Senators Revenue and Operating Income

[GCK]

Our prices are way below league average. It takes money to fuel above floor spending. The last ticket I bought in Belleville cost more than my last Sens ticket. The leafs make $3 million a game. Sens make $609G… If you want that type of spending you need to raise ticket prices and playoff ticket process.

Trying to deflect again. The leafs are prevented from spending that difference thanks to the salary cap. Pointing out the leafs get 3M per game is pointless.

 

[HSF]

That has never worked in Ottawa - Bryden tried that, Geener has too. Fans didn’t respond. Hurts to hear how personal Stone viewed the empty buildings during the playoffs. Guys like that don’t want to play in cities that can get excited for a playoff series let alone have crappy weather and taxes.

Anyway, spending is up over $70 and projects to increase.

I heard he did not want to stay for a rebuild and wasn't sure if Ottawa would spend to actually build a team.

Makes a lot of sense why he wanted to go with Vegas management and ownership

 

[Sweatred]

I agree it does, and he would have made a lot more money if he had just done a reasonable price increase and sold out every night in the playoffs.

Maybe - the idea was to hammer the 12000 season tickets holders who mainly write off the cost and will buy the games … it put a pressure on the fans that would buy a single game. I get why fans don’t want to spend $175 x 2 to sit in the 200 level … that’s a $500 night. But that is what big revenue teams and big spenders charge (and get).

 

[Tuna99]

No thanks.

It’s like worrying the Sens are going to sign some veteran Dman that’s as doen 2 years ago like Del Zotto, Jason Smith or Hainsey.

it’ll happen, the Sens will be erratic and out of left field, but that’s how they do business

 

[BankStreetParade]

The steadfastness of using a publication's estimates of a franchise's yearly fiscal health as fact is really astounding. Let me know when one of you jabronis has a chance to look at the books for yourself and can give us the real numbers from the last 15 years instead of getting wound up arguing semantics over guesstimates.

 

[Sweatred]

The steadfastness of using a publication's estimates of a franchise's yearly fiscal health as fact is really astounding. Let me know when one of you jabronis has a chance to look at the books for yourself and can give us the real numbers from the last 15 years instead of getting wound up arguing semantics over guesstimates.

Oh come on … That’s like questioning every player eval around here until someone has worked in the league for 10 years and can voice an opinion with some sort of value.

You head is in the sand if you think those numbers are far off anyway and their inaccuracy is likely consistent franchise too franchise.

Forbes doesn’t just put their name to something because the student intern is throwing darts at a board.

So until we get a forensic accountant to share details of all 30+ teams I think these are as good a source as any.

 

[BankStreetParade]

Oh come on … That’s like questioning every player eval around here until someone has worked in the league for 10 years and can voice an opinion with some sort of value.

You head is in the sand if you think those numbers are far off anyway and their inaccuracy is likely consistent franchise too franchise.

Forbes doesn’t just put their name to something because the student intern is throwing darts at a board.

An educated guess is still...a guess. There's no comparable to player evaluations because unlike the Senators' finances and accounting books, you can actually see the players you're evaluating.
No one's head is in the sand if they say I'll believe concrete numbers when I see them over the musings of some guy on the internet.

 

[Sweatred]

An educated guess is still...a guess. There's no comparable to player evaluations because unlike the Senators' finances and accounting books, you can actually see the players you're evaluating.
No one's head is in the sand if they say I'll believe concrete numbers when I see them over the musings of some guy on the internet.

No doubt … there’s lot of people here who think the Sens should spend the same as everyone else.

The Sens who make about $2.4 million less a game over 46+ games are spending about ~$8 less than the leafs on payroll.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Maybe - the idea was to hammer the 12000 season tickets holders who mainly write off the cost and will buy the games … it put a pressure on the fans that would buy a single game. I get why fans don’t want to spend $175 x 2 to sit in the 200 level … that’s a $500 night. But that is what big revenue teams and big spenders charge (and get).

Not sure why you think , STH mainly write off the cost, I never did that, and in Ottawa that number is likely lower, only one doing that would be a private business, and they can’t write off as much as you think.

 

[Sweatred]

Not sure why you think , STH mainly write off the cost, I never did that, and in Ottawa that number is likely lower, only one doing that would be a private business, and they can’t write off as much as you think.

I’d assume the majority of high priced seats are owned by businesses of some sort.

 

[DuncanMacpherson]

Backloading all these contracts is about to hit Melnyk really hard in the wallet. Some players are getting big salary increases these next couple years.

 

[branch]

The only way to save this team is if we get shovels in the ground at LeBreton next week. Otherwise we are cooked.

 

[Sweatred]

Backloading all these contracts is about to hit Melnyk really hard in the wallet. Some players are getting big salary increases these next couple years.

This is an issue - this team is potentially headed for >$80 million payroll in a few years with a $80 cap.

It won’t collapse the franchise, the Sens will just move Chabot and/or Brady at $10 million each but it will crush a lot of hearts (see 4000 EK posts).

 

[Sweatred]

The only way to save this team is if we get shovels in the ground at LeBreton next week. Otherwise we are cooked.

Possible - but a new building costs about $25+ per ticket to pay off over 30 years. I’m not sure we can aborb that… we can’t sell the $25 tickets as it is.

 

[Tuna99]

This is an issue - this team is potentially headed for >$80 million payroll in a few years with a $80 cap.

It won’t collapse the franchise, the Sens will just move Chabot and/or Brady at $10 million each but it will crush a lot of hearts (see 4000 EK posts).

Owner Rule 5B - Don’t make empty promises or empty threats to your fan base and you’ll be okay in pro sports

 

[Sweatred]

Owner Rule 5B - Don’t make empty promises or empty threats to your fan base and you’ll be okay in pro sports

Promises ? Do you mean “the plan” ??? Do you think the plan “plans” for an increase in ticket sales and revenue ? Or do you think it promises massive spending regardless of what revenue looks like? Do you realize we are ~$8 million less than teams like the Rangers and Leafs and about to try to sign our 1C and 2-3LW?

 

[Micklebot]

Not sure why you think , STH mainly write off the cost, I never did that, and in Ottawa that number is likely lower, only one doing that would be a private business, and they can’t write off as much as you think.

For one thing, you can't write off personal use. If your clients are all gov't, they can't accept tickets making it tougher to justify them as business expenses under the tax provisions. Also, Scanlan reported a few years ago that sources told him only a out half of the teams season ticket sales came from corporate sales, while a team like the leafs was around 80%.

 

[Tuna99]

Promises ? Do you mean “the plan” ??? Do you think the plan “plans” for an increase in ticket sales and revenue ? Or do you think it promises massive spending regardless of what revenue looks like? Do you realize we are ~$8 million less than teams like the Rangers and Leafs and about to try to sign our 1C and 2-3LW?

I don’t know what the plan is but I know it’s big, Melnyck guaranteed multiple Cups within 3 years and it was made to sign all our “superstars” so I’m
Excited

 

[Sweatred]

Where Senators money comes from - based off 2019 numbers

Analysis: The NHL’s cruel new math | Ottawa Citizen

Assume a future return to $125 of revenue that fuels at 50/50 payroll of $62.5+ million at +\- $10 million of losses/profit.

$41.25 (33%) from local/national TV
$18 (15%) from NHL Rev Share.
$31 (25%) from gate off avg of 14500.
And a missing 27% or $33 from other events or sources.

In 2022 TV and league revenue sharing should be similar or improved but there is a big drop on ticket sales off an average of 14500 and I assume there are much fewer events running out of the CTC. That could easily be below $15 million now.

We could easily be looking at a revenue total around $80-90 million trying to run a hockey operating with a $75 million budget.

 

[SensFactor]

Winning would solve a lot of problems we are experiencing. Saying that, getting a new building or rapidly improving transportation to the arena who be equally important.

 

[BankStreetParade]

Where Senators money comes from - based off 2019 numbers

Analysis: The NHL’s cruel new math | Ottawa Citizen

Assume a future return to $125 of revenue that fuels at 50/50 payroll of $62.5+ million at +\- $10 million of losses/profit.

$41.25 (33%) from local/national TV
$18 (15%) from NHL Rev Share.
$31 (25%) from gate off avg of 14500.
And a missing 27% or $33 from other events or sources.

In 2022 TV and league revenue sharing should be similar or improved but there is a big drop on ticket sales off an average of 14500 and I assume there are much fewer events running out of the CTC. That could easily be below $15 million now.

We could easily be looking at a revenue total around $80-90 million trying to run a hockey operating with a $75 million budget.

Your math is wrong. You can find the real numbers online instead of just throwing shit at the fan and seeing what sticks.

 

[Sweatred]

Your math is wrong. You can find the real numbers online instead of just throwing shit at the fan and seeing what sticks.

Ohhh … Big boys WORDs and no evidence .. like if you scream loud it may go away… I’m just compiling the data from the article. Feel free to point out any mistakes … it’s off the back of a napkin off my cell phone.

 

[BankStreetParade]

No doubt … there’s lot of people here who think the Sens should spend the same as everyone else.

The Sens who make about $2.4 million less a game over 46+ games are spending about ~$8 less than the leafs on payroll.

Wrong again unless you think $83 million (Leafs' salary expenditures for this season) minus $63 million (Ottawa's salary expenditures) equals $8 million.

 

[BankStreetParade]

Ohhh … Big boys WORDs and no evidence .. like is you scream loud it may go away… I’m just compiling the data from the article. Feel free to point out any mistakes … it’s off the back of a napkin off my cell phone.

You've got about $40ish million from the regional contract, about $15 million from the Canadian national deal, and the US national deal is worth about $19ish million. So, around $73-$75 million per year in TV revenue alone. Which is a far cry from your 41.25 million in tv revenue and $80-$90 million in total revenue.
Keep spamming the forum with your horseshit back of the napkin math though. Great work!!!

 

[Sweatred]

You've got about $40ish million from the regional contract, about $15 million from the Canadian national deal, and the US national deal is worth about $19ish million. So, around $73-$75 million per year in TV revenue alone. Which is a far cry from your 41.25 million in tv revenue and $80-$90 million in total revenue.

Source please - I shared the article I took my values from. I’d love to see more accurate if you can find them… and you don’t need SCREAM.