Ryan Johansen Saga III

[CBJWerenski8]

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=462293

REPORT: BLUE JACKETS RFA JOHANSEN TO RECEIVE KHL OFFER

An important quote from that article:

Johansen and Overhardt tabled a two-year contract on Thursday to the Blue Jackets, which was received warmly according to TSN Hockey Insider Darren Dreger.

Seems like they might be inching toward each other.

 

[DJA]

An important quote from that article:



Seems like they might be inching toward each other.

I think that was a typo and meant to say the offer WASN'T warmly received, based on this other article:

One day after leaving Columbus amid a contract dispute, the agent for Blue Jackets forward Ryan Johansen has tabled another two-year contract offer.

According to TSN Hockey Insider Darren Dreger, it doesn't appear the offer was warmly received by the team.

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/teams/story/?id=462106&hubname=nhl-blue_jackets

 

[CBJWerenski8]

I think that was a typo and meant to say the offer WASN'T warmly received, based on this other article:



http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/teams/story/?id=462106&hubname=nhl-blue_jackets

Damn, good catch.

 

[Sore Loser]

Interesting facts:

Kurt Overhardt's son Alex is a 17 year old rookie forward who just scored his first WHL point (an assist) with Johansen's former Portland Winterhawks. This coming season Alex will be a teammate of current CBJ prospect Oliver Bjorkstrand, and is a fairly well regarded prospect for this summer's NHL draft.

The ties to Overhardt, the Jackets, and the Winterhawks are almost like a bad episode of The Twilight Zone...

 

[major major]

If Overhardt has tabled an offer < $5m, now its the Jackets turn to move up some. $3m is too low.

 

[Wendy Clear]

If Overhardt has tabled an offer < $5m, now its the Jackets turn to move up some. $3m is too low.

I agree. It was probably like $4.9m, but still, the Jackets need to make it $3.5m, KO will come back with like $4.3m, and then they should finally settle in the region of $3.7-3.9m, what he's worth.

 

[Wendy Clear]

Another funny thing I've noticed. The pro-overpaying people are the same guys who always reference "good" franchises and infer how they want the Jackets to develop into this.

Well, top franchises don't overpay a player based on his standing with the team. Just because RyJo might be "the Stamkos of Columbus" (best player, goal-scoring center, can't replace) he's not actually Stamkos and therefore not worth Stamkos money.

They do need him, but they can't, shouldn't and won't negotiate like they're nothing without him.

 

[WannabeFinn]

So if Overhardt/Joey did in fact submit an offer below 5m AAV and the CBJ budge a bit and agree on, let's say, 4m AAV.. are JD/JK looked upon as weak for moving up from their 3m offer or genius for lowering his asking price so significantly and so quickly

 

[Cyclones Rock]

The problem with this viewpoint, if I am understanding you properly, is that you are looking at one factor (money) of a comparable contract without taking into account the others (mainly term). On a 6I agree that Skinner is a good comparable player, but you can't just say that means Joey is worth $5m and some change per year on a 2 year contract.6 year deal? Yea, and what CBJ offered on a longer term isn't too far off that if I recall. But based on the facts that many have laid out here and all over the Internet, the CBA doesn't work that way. Would Skinner have gotten $5m+ on a two year deal? Based on the facts given here, unlikely. So, again assuming I am understanding what you are saying, JD/JK should throw out the CBA and past comparable contracts?

I've viewed the Skinner comp as a comp on both $ and term.

Obviously a bridge deal would be lower.

People seem to forget Bobrovski's 2 year/$11 million bridge deal.

$5 million per year on bridge is hardly unprecedented

I still can't believe that this management is so obtuse that they won't sign this kid long term. I'd say send in the clowns, but they're already here. The only thing missing from Jarmo and JD is the face paint.

 

[EDM]

Couple of things.

First, if and that is a big if, Joey has finally moved below $5 million, I do hope the Jackets eventually makes some move, whether it is $3.25 of $3.5. A contract between $3.5 million and $4 million would be accepted by the fans as reasonable.

Second, I would be flabbergasted if JK and JD feel their hands are tied by their $3 million offer. They know they have some room to move.

Third, as I suggested earlier, JD's "outburst", really was not an outburst at all but a forcefully driven line in the sand. They may truly now believe that Joey has to crawl across broken glass to get a deal done.

Fourth, in handling this the FO may see this as the time to draw a clear line for all future negotiations withJoey, Rychel or whoever and get it established that no one misses training camp without a cost to their actions.

Fifth, if Joey chooses to go to Russia it would be the biggest mistake of his life. Russia is a horrible place to live for Russians, much less Canadians. It is dangerous and without a doubt it would be the worst year of his life.

Sixth, if Joey has in fact lowered his demand below $5 million so quickly while the Jackets have not budged, it shows who has the real leverage now.

 

[Wendy Clear]

People seem to forget Bobrovski's 2 year/$11 million bridge deal.

Bob had proven more. And the comps are much muddier for goalies. Apples and oranges. Heck, apples and pineapples.

The only thing missing from Jarmo and JD is the face paint.

Ever wonder why you're so alone in this? Why 98% of the fans, all the talking heads, smart and otherwise, are supporting the Jackets?

Well, you do have Zherdev...

 

[BF3]

I think the notion that the public comments by JD have tied CBJHO to the $3 mil number are *********. If Overhardt offers are good counter-offer, something that they can actually negotiate with in good faith, they will come up to $3.75-4 AAV mil to get this done. The idea that CBJFO can't negotiate now because they "set a hard number" is crazy.

At this point, it's going to be 2 years, $3.75-$4 mil AAV, we just need RyJo's agent and JD to realize this. I think Jarmo has an acceptable number in mind.

 

[KallioWeHardlyKnewYe]

Awww crap. Now even our talented Canadians are selfish, greedy Russians. That's so Blue Jackets.

 

[Jackets16]

I agree. It was probably like $4.9m, but still, the Jackets need to make it $3.5m, KO will come back with like $4.3m, and then they should finally settle in the region of $3.7-3.9m, what he's worth.

That is if you actually believe the rumor. I don't based on who it is from. I don't believe anything that guy says (types).

 

[Jackets16]

Second, I would be flabbergasted if JK and JD feel their hands are tied by their $3 million offer. They know they have some room to move.

Sixth, if Joey has in fact lowered his demand below $5 million so quickly while the Jackets have not budged, it shows who has the real leverage now.

If true, #6 is because of #2 if you ask me.

 

[Jackets16]

So if Overhardt/Joey did in fact submit an offer below 5m AAV and the CBJ budge a bit and agree on, let's say, 4m AAV.. are JD/JK looked upon as weak for moving up from their 3m offer or genius for lowering his asking price so significantly and so quickly

Genius. Like I said in another post, IF Johansen and his agent lowered their numer so much, so quick, it i probably because of what Jarmo and JD said. They realized they better get realistic and quick or Ryan likely wouldn't be playing in the NHL this year.

 

[DJA]

Portzline says the offer wasn't less than $5 million.

Overhardt last offer -- extended to the club and summarily rejected on Thursday -- was believed to be a two-year, $12 million offer. There have been no further talks.

http://bluejacketsxtra.dispatch.com...kers/2014/09/tsn-johansen-has-khl-offers.html

 

[Jackets16]

Portzline says the offer wasn't less than $5 million.



http://bluejacketsxtra.dispatch.com...kers/2014/09/tsn-johansen-has-khl-offers.html

If that is the case, they either offered what they have been or they were offering more than we thought before.

 

[EspenK]

Awww crap. Now even our talented Canadians are selfish, greedy Russians. That's so Blue Jackets.

 

[Tulipunaruusu*]

Fifth, if Joey chooses to go to Russia it would be the biggest mistake of his life. Russia is a horrible place to live for Russians, much less Canadians. It is dangerous and without a doubt it would be the worst year of his life.

Ilari Melart actually said that Siberia isn't the same as America where you have suburbs that are rather uninviting for a walk. Even during daytime.

For Johansen KHL would likely be huge culture shock and with the Russia-Ukraine conflict unsolved I don't think they can really entertain that thought as an option to personal holdout.

 

[EspenK]

Regarding Brooks' article about the sub-5 mill offer being proposed I asked on the Rangers board how reliable his "reports" usually are.
FWIW here's the only response so far:

He's usually pretty good this sort of stuff. It's when he tries to write analysis that he goes off the rails.

 

[pete goegan]

If Overhardt has tabled an offer < $5m, now its the Jackets turn to move up some. $3m is too low.

As an OT aside, I think it's interesting that the term "tabled" has exactly opposite meanings in American and British parliamentarianism - here it means "put aside" or ''removed from consideration." In their system, it mean, literally, "brought to the table for consideration."

OK, carry on.

 

[CBJfan4evr]

So if Overhardt/Joey did in fact submit an offer below 5m AAV and the CBJ budge a bit and agree on, let's say, 4m AAV.. are JD/JK looked upon as weak for moving up from their 3m offer or genius for lowering his asking price so significantly and so quickly

The problem I see developing here is that if they do up the offer to 4m or above they've got to face their fellow GM peers. Moving up into this range sets precedent for future bridge contracts and costs all the GM's around the league more money. They might not be the most popular guys on the block in that situation. Shaping up to be a league wide issue and not just a Jackets issue. We all know after this situation that others coming out of entry level deals are going to push for more money. The question is who will cave. Is there a problem in being the first? After this fiasco this will be a hot topic for the next CBA.

 

[Durkin67]

Leaf fan here...

with all respect, if my team had a budding young star balking at the very reasonable offers being made, and countering with what appears to be unreasonable demands, at some point I would be questioning if said player was really looking to stay with the club or if he was forcing the teams' hand by making a trade the only option.Its normal for the player to let the agent wear the villain hat if he's really looking for a change of address.

Kessel wanted out of Boston when he was n the same situation as RJ. He and his agent were equally obstinate.

At what point do Blue Jackets fans contemplate whether it is time to move away from RJ and focus on the possible compensation?

 

[blahblah]

At what point do Blue Jackets fans contemplate whether it is time to move away from RJ and focus on the possible compensation?

Thanks for asking us if we were smart enough to consider the nuclear option. Having said that I don't think we're there yet.