Post-Game Talk: Same team, another season. Leafs put in a lacklustre effort lose 4-1

[34]

Domi - struggling, does not look good thus far.

Marner - looks very bad

Klingberg - This guy just sucks. Bad signing.

Knies - overrated (bottom 6 player at best)

Minten - I like the kid but he is not ready.

Goaltending - piss poor (big issue)

D - below average

On a bright note, Nylander is establishing himself as one of the very best players in the league. Just so dominant. Matthews is gonna do Matthews, best goal scorer in the modern NHL.

 

[VanW27]

I didn't think the Minten line was bad.

It seemed the team was off in the first period, they had an opportunity to do something, but just no cohesion.

Perry goal was inattention, they got dummied on that and that really was game, and I suspect Woll just too deep as it wasn't a great shot it was just a good shot.

Perry's goal isn't inattention, Marner saw him, was beside him and chose to go for the pick off instead of just covering him.

He's generally an excellent defensive player but that is one specific area he's really bad at. If he's in defensive position with the play in front of him he will almost always try to flag the puck down or pick off the pass instead just covering his man.

It's the same reason Marner and Matthew's have been a disaster at 3 on 3. Both of them try and stand up in the neutral zone to pick off passes instead of backing off leading to incredibly easy and wide open 2 on 1s for the opposition

 

[Fogelhund]

Thank you 6ix. To elaborate -- how many times did Marner give up the puck? I am guessing 8. Domi is nearly useless with the puck. Defense is what it is --- in big trouble...

According to the stats sheet, he gave away the puck once.

MoneyPuck.com

Real Time Hockey Win Probabilities In Game

moneypuck.com

McCabe and Klingberg are not a good pairing.

If I was going by one game's set of stats... the optimal pairings would be.

Rielly Brodie
McCabe Liljegren
Gio Klingberg

ame	TOI	On-Ice xGoals For	On-Ice xGoals Against	On-Ice Goals For	On-Ice Goals Against	On-Ice Shot Attempts For	On-Ice Shot Attempts Against	On-Ice Unblocked Shot Attempts For	On-Ice Unblocked Shot Attempts Against	On-Ice Shots On Goal For	On-Ice Shots On Goal Against	xGoals %	Corsi %	Fenwick %	Score Adjusted xGoals %	Score Adjusted Corsi %	Score Adjusted Fenwick %	Flurry Adjusted xGoals %	Score/Flurry Adjusted xGoals %	On-Ice xGoals For	On-Ice xGoals Against	On-Ice xGoals Differential
Rielly-Brodie	13:15	0.589	0.219	0	0	14	15	12	7	7	3	72.9%	48.3%	63.2%	70.2%	44.3%	60.4%	72.5%	69.8%	0.59	0.22	0.37
Mccabe-Klingberg	10:17	0.317	0.811	0	1	15	13	8	10	4	9	28.1%	53.6%	44.4%	26.2%	51.6%	42.8%	29.0%	27.0%	0.32	0.81	-0.49
Giordano-Liljegren	7:36	0.347	0.051	1	0	12	3	7	2	5	2	87.3%	80.0%	77.8%	86.1%	78.8%	76.4%	87.2%	86.0%	0.35	0.05	0.3
Giordano-Klingberg	3:07	0.306	0.217	0	0	8	2	5	1	1	1	58.5%	80.0%	83.3%	54.5%	76.0%	80.1%	58.3%	54.3%	0.31	0.22	0.09
Mccabe-Liljegren	2:46	0.269	0.077	0	0	4	5	4	3	3	2	77.6%	44.4%	57.1%	73.8%	37.9%	50.8%	78.5%	74.8%	0.27	0.08	0.19
Klingberg-Liljegren	1:34	0	0.045	0	0	0	2	0	1	0	1	0.0%	0.0%	0.0%	0.0%	0.0%	0.0%	0.0%	0.0%	0	0.05	-0.04
Mccabe-Giordano	1:33	0.24	0.047	0	0	2	2	2	1	2	1	83.5%	50.0%	66.7%	80.5%	44.5%	61.9%	83.5%	80.5%	0.24	0.05	0.19
Rielly-Klingberg	1:28	0	0.12	0	0	3	2	0	1	0	1	0.0%	60.0%	0.0%	0.0%	54.2%	0.0%	0.0%	0.0%	0	0.12	-0.12
Rielly-Giordano	1:25	0.012	0.098	0	1	2	1	1	1	1	1	10.6%	66.7%	50.0%	9.0%	61.5%	44.6%	10.6%	9.0%	0.01	0.1	-0.09
Rielly-Liljegren	1:20	0.533	0.056	0	0	3	2	3	1	2	1	90.5%	60.0%	75.0%	89.3%	57.6%	73.1%	90.2%	88.9%	0.53	0.06	0.48
Brodie-Liljegren	0:57	0	0.071	0	0	0	3	0	2	0	2	0.0%	0.0%	0.0%	0.0%	0.0%	0.0%	0.0%	0.0%	0	0.07	-0.07
Brodie-Giordano	0:47	0.044	0	0	0	2	0	1	0	1	0	100.0%	100.0%	100.0%	100.0%	100.0%	100.0%	100.0%	100.0%	0.04	0	0.04
Rielly-Mccabe	0:32	0	0

 

[shaner82]

Watch Vegas play then look at this team. Lots of fun to watch on most nights, but probably still not cup ready.

Mediocre goaltending, regressed D-core, shit depth and a forward group that is a lot worse at defence than the one we went into last playoffs with. And cap strapped for the next 2 seasons...

That's why I wanted to see Marner traded. We've tried and failed with this core. It isn't working. Adding a few mediocre pieces isn't going to change that. We needed much bigger change.

 

[mjd1001]

I'm really surprised there is such a push by so many on here to have Knies move up and be a bigger part of this team.

He looks good at times. He had some flashes in the playoffs last year, but I think people overestimate his progress at the moment. He might be a very good player, and many of us WISH he was right now, but I just don't always see it other than small flashes.

If management thinks he is good enough to make the team, great... They know more than me. So then I'd like to see him get more than 10 minutes per game. However, I don't think moving him up to the top line or giving him 17 to 18 minutes a game will make this team that much better.

I guess if you hit a two or three game losing streak you can give it a shot, I just think right now on a lower line with reduced minutes, it's probably best for his development and best for the team.

As much as we don't want a trade deadline veteran that you acquire for a third round draft pick to be on a higher line, or the journeyman to be plugged in and get more minutes than Knies, those guys have more NHL experience, so while they may not be as talented, they may actually be better for the team at the moment... Even if it's frustrating to watch them.

 

[Tufted Titmouse]

Do people really consider that a lacklustre effort?

I thought we played well, can't dominate every game.

 

[Fogelhund]

Do people really consider that a lacklustre effort?

I thought we played well, can't dominate every game.

It was a sloppy game from us.. just seemed to lack focus... at least until about 12 minutes left in the game, and then we came on pretty strong. We can't dominate every game, but against a bottom half team, it should be points on the board. On the balance, we should have won that game, but.. it didn't happen. No points for could have, would have, should have.

 

[34]

Do people really consider that a lacklustre effort?

I thought we played well, can't dominate every game.

Woll failed to make the saves that Chicago goaltender made.

 

[thusk]

Domi - struggling, does not look good thus far.

Marner - looks very bad

Klingberg - This guy just sucks. Bad signing.

Knies - overrated (bottom 6 player at best)

Minten - I like the kid but he is not ready.

Goaltending - piss poor (big issue)

D - below average

On a bright note, Nylander is establishing himself as one of the very best players in the league. Just so dominant. Matthews is gonna do Matthews, best goal scorer in the modern NHL.

Its 3 game, every team started to etablish their system, will take at least a 10-20 game for it. 7 new player whos trying to create chemistry, will taking time too

2 of 3 allowed was result of a bad line change, something who just gonna be better with time.

And i still think leafs need to split their core on 3 different line...Matthews/marner was not able to drive leafs offensive on 1st line, leafs struggling to generate offensive... always the same thing... wheb your 1st line dont score, you need your 2nd, 3rd and 4th and your D to make thing happening abd thats wqs an issue by the past on playoff

 

[Aashir Mallik]

Do people really consider that a lacklustre effort?

I thought we played well, can't dominate every game.

More than the offence, the defence was just no good

2 breakaway goals? One on the pk? That’s just not good enough. Woll also made a few very good saves that could’ve been in.
defence should be expected to be better than that

Even then we probably should get more than 1 goal. But defence was a glaring issue

 

[34]

Its 3 game, every team started to etablish their system, will take at least a 10-20 game for it. 7 new player whos trying to create chemistry, will taking time too

2 of 3 allowed was result of a bad line change, something who just gonna be better with time.

And i still think leafs need to split their core on 3 different line...Matthews/marner was not able to drive leafs offensive on 1st line, leafs struggling to generate offensive... always the same thing... wheb your 1st line dont score, you need your 2nd, 3rd and 4th and your D to make thing happening abd thats wqs an issue by the past on playoff

Do you think the goaltending and D are good? Enough to compete for a Cup.

 

[TheOne]

WILL DO
Ill have to watch it. Need a good list of movies to watch. Hip replacement next week so I'll be laid up for a few months..

Your fan base is identical to ours. Oilerville is on Meltdown now. Our defence is not looking to good to say the least

I'm actually a blackhawks fan. I like to follow all the teams boards and game threads. I usually don't comment because I don't want to be "that guy" who stirs the pot in other team's board. Like I followed the GDT for both EDM and VAN during those 2 games. I'm eyeing the Oilers right now, because with the hawks in a rebuild and with Bedard, I'm hoping our FO realizes that you have to actually build a team to support your stars and not follow in Chiarelli's footsteps. I'm sure you guys will figure it out, make some good trades this winter, and tear it TF up in the playoffs. I'd love to see McDrai hoist a cup.

Edit: good luck with your hip surgery! Hope it's completely successful and you have a speedy recovery!

 

[ACC1224]

Perry's goal isn't inattention, Marner saw him, was beside him and chose to go for the pick off instead of just covering him.

He's generally an excellent defensive player but that is one specific area he's really bad at. If he's in defensive position with the play in front of him he will almost always try to flag the puck down or pick off the pass instead just covering his man.

It's the same reason Marner and Matthew's have been a disaster at 3 on 3. Both of them try and stand up in the neutral zone to pick off passes instead of backing off leading to incredibly easy and wide open 2 on 1s for the opposition

It all happened so fast live and they never showed a replay. Seemed odd that Marner and Perry were so far behind the play. Where was the defense?

 

[leafan11]

Marner is carrying his play from the Panthers series into the start of the season.

 

[ACC1224]

Do people really consider that a lacklustre effort?

I thought we played well, can't dominate every game.

I know it's an excuse but all the fumbles and missed passes made me think the ice must have been horrible. Hopefully they find some money in that renovation budget to fix that.

 

[Gallagbi]

I know it's an excuse but all the fumbles and missed passes made me think the ice must have been horrible. Hopefully they find some money in that renovation budget to fix that.

I dont think its money, its volume from what ive heard. Just too much going on

 

[thusk]

More than the offence, the defence was just no good

2 breakaway goals? One on the pk? That’s just not good enough. Woll also made a few very good saves that could’ve been in.
defence should be expected to be better than that

Even then we probably should get more than 1 goal. But defence was a glaring issue

Perry breakway result of a bad change i dont know whos gone on bench for marner

Pp goal was result of bad change whos forcing klinberg to step late in the ice and had no choiolce to hook... it was not about defensive but about concentration and judgement

Do you think the goaltending and D are good? Enough to compete for a Cup.

D is about 5 player, its about your system and better your playing the right way and protecting your goalie and bettet your goalie will be...

1-I dont think goalie was really an issue on that one...2- to feel confortable goalie need to have playblike 6 to 10 game...woll played 2 game and half, Samsonov like5 or 6 game? so again we can just relax

 

[Budz]

Gonna lose games. Not going to win 82.

The team has to become a team - it takes time. The GM will need a little time to shape the team. I’m not going to over react to a nothing game.

I still believe the Top 9 is not aligned correctly. Leaving Minten with another rookie and a new player is a fail.

Need a lines reset.

 

[ACC1224]

I dont think its money, its volume from what ive heard. Just too much going on

I meant money to be used to have ice that can handle the building volume.

 

[Fogelhund]

Woll failed to make the saves that Chicago goaltender made.

I thought Woll had a pretty good game overall, and made some great saves. Two goals where he was one on one with the shooter.. Perry's breakaway, and Johnson getting in behind the defenders too, McCabe letting his man get by him, and then McCabe screened him on the first goal. No way Woll can see this, and it's off the post and in... If you are going to block, you better get it done, and not completely screen your own goalie.

""

 

[thewave]

Better question is why do we have a coach learning on the job?

Its not even learning. Usually to learn something like this you need to apprentice. He just jumped from AHL to NHL and peter principle fell flat on his face come POs every time and the execs just left him there.

Its kinda crazy stupid if you think about it.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

Seems like an act, just ignore it.

It takes me a good 30-45 minutes to write one of my comments.

I average about two a day. I've been doing it for years and enjoy it. I have fun but it's definitely not an act.

I wish more people were as emotionally invested in this team as I am.

I tell everyone all the time if they don't like my comments to just put me on ignore. Taking the time to write these comments is on me. Taking the time to read them is on you.

At this point if you haven't muted yet I can only assume you enjoy reading my comments every day.

 

[AcerComputer]

Nonsense !!! This team, with this core 4, has continually lost games to teams they should easily beat on a regular basis THROUGHOUT the entire season for 7 or 8 years.

They lost to the Panthers in the 2nd round of the playoffs last season. Was that because it was too close to being their first 10 games of the playoffs too ??? As well, the Panthers just barely made the playoffs, unlike our Leafs that easily qualified.

The core 4 take games off too much, and it sure doesn't help them go farther in the playoffs either.

Unfortunately, lesser skilled teams come to Toronto and play above their capabilities purely because they are in Toronto to play our Leafs. This means our Leafs, especially the core 4, have to work harder every game at home.

HARD WORK beats skill when skill doesn't WORK HARD !!! IMHO, we need MORE consistent hard work from our core 4.

It's game 3 and the sky is falling for you. Trade everyone right? Leafs played worse in the first game against MTL, but it's all forgotten because they won. Too many results oriented fans on here. I will evaluate this team starting with game 11, as there is nothing to learn watching the first 10 games.

 

[EbonyRaptor]

And our rookies have not scored or dominated. Not that they haven't played well, but our d over all is terrible.

Yeah, you guys are in a bit of a tough spot on the back end. Klingberg has never been good defensively, Giordano is older than dirt, there's no one in the pipeline ready to be thrown into the deep end of a Cup contending team and you cap situation ain't good.

I know the "word on the street" is Nylander will eventually get traded rather than lose him to UFA after the season - but he was arguably your best player last night so that's not something to hoped for.

 

[hullsy47]

Domi does not look like himself. He is great at carrying the puck in and last night had a lane but just dumped it in. Not sure whether nerves or trying to fit in a coaching system that is not fit to him.

That's why u got him for 3 mill.and he's played on like 5 teams