GDT: Semifinal - May 19 - Canada vs Switzerland

[Chimpradamus]

If watching players stick handle ineffectively on the perimeter is your thing, then international hockey is for you. I'd rather watch McDavid beat players wide 8 times a period in the NHL because he has less distance to travel from A to B.

Speed is actually rewarded on small ice. Big ice handicaps players who can think and move faster than others. Defensive positioning is everything, and it's easier to do, because, again, the actual legitimate scoring areas don't get any bigger. All you're doing is making the perimeter larger, and the perimeter isn't a threat. Danger areas are defended the exact same way, only more effectively because it takes offensive players longer to get to there, having to travel the extra distance.

So you're arguing great skating players are punished on a big sized rink? Ok, that's a first. You know what happened when NHL stars spread out in other leagues during the lockout? Those NHL stars who couldn't skate, were benched, because they were useless. But you claim a big ice benefits bad skaters. Ok.

If you haven't understood it yet, most teams NA teams face have great skaters, everyone of them. You know why? Not because they're bad skaters and benefit from that.

You know why McDavid blows by so many defensemen in the NHL? Because they're shit at skating! If that's what you like to see, ok. But don't come with such ridiculous arguments.

 

[syz]

So you're arguing great skating players are punished on a big sized rink? Ok, that's a first. The distance between the nets isn't some gigantic leap you know.

I'd be incredibly surprised if bringing up basic math was a first, but c'est la vie.

It's quite literally a game of inches. To think that adding inches wouldn't slow things down would be stupid. If somebody runs a 100M sprint and a 105M sprint I'm willing to bet I know which time is going to be faster.

All it does is give slower players more of a chance. Even if it's fractional we're talking about professional athletes making split second decisions. Giving them a few more split seconds leads to a far more boring viewing experience.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

Well this game featured a joke of a team that doesn't deserve to be in the finals, and it's not Switzerland

 

[aphyro]

I'd be incredibly surprised if bringing up basic math was a first, but c'est la vie.

It's quite literally a game of inches. To think that adding inches wouldn't slow things down would be stupid. If somebody runs a 100M sprint and a 105M sprint I'm willing to bet I know which time is going to be faster.

I'm 100% positive Usain Bolt would have a better time than u on 200m sprint if you had 100m

 

[booyakasha]

Well this game featured a joke of a team that doesn't deserve to be in the finals, and it's not Switzerland

Thats a little harsh.
I applaud the Canadian team, and full props to Swiss .
no shame in losing, as the Swiss earned their win.
to ridicule the Canadian team like that downplays the effort of the Swiss team.

 

[Chimpradamus]

I'd be incredibly surprised if bringing up basic math was a first, but c'est la vie.

It's quite literally a game of inches. To think that adding inches wouldn't slow things down would be stupid. If somebody runs a 100M sprint and a 105M sprint I'm willing to bet I know which time is going to be faster.

All it does is give slower players more of a chance. Even if it's fractional we're talking about professional athletes making split second decisions. Giving them a few more split seconds leads to a far more boring viewing experience.

So a 105m sprint is better for a slower skater, than a 100m sprint? Is that a basic math conclusion? Ok. You just brought up basic math. Thank you for your wisdom. So a slower defenseman would logically rather cover 120m of ice, than 80m of ice playing against McDavid? Not only that, he would rather give McDavid extra space in the corners, because that benefits the poor skating defenseman! How couldn't I see this before?! You should send a memo to someone important, this is revolutional!

And I who thought all this time a smaller rink gives a greater benefit to slower, more physical players. It has always been the opposite! The earth isn't round, it's flat!

 

[syz]

I'm 100% positive Usain Bolt would have a better time than u on 200m sprint if you had 100m

But are you also 100% positive that Usain Bolt would have a better time on a 100m sprint than Usain Bolt would have on a 200m sprint? Because that's the elementary thing being proposed here, as opposed to whatever it is you're babbling about.

 

[PatrikBerglund]

I'd be incredibly surprised if bringing up basic math was a first, but c'est la vie.

It's quite literally a game of inches. To think that adding inches wouldn't slow things down would be stupid. If somebody runs a 100M sprint and a 105M sprint I'm willing to bet I know which time is going to be faster.

All it does is give slower players more of a chance. Even if it's fractional we're talking about professional athletes making split second decisions. Giving them a few more split seconds leads to a far more boring viewing experience.

The bigger the ice-surface is, the more a great skater can exploit and use it to his advantage. It's just common sense.

 

[aphyro]

But are you also 100% positive that Usain Bolt would have a better time on a 100m sprint than Usain Bolt would have a 200m sprint? Because that's the elementary thing being proposed here, as opposed to whatever it is you're babbling about.

That was not whats being discussed here was it? Usain Bolt is a better sprinter than u are... so with ur logic you should beat Usain Bolt on a 200m sprint while he would hold the edge of u on a 100m.

 

[NorthernShark]

Issa Timo Time

 

[syz]

The bigger the ice-surface is, the more a great skater can exploit and use it to his advantage. It's just common sense.

The point is that you can make the ice surface as big as you want and the areas worth exploiting would remain the same size. The only way the extra space is conducive to more offensive is if defending players chased the player with the puck--but they don't, because they aren't stupid. They stay collapsed in the same place they would on any other ice surface and happily give up more perimeter shots. Meanwhile any shots/passes have a larger distance to travel and can therefore more easily be reacted to by defending sticks/opposing goaltenders.

On rush/transition plays that extra space is nullified by the fact that the offensive player has a wider lane to the net, so it's only relevant if they're hit with a stretch pass straight up the middle... which, again, isn't available, because defending players aren't stupid enough to just hang out at the boards or something; they're still covering the middle of the ice, just like they always would.

Defending in hockey is 100% a process of angling the attacker to the perimeter, no matter how big the surface is. Making the rink wider just makes that process easier.

But that's just common sense...

 

[Merya]

Very weird postgame talk. Switzerland was better. They deserved themselves already against Finland. Some canadians showing very bad sportmanship, like every friggin time Canada doesn't win. Shame on you, shame! Shame! Shame! Shame! Shame!

 

[booyakasha]

Very weird postgame talk. Switzerland was better. They deserved themselves already against Finland. Some canadians showing very bad sportmanship, like every friggin time Canada doesn't win. Shame on you, shame! Shame! Shame! Shame! Shame!

 

[Merya]

Yes I was going for that GoT reference.

 

[Chimpradamus]

The point is that you can make the ice surface as big as you want and the areas worth exploiting would remain the same size. The only way this is relevant to the conversation is if defending players chased the player with the puck--but they don't, because they aren't stupid. They stay collapsed in the same place they would on any other ice surface and happily give up more perimeter shots. Meanwhile any passes have a larger distance to travel and can therefore more easily be reacted to by defending sticks/opposing goaltenders.

On rush/transition plays that extra space is nullified by the fact that the offensive player has a wider lane to the net, so, it's only relevant if they're hit with a stretch pass straight up the middle... which, again, isn't available, because defending players aren't stupid enough to just hang out at the boards or something; they're still covering the middle of the ice, just like they always would.

You mean they collapse around the net in a zone defense? A very common strategy on the small sized rink as well, only it's tougher to get the puck out of the zone. So it's tough to score, generally? Yes, it's always tough to score on a set defense. Now compare what happens when one team takes the lead. You still just want to collapse? Well, good luck winning the game.

So, passes are longer? Sure, but the defensive zone is also bigger to defend. A hard quality pass also makes the extra travel distance negligible. Nothing stops a player from going in closer to the net on the big ice as well. The defense isn't covering more ice than on a small rink, the offense can choose the angle they want to shoot from.

Now, if the ice surface is kind of bad is a bigger issue on big ice, but that's not the fault of the format. Bad quality ice is not unknown in any league or format.

 

[syz]

You mean they collapse around the net in a zone defense? A very common strategy on the small sized rink as well, only it's tougher to get the puck out of the zone. So it's tough to score, generally? Yes, it's always tough to score on a set defense. Now compare what happens when one team takes the lead. You still just want to collapse? Well, good luck winning the game.

So, passes are longer? Sure, but the defensive zone is also bigger to defend. A hard quality pass also makes the extra travel distance negligible. Nothing stops a player from going in closer to the net on the big ice as well. The defense isn't covering more ice than on a small rink, the offense can choose the angle they want to shoot from.

The
defensive
zone
isn't
bigger
to
defend
because the part of the defensive zone that's actually worth defending (assuming you have a professional goaltender) is still the exact same size.

The high danger areas do. not. change. They simply take more time to get to, which benefits the defending team.

This is all without even mentioning the fact that traveling through the neutral zone is also slower, which just gives D more time to collapse as a play is coming in on them.

 

[Halla]

WOW. I was at the game where guys like Raymond,Roy,Bourque and Scrivens trounced this same team (minus Hischier) 5-1.
and a mcdavid led team can't get it done?

 

[Halla]

Very weird postgame talk. Switzerland was better. They deserved themselves already against Finland. Some canadians showing very bad sportmanship, like every friggin time Canada doesn't win. Shame on you, shame! Shame! Shame! Shame! Shame!

switzerland got outshot 45-17 and were utterly dominated.
they won, but that doesnt mean they were better.

also take it down a notch dude. inferiority complex coming out strong

 

[Merya]

also take it down a notch dude. inferiority complex coming out strong

I'm sorry it hurt you so bad.

 

[Lampedampe]

The
defensive
zone
isn't
bigger
to
defend
because the part of the defensive zone that's actually worth defending (assuming you have a professional goaltender) is still the exact same size.

The high danger areas do. not. change. They simply take more time to get to, which benefits the defending team.

This is all without even mentioning the fact that traveling through the neutral zone is also slower, which just gives D more time to collapse as a play is coming in on them.

I'm willing to agree that worse teams are able to diminish their disadvantage on a bigger ice surface, because they are able to sit back and on a bigger ice and thus they get more time to get into position to defend. However i don't think that this is what's being discussed by the other posters honestly, it's just common sense that speed is more rewarded on a bigger ice surface for the same reason.

 

[Merya]

On big ice the best of the best virtuosos have space to show their dominance. Trap and lesser players playkilling has less room.

 

[garbageteam]

The tournament itself will always have a bit of a niche value to it but I really hope Canada takes at least the Bronze to make it more attractive for Canadians to return

 

[syz]

I'm willing to agree that worse teams are able to diminish their disadvantage on a bigger ice surface, because they are able to sit back and on a bigger ice and thus they get more time to get into position to defend. However i don't think that this is what's being discussed by the other posters honestly, it's just common sense that speed is more rewarded on a bigger ice surface for the same reason.

In no world is speed rewarded when it has to travel a longer distance. Obviously that's going to be worse the slower you are, but the point is that everybody/everything gets slower, and that makes the game boring. I guess in a sense big ice doesn't reward speed, but rather punishes sloth.

Put any of these D on an NHL rink with McDavid and he skates around them clean at least once per shift. Hell, I've seen him do it to Josi multiple times.

 

[garbageteam]

WOW. I was at the game where guys like Raymond,Roy,Bourque and Scrivens trounced this same team (minus Hischier) 5-1.
and a mcdavid led team can't get it done?

That Swiss team didn't have Josi, Meier, Fiala, Andrighetto, Niederreiter, Mueller and Kukan. Don't think they had Noah Rod either. These aren't exactly plugs. And neither team has had Hischier on it for some reason. This Swiss team is still missing a handful of NHLers like Baertschi, Sbisa Weber & Malgin.

Only McDavid and Vlasic would be on a true best-of Canadian team. But the rest of this team is still significantly stronger than the one at the 2018 Olympics. They're underperforming based on the roster. Other than the Swedish D which is almost their A level, this Canadian roster is on paper one of the best teams in this year's tournament

 

[Merya]

Put any of these D on an NHL rink with McDavid and he skates around them clean at least once per shift. Hell, I've seen him do it to Josi multiple times.

Seriously? This is a rare occasion of selfassassination.
Well Done Sir!