RW Matvei Michkov (2023, 7th, PHI) Part 4

[bert]

He's an average skater in terms of power and speed. His shot is good, but not like Bedard in terms of velocity and release, who looks like Joe Sakic on steroids. He is not strong. He is not a flashy stickandling or dangling wizard. Nothing about his game is overpowering or eye popping. What is his x-factor??

Whats Kucherov's X factor?

 

[Sasso09]

Can't it be both?

I mean, clearly, I'm a "troll" because of relatively minor disagreement about a prospect's playmaking prowess.

And two just goes without saying really...I'm the dumbest guy you know.

This isn't minor. You're focused on the one thing that's universally agreed upon. What makes Michkov the prospect is, is his generational IQ, everyone sees it but you apparently.

His tools aren't nearly as impressive at other top prospects, if his IQ wasn't elite he wouldn't be as successful as he's been. I don't want to call you dumb because clearly you put him into what you're doing and I've read some stuff you've said before that was very well thought out..I just don't understand your thought process on this Michkov IQ thing...

Like a previous comment asked of you, please list the prospects and current players you think have higher IQ. If Demidov is on that list then all my questions will be answered

From my viewings of him in the KHL and his early preseason games, he did not play the game the same way. Like you said, his shooting rates in the KHL were high in Sochi, but if you watched the rookie game, his preseason games versus the capitals, Islanders and the game where he scored 2 goals vs Boston, most of the offense that he created were setting up his teammates for good scoring chances.

Perhaps in Sochi he realized he was the biggest threat thus the skewed shooting. Almost every scout I listened to actually commented that there is a great playmaker hidden in Michkov, which at the time I was skeptical due to his statistics.

But the eye test at least from his early games, if you did not know who Michkov was and his track record, people would say he was primarily a playmaking winger and he really excelled at it. The philly powerplay looked completely different when he was on the ice. It looked like an actual NHL powerplay.

If you could take a deeper look at those 3 games, and evaluate, would be nice. Some philly fans even wanted him to shoot more before his 2 goal performance , because he barely shot the puck in the preseason. In 4 games, he has recorded 8 SOG. Cutter Gauthier had 12 SOG in one game, a renowned aggressive shooter.

Could be the case of rookie deferring to vets, but anyhow, I came away thinking, if he plays like this, it looks like 30-50 player in terms of goals/assist ratio.

Also, how do you explain his record setting points in every league/tourney he has played in?

He's an average skater in terms of power and speed. His shot is good, but not like Bedard in terms of velocity and release, who looks like Joe Sakic on steroids. He is not strong. He is not a flashy stickandling or dangling wizard. Nothing about his game is overpowering or eye popping. What is his x-factor??

Definitely average skater in terms of power and speed, excellent edge work and mechanics though.

His shot is pretty elite, no one has a shot like Bedard so that's unfair

His stick handling is excellent and he for sure is a wizard

He is very strong on the puck

But your point still stands, his IQ is his best attribute

 

[Siludin]

Whats Kucherov's X factor?

10

 

[SaSaShi]

Whats Kucherov's X factor?

intelligence

 

[majormajor]

Michkov isn’t real, a primary assist, on shot purposely to let Konecny get a tap in rebound hahaha, good god.

He had no play there other than firing it on net and hoping for a rebound. That's what most guys would do. You think it's unreal?

This kid does enough special stuff, we don't need to start fellating him over routine plays.

 

[Fatass]

intelligence

Exactly! Same as Michkov. The greatest players, all Cup winners, have beyond elite smarts.

 

[bert]

intelligence

Hmmm.... His puck control vision and shot are wild but yes thats it. Similar traits for these two players? Not saying Michkov is Kucherov but maybe kucherov light?

 

[Garbageyuk]

He had no play there other than firing it on net and hoping for a rebound. That's what most guys would do. You think it's unreal?

This kid does enough special stuff, we don't need to start fellating him over routine plays.

Lol, that’s been going on for months. You’re late to the party

 

[MTL Dirty Birdy]

How many times out of 10 should a player with an above average shot score with this much net in the clip I just posted?


Agreed, but Bedard is undoubtedly in another tier

Bédard shouldn’t have even won the Calder. Fabre got robbed.

 

[Michael Farkas]

This isn't minor. You're focused on the one thing that's universally agreed upon. What makes Michkov the prospect is, is his generational IQ, everyone sees it but you apparently.

His tools aren't nearly as impressive at other top prospects, if his IQ wasn't elite he wouldn't be as successful as he's been. I don't want to call you dumb because clearly you put him into what you're doing and I've read some stuff you've said before that was very well thought out..I just don't understand your thought process on this Michkov IQ thing...

Like a previous comment asked of you, please list the prospects and current players you think have higher IQ. If Demidov is on that list then all my questions will be answered

Ok, so I'm no longer a troll or a dunce? That was quick haha

Anyhow...I'm still not sure what this buzzword "generational IQ" is ("you wouldn't!") but the whole "everyone sees it but (me)" thing is an odd claim...

HockeyProspect, Hockey Sense = 7 (of 9)
"To start, Michkov’s playmaking isn’t at the same level as some of the other top end prospects in this class."

...
"
He’s a gifted shooter but we wouldn’t label him a dynamic or even exceptional playmaker. He struggles to recognize weakside options or the highest percentage option in transition when comparing him to the other star players available, and his leading passes and overall passing trajectory leave him on the outside looking in compared to the high-end playmakers in this class."

(For the record, I did not write that in full or in part)

--

EliteProspects, Hockey Sense = 8, Passing = 7
Sportsnet, Hockey Sense = 7 (of 10) [they also called his explosivity an 8/10, so nevermind]
THN: " He was playing hero hockey and ignoring open passing opportunities and finding himself in bad spots. "

Team scouts gushed about his shot and scoring ability much more than his playmaking. One told me, (paraphrasing) "Kucherov, except Kucherov is a passer" - but he liked Michkov a lot, of course.

It's the "generational IQ" thing that's unique, right? And I'm not looking for anyone to strive for consensus. Consensus is for losers, so I don't say that to try to ad populum you into anything...but in exchange, I don't need to be handed that "everyone but you has always said, he's a boy genius!"

I'm not going to list every player and prospect that has a higher IQ...I listed quite a few back when I was asked.

I'm not sure what the beef is with Demidov in this thread? I guess there's a pissing match of sorts? I made a video for Demidov a couple months ago. I like him a lot...that might renew the application on my cone-shaped cap though...

Look, I'm not here to change your mind. I'll have the conversation if there's a conversation to be had...but my desire to try to trade "internet gotchas" is pretty fleeting haha

 

[SaSaShi]

Yeah, just stop talking. It's clear you're not watching anything


Lol.... he's been downright DOMINANT in all but the last one, where he still had a nice assist.

Just stop

are you a closet flyers fan? and using the blackhawks profile pic as a defense mechanism response to the pain from the traumas?? There is some South Philly anger in your post here....

Hmmm.... His puck control vision and shot are wild but yes thats it. Similar traits for these two players? Not saying Michkov is Kucherov but maybe kucherov light?

hopefully one day Kucherov becomes Michkov-lite...... zinggg.

Let us have something Dear Hockey Gods.

 

[HeadLiceHatty]

He had no play there other than firing it on net and hoping for a rebound. That's what most guys would do. You think it's unreal?

This kid does enough special stuff, we don't need to start fellating him over routine plays.

You’re absolutely silly if you think that wasn’t on purpose look at the celebration it even made Konecny laugh, stay triggered. Lmao, it’s unbelievable how upset some posters are about praising a 19 year old in his own thread, some of you guys are certainly without a doubt living your best lives.

 

[majormajor]

You’re absolutely silly if you think that wasn’t on purpose look at the celebration it even made Konecny laugh, stay triggered. Lmao, it’s unbelievable how upset some posters are about praising a 19 year old in his own thread, some of you guys are certainly without a doubt living your best lives.

I didn't say it wasn't on purpose. Read better. I'm saying it probably was on purpose and shooting for a rebound is a commonplace thing to do in hockey. And in that exact situation even depth NHLers would have tried the same play.

 

[Guadana]

Give me York and Sanheim over Mateychuk or Hutson all day every day.. York and Sanheim are for sure better than both and I doubt either of them at any point end up better than York.

I fail to see how Montreal or CBJ have a better core. Buffalo, for sure, Ottawa? Probably.

Michkov
Konecny
Tippett
Frost
Foerster
Farabee
Luchanko
Brink
York
Sanheim
Drysdale
Bonk
6 picks in the top 40 of the 25' draft

VS

Suzuki
Slafkovsky
Demidov
Caufield
Dach
Hage
Laine
Roy
Newhook
Hutson
Reinbacher
Guhle
Mailloux
Baron
Struble

That's easy money for Philly

Why? They are not as dynamic. May be better defensively but you don't know how Mateychuk and Hutson will develop their defensive game. Even if they don't, they still can be more dynamic players. Defensive part can be resolved by Jiricek, Guhle, Scozil, Reinbacher etc.
Flyers just don't have this depth of talent.

Jackets and mtl have better core. Mtl have great core. Even with historically dumb decision on the 2023 draft their offensive core is great. Much greater than what flyers have. Demidov has potential to be 75-95 points player or even better. Slaf has potential to be ppg player or even better, Caufield, Hage and Suzuki have their own good potential for development.
Guys like Tippet, Farabee, Frost, Koneckny are good, just isn't there. They are more ready product with lower ceiling and space for development. Its just how it looks from the outside.
Flyers don't have players of Fantilli and Lindstrom profile. Both are dynamic and big centers who are playing on the edge. Supporting cast may be isn't great but its okay, they have guys like Marchenko, Chinakhov etc who can easily play complimentary role with good center and produce 40-50 or may be even more points. I don't like Johnson but still he has enough offensive potential to be better player with good center in the team with better depth.

Thats easy loose for Philly. May be not this season, but on the long term perspective and may be even right this season there are much more potential for mtl squad. Im not a mtl fan at all btw. And I'm very sympathazing to Michkov and flyers. But center depth is not good, centers perspective isn't good for now. Defense isn't there. I like Sanheim, not a big fan of York at all(as I'm not a fan of Hutson), but defensive core of MTL is just bigger, have all the pieces. Flyers should work and work hard. Wingers depth is good enough but still mtl have enough, overall east is full of talented players, its a very hard future ride for flyers, for now their real perspective is to playing and fighting for 7-8 spots and losing it fast because teams with better depth will block Michkov's line and will eat other squad.

 

[Sacha BOXviert]

Yeah, I think the thing that I'm not communicating very well is that I don't think he's a shoot-at-all-costs player like, say, Cole Eiserman. I think Michov prefers to shoot, but he's a capable passer. My thing is that I don't find that to be a conceptionally or technically elite part of his game and I haven't since I've been watching him. Good? Totally. Productive at the NHL level? Certainly should be. Enough to be considered a high-end assist man or meaningfully exceed his goal total? I'd be surprised if that was consistently the case. You mentioned 30/50, that second number is a little too rich for my blood. That said, team tactics factor into that - what his role is on the power play, etc.

It felt like he was a little bit deferential from what I saw. Obvious comment: I think he's just adjusting to how this league functions, the speed of it, the angles of back pressure, etc. He's a good (or better) passer into adjacent layers and lanes, if you provide him those options, he'll take them...especially to set up give n go situations where he pulls the trigger. I think we'll see that early in the regular season.

He's really ****** good at hockey haha

I think this sort of undersells him a bit overall, but I get it where you're coming from.

I have a sneaking suspicion this is gonna be like the time I was writing for the Dallas Stars and I fought tooth and nail to not have Fabian Brunnstrom as a top-3 prospect in the organization even though it was like a Publisher's Clearinghouse win for Dallas and I said, "I don't know about this guy...I don't think it's really gonna work out that well." Hat trick first game.

Michkov is gonna start out 1+12 this year after this haha

Capable passer. Im done

---

 

[DuklaNation]

Yeah, just stop talking. It's clear you're not watching anything


Lol.... he's been downright DOMINANT in all but the last one, where he still had a nice assist.

Just stop

Michkov is undersized, against full NHL lineups, it will show up more. Time and space are everything. It's clear you don't understand why some prospects can struggle. Dominant? WTF.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

I'm surprised this kid has so many detractors , do we not love hockey? Its very strange , he is very special

 

[Frank Drebin]

Should be an interesting season.

 

[AD1066]

It's strange seeing his IQ called into question or his passing labeled as merely "capable".

None of his other traits are elite or can explain his success at every level of the sport.

 

[Acallabeth]

He had no play there other than firing it on net and hoping for a rebound. That's what most guys would do. You think it's unreal?

This kid does enough special stuff, we don't need to start fellating him over routine plays.

That's true. That the smartest plays are nearly always not the flashiest ones is also true.

World class players most often do the same stuff as average players, tweaking it just a bit for the play to work better. Most great plays are quite subtle, there are very few highlight-reel style players who make a spectacular use of their skills.

 

[SaSaShi]

I'm surprised this kid has so many detractors , do we not love hockey? Its very strange , he is very special

It's only natural. When Crosby came out I was guilty of the same thing. Overrated, crybaby, ref's favorite, just a glorified grinder.

Slowly the envy, hate and jealousy turned into respect after some years. Now I enjoy watching him immensely and wish him a long career. Btw I'm not saying Michkov is crosby level. Just similar thought process.

But at the beginning it was pure hate on a player that the Flyers had no chance of drafting. Now imagine the Michkov situation. For 3 years michkov was touted as the Russian Bedard, same skill level, even outperformed him in same tourney.

Imagine the level of hate/jealousy of some team's fans that actually had the chance to draft Michkov, not only draft but fell to their laps but chose otherwise by what most people rate is a vastly inferior player.

It's completely understandable. But if Michkov hits, the hate will slowly turn into respect, and finally into adulation. Time heals all wounds.

 

[Garbageyuk]

When Crosby came out I was guilty of the same thing. Overrated, crybaby, ref's favorite, just a glorified grinder.

Lol, you might’ve been the only one. If I’d ever thought something that dumb, I’d never admit it lmao.

 

[SaSaShi]

Lol, you might’ve been the only one. If I’d ever thought something that dumb, I’d never admit it lmao.

Thing is I never believed any of those things I said. I knew 87 was amazing. It was the jealousy and envy.

 

[HeadLiceHatty]

I didn't say it wasn't on purpose. Read better. I'm saying it probably was on purpose and shooting for a rebound is a commonplace thing to do in hockey. And in that exact situation even depth NHLers would have tried the same play.

Type better, or get critiqued, your post lacked clarity and your point if that’s what you really meant. If depth players could do that purposely then they would be on most teams top lines and PP1, you’re grasping at straws.

 

[HeadLiceHatty]

Michkov is undersized, against full NHL lineups, it will show up more. Time and space are everything. It's clear you don't understand why some prospects can struggle. Dominant? WTF.

This is utterly hilarious, it’s clear you haven’t watched him play guy has been dominant in 1 on 1 puck battles and has been playing against grown men since he was 16 hahahaha. Keep wishing and praying.