moreso the transfers. No one wants to transfer and potentially wait 30 mins for a local bus on-top of the whole commute time.

No park and ride options is a big problem. No one wants to transfer and park and rides along the rail line prevent people from having to transfer.

I feel like those car expenses are extremely high.

Insurance, sure.
Gas, sure.

Maintenance? No way. Oil change is like $100...so 2-3 of those a year...getting winter tires switched is like $60...so $120 a year.

It cost me about $150 to bring my car in for an oil change and to switch to summer wheels...

So my maintenance is about $300 a year...or $400 if I add my summer crown appointment.

Where are you getting $1,500 per year?

I've owned cars for 10 years and maintenance is never equal to $15,000.

Probably do the breaks twice over the life...that's like $750 each time... Probably tires once or twice...$1,000 a set. Tires and breaks aren't a yearly thing...they're like a once every 4-8 years thing.

I'm not seeing 20k to keep a vehicle for 15 years or whatever the life of a regular vehicle lasts.

I did however totally forget about parking costs....because I used to get free parking with my job but don't anymore.

Car payments are only for those who don't buy cheap second hand cars lol.

 

[Golden_Jet]

I agree about the speed not being a huge factor...moreso the transfers. No one wants to transfer and potentially wait 30 mins for a local bus on-top of the whole commute time.

No park and ride options is a big problem. No one wants to transfer and park and rides along the rail line prevent people from having to transfer.

I feel like those car expenses are extremely high.

Insurance, sure.
Gas, sure.

Maintenance? No way. Oil change is like $100...so 2-3 of those a year...getting winter tires switched is like $60...so $120 a year.

It cost me about $150 to bring my car in for an oil change and to switch to summer wheels...

So my maintenance is about $300 a year...or $400 if I add my summer crown appointment.

Where are you getting $1,500 per year?

I've owned cars for 10 years and maintenance is never equal to $15,000.

Probably do the breaks twice over the life...that's like $750 each time... Probably tires once or twice...$1,000 a set. Tires and breaks aren't a yearly thing...they're like a once every 4-8 years thing.

I'm not seeing 20k to keep a vehicle for 15 years or whatever the life of a regular vehicle lasts.

I did however totally forget about parking costs....because I used to get free parking with my job but don't anymore.

Car payments are only for those who don't buy cheap second hand cars lol.

If your keeping your car for 10 years, you’re going to need an exhaust $1000, alternator $1000, fluid changes/flushes other than oil,
Shocks …. as well.
Tires need winter and summers, adds up quick, maybe $1000 not 1500.

 

[jbeck5]

That doesn't make sense. My house was built in 79 and it's close to there. There is no way that was a dirt road for that long.

Ill see if I can find the old map. Des epinettes was paved from Jeanne Darc to Turnberry Rd...then was dirt for the dip, and then paved from 10th line to wayside.

It was not paved from wayside to Turnberry for a good year or two as they developed that area.

My parents have a map from the late 80s and you could see des epinettes was two seperate ends connected by a dirt road for 50M...

 

[Stylizer1]

A faster moving train isn't going to help, the stops are too close together. The entire line 1 is only 25 km once extended, so going 80km/hr (current top speed) to 120 would only shave off a little over 5 mins from the entire line, and that ignores the time it takes to reach those speeds would be the same between stops, and the train that hits 120 would have to start

With 18 stops over 25 kms (once construction is done) it will be an average of 1.4km per stop, at 80km max speed, about 380m of that would be accelerating and decelerating, so your only gaining additional speed for 1 km per stop,

I agree the transfer is where you can make up the most time. I wish they had invested more in park and rides on the outside of downtown, a substantial park and ride at Orleans, Trim Blair and Montreal road would do wonders imo.


Owning a car vs bus...
~$1500/yr insurance
~$1500/yr Gas @ 15000km, 8L/100km, $1.20/L, cut that in half if you don't drive a lot,
~$1500/yr Maintenance (tires, brakes, oilchange, other service, ect) less if you do it yourself.
~$900/yr Parking (assuming you are driving to work and get a killer deal of $75 a month for parking)
~$6000/yr car payment until it's paid off (that's on a 30k car not accounting for interest or tax), if you amortize that over 10 years instead of the typical 5 year loan to account for needing a new car after 10 yrs, $3000

So, a conservative estimate of about 8k on a car a year, vs $1600 on a bus pass.

That said, many people will own a car regardless of whether they bus too, so many costs are fixed liek the insurance, it's really the incremental costs that matter, so gas (to and from places you would have bused) and parking. A bit less maintenance is required too.

have you ever been on a subway? Those things get up to top speed in like 10 seconds. We get the LRT.

 

[jbeck5]

If your keeping your car for 10 years, you’re going to need an exhaust $1000, alternator $1000, fluid changes/flushes other than oil,
Shocks …. as well.
Tires need winter and summers, adds up quick, maybe $1000 not 1500.

Uhh no you will not need most of those things... You're keeping your mechanic rich though.

I constantly drove 10-15 year old cars in mint condition just regular oil change, rust proofing, and tires last 8 years for me...and brakes last 6 years for me. And I drive them hard and even took them on track days.

Edit: I will say it depends on the car. With my car and my family growing ups car, we did not need to get suspension or exhaust work on a

1988 jeep Cherokee kept until 2005.
1998 Ford Windstar kept until 2012.
2001 Toyota Camry kept until 2015.
2010 Toyota Sienna still going strong
2010 Hyundai genesis still going strong but just sold

Howeverrr the 2009 Chrysler 300 needed suspension work every 2 years it seems...and my cousin with a 2008 Dodge Magnum has the same issues.

Otherwise cars have needed basically no maintenance until they're 14-17 years old. Just oil changes and rust proofing and keeping in garages.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Uhh no you will not need most of those things... You're keeping your mechanic rich though.

I constantly drove 10-15 year old cars in mint condition just regular oil change, rust proofing, and tires last 8 years for me...and brakes last 6 years for me. And I drive them hard and even took them on track days.

I always keep cars 10-12 years, and have always needed those things.

Did you have them from new, if used how do you know those things were not changed.

Alternator life is about 120-200k

 

[StoicSensFan]

Uhh no you will not need most of those things... You're keeping your mechanic rich though.

I constantly drove 10-15 year old cars in mint condition just regular oil change, rust proofing, and tires last 8 years for me...and brakes last 6 years for me. And I drive them hard and even took them on track days.

You gotta tell me these magic car brands that don't need suspension and steering components replaced, alignments, and have rust-proofed exhausts. You've never had any belt driven components fail on you like the a/c, p/s or waterpump?

 

[jbeck5]

I always keep cars 10-12 years, and have always needed those things.

Did you have them from new, if used how do you know those things were not changed.

Alternator life is about 120-200k

Because we got the cars new or 4 years old (after lease) with like 30-80,000km and the full records.

We had friends who would lease cars and if we liked it would ask them to buy it at a cheap cost and turn around and sell it to us...we'd have full records.

 

[StoicSensFan]

What kind of laptimes did you see with the Cherokee, Windstar and Sienna?

I kid, I kid.

 

[jbeck5]

You gotta tell me these magic car brands that don't need suspension and steering components replaced, alignments, and have rust-proofed exhausts. You've never had any belt driven components fail on you like the a/c, p/s or waterpump?

Nope. I'm too young too remember early stuff on the cars...so maybe before 2000 if the Jeep had any issues, I might not know...but nope...none of that for the Camry or sienna or genesis or 300.

Here's the jeep at 18 years old before we sold it to my friend down the street as his first car. Mint condition. AC couldn't break on it because there was no AC haha.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Because we got the cars new or 4 years old (after lease) with like 30-80,000km and the full records.

We had friends who would lease cars and if we liked it would ask them to buy it at a cheap cost and turn around and sell it to us...we'd have full records.

Well you’d be in the minority for repairs then.

 

[jbeck5]

What kind of laptimes did you see with the Cherokee, Windstar and Sienna?

I kid, I kid.

Lol the sienna would be funny at luskville drag when people bring their Pontiac Sunfires and run a 17 lol. Pull up in a sienna with 7 people and pull on them.

 

[jbeck5]

Well you’d be in the minority for repairs then.

Interesting. When I got my genesis with about 80-90k I was told it's the original clutch and shit talkers would say it wouldn't last to 100k. Sold it at 140something and the clutch was still going strong even though I would do launches and pulls and donuts and burnouts lol took so much abuse and kept going as new.

But then the 300 had $1,000 repairs every year

The Dodge is a 2009 and Hyundai is a 2010. Both rust proofed every year. Both washed every week and waxed often. Look at the difference in how they held up over time.

The car makes a difference.

 

[Micklebot]

I agree about the speed not being a huge factor...moreso the transfers. No one wants to transfer and potentially wait 30 mins for a local bus on-top of the whole commute time.

No park and ride options is a big problem. No one wants to transfer and park and rides along the rail line prevent people from having to transfer.

I feel like those car expenses are extremely high.

Insurance, sure.
Gas, sure.

Maintenance? No way. Oil change is like $100...so 2-3 of those a year...getting winter tires switched is like $60...so $120 a year.

It cost me about $150 to bring my car in for an oil change and to switch to summer wheels...

So my maintenance is about $300 a year...or $400 if I add my summer crown appointment.

Where are you getting $1,500 per year?

I've owned cars for 10 years and maintenance is never equal to $15,000.

Probably do the breaks twice over the life...that's like $750 each time... Probably tires once or twice...$1,000 a set. Tires and breaks aren't a yearly thing...they're like a once every 4-8 years thing.

I'm not seeing 20k to keep a vehicle for 15 years or whatever the life of a regular vehicle lasts.

I did however totally forget about parking costs....because I used to get free parking with my job but don't anymore.

Car payments are only for those who don't buy cheap second hand cars lol.

Well, I went by personal recent experience, but my car is a bit older so maintenance is higher (out of warranty and getting to the point I need some things dealt with), also the make has a big impact, Toyota and Hyundai for example was always considered pretty low cost to maintain while Ford and Chevy tended to be much higher. Luxury vehicles are even worse.... There is plenty of numbers you can get from a quick google, this one for example is double my overall estimate but about 500 less a year on maintenance, so I'll grant you that I went higher than average.

Then again here's another source claiming the yearly average is $1500, but it starts lower and only hits the yearly average at year 10, those 10 yr+ cars are likely shouldering a lot of the cost.

Car Maintenance Cost | What Is The Average Car Maintenance Cost?

How much are car maintenance costs? Read our guide to determine the average maintenance costs for top car brands. How much should you budget for car maintenance?

www.thinkinsure.ca

As for car payments, sure, you can buy used, then you're likely out of warranty and probably have to deal with higher maintenance costs, be it brakes, tires, battery, transmission, muffler, ect. But you're still on the hook for 10k or more, heck you mentioned getting a Kona n, 2021 kona's are going for around 20k on Autotrader right now and that's not even the N, so my 30k as a starting point seems pretty reasonable.

Anyways, the overall point was more that there are lots of costs that don't often get thought of when it comes to owning a car, you might have been lucky to get free parking until recently, but a lot of people aren't, and that's not even considered parking costs for people renting apartments which can add another $80-$120 a month.

From a purely cost perspective, you're probably better off busing and renting a car for trips, taking an Uber the odd time you need to, assuming you are well served by transit. Personally I'd rather tax dollars go towards making public transit a reasonable option than making driving slightly more convenient, if I could get to work in 45 min instead of 20 driving, I'd probably do it, but like you said, the transfer really makes it a big headache.

 

[StoicSensFan]

Interesting. When I got my genesis with about 80-90k I was told it's the original clutch and shit talkers would say it wouldn't last to 100k. Sold it at 140something and the clutch was still going strong even though I would do launches and pulls and donuts and burnouts lol took so much abuse and kept going as new.

But then the 300 had $1,000 repairs every year

The Dodge is a 2009 and Hyundai is a 2010. Both rust proofed every year. Both washed every week and waxed often. Look at the difference in how they held up over time.

The car makes a difference.

Not surprised by the Dodge, also had similar experiences with a 2002 Durango that was bought lightly used but went through wheel bearings, brakes, and suspension components like crazy.

 

[jbeck5]

Well, I went by personal recent experience, but my car is a bit older so maintenance is higher (out of warranty and getting to the point I need some things dealt with), also the make has a big impact, Toyota and Hyundai for example was always considered pretty low cost to maintain while Ford and Chevy tended to be much higher. Luxury vehicles are even worse.... There is plenty of numbers you can get from a quick google, this one for example is double my overall estimate but about 500 less a year on maintenance, so I'll grant you that I went higher than average.



View attachment 1014497
Then again here's another source claiming the yearly average is $1500, but it starts lower and only hits the yearly average at year 10, those 10 yr+ cars are likely shouldering a lot of the cost.

Car Maintenance Cost | What Is The Average Car Maintenance Cost?

How much are car maintenance costs? Read our guide to determine the average maintenance costs for top car brands. How much should you budget for car maintenance?

www.thinkinsure.ca

As for car payments, sure, you can buy used, then you're likely out of warranty and probably have to deal with higher maintenance costs, be it brakes, tires, battery, transmission, muffler, ect. But you're still on the hook for 10k or more, heck you mentioned getting a Kona n, 2021 kona's are going for around 20k on Autotrader right now and that's not even the N, so my 30k as a starting point seems pretty reasonable.

Anyways, the overall point was more that there are lots of costs that don't often get thought of when it comes to owning a car, you might have been lucky to get free parking until recently, but a lot of people aren't, and that's not even considered parking costs for people renting apartments which can add another $80-$120 a month.

From a purely cost perspective, you're probably better off busing and renting a car for trips, taking an Uber the odd time you need to, assuming you are well served by transit. Personally I'd rather tax dollars go towards making public transit a reasonable option than making driving slightly more convenient, if I could get to work in 45 min instead of 20 driving, I'd probably do it, but like you said, the transfer really makes it a big headache.

Fair enough. You're right about apartment parking. I would hate to have to pay that.

I have a cottage I go to almost every weekend 3 seasons so I couldn't do bus plus Uber. Would cost me a fortune lol.

 

[jbeck5]

Not surprised by the Dodge, also had similar experiences with a 2002 Durango that was bought lightly used but went through wheel bearings, brakes, and suspension components like crazy.

Bearings on Dodge was complete ass. If they cared about their reliability they would have done a recall a long time ago on the front end suspension. It's a known issue but Dodge stays quiet.