Maybe I'm a fool for thinking they might figure it out, but I'm not going to pretend like there is no chance this team contends for a Cup in the near future.
News Article: Rutherford and Johnston are staying. Both of them.
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Maybe I'm a fool for thinking they might figure it out, but I'm not going to pretend like there is no chance this team contends for a Cup in the near future.
It all depends. If we're willing to cut the deadweight, make the necessary moves to land top flight talent for Sid and Geno, and we start to make a Hell of a lot more intelligent decisions in the draft/free agency, sure.
But that's a lot of ifs considering this team's track record of stubborn, spiteful incompetence.
SHOOTANDSCORE
Eeny Meeny Miny Moe
- Sep 25, 2005
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I'm not even on "team Babcock" and I find this maddening. This right here is why we aren't going to sniff a Cup in a good while.
Bennett Brauer
Registered User
It's changing though and changing for the better. That's why I question why people want to get rid of Rutherford and Johnston so much. Clearly ownership agrees with you about being a poorly run organization. That's why the GM and Coach were fired. Rutherford wasn't going to come in and fix all of Shero's mistakes in one offseason, hell he ended up making a couple of his own but when I look at the bigger picture, in my eyes, the organization is headed in the right direction.
You mention how we're *****ing about wingers for Crosby and Malkin. Obviously Shero brought them in, they just didn't stay, I'm talking guys like Hossa and Iginla. He brought in Neal who is now Hornqvist thanks to JR, which was a solid move. Then there's David Perron and drafting Kasperi Kapanen. In one year, Rutherford improved that area a great deal.
I don't disagree about the asset management, but a lot of that was Ray Shero and very little of it was Jim Rutherford. Hell bent on being old, slow and soft, again, is mostly on Shero. I don't expect Scuderi to stay, and while we traded youth for experience in Despres for Lovejoy, that was the only move JR made where we sacrificed youth for a veteran (unless you include the Winnik deal which I don't because picks aren't even made yet and Sill wasn't going to amount to anything here).
Other than those two trades, every move JR made was to make us younger, and with him openly admitting fault for the Despres trade, I'm not worried about any more trades like that. He will continue to make us younger and faster, I truly believe that. Think I'm crazy all you want, but that's what I see.
http://www.tsn.ca/video/dreger-on-babcock-s-timeline-to-find-new-team-1.278202
There is a mention of Pittsburgh towards the end.
There is a mention of Pittsburgh towards the end.
Shaftception
Registered User
- Apr 6, 2011
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Seriously? They're going to magically not suck next year because lovey dovey super positive homerism? Jesus christ is this r/penguins?
Here's a prediction and quote it when it comes true 12 months from now, hint it's no different then what was said 12, 6, 3, 2 or 1 month(s) ago. They have no forward talent in the pipeline, no assets to acquire said talent that won't take away equal talent from what they already have and said talent already here is old, slowing down or constantly injured. They're going to eventually lose early in the playoffs or not even make them. Their junior dimwit coach's (who they're keeping in favor of not even trying to court a vastly superior one simply to not hurt feelings) system will fail once again, sucking all offense out of the team because it relies on skilled players in key positions to even work. Which is all well in good in fantasy land, too bad here in reality said players filling those roles on this team are consistently and annually injured with serious (letang) or nagging minor injuries (malkin, seriously his conditioning is pathetic, I'd take 100 fat ovechkin's over malkin's scrawny ass who can't play 70 games let alone 82 without suffering some knee, ankle, shoulder, elbow, name a body part injury every single year).
So when the exact same excuses are used next year to excuse the slow, old, same oft injured roster and dumbass zero, I mean one year of experience coach with whichever gm chooses to take responsibility this time around, just remember not everyone was oblivious to what anybody with a functioning brain could see coming a mile away.
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Darth Vitale
Dark Matter
I can vouch for this -- it's 100% true. The Blackhawks wouldn't have won a single Cup under Bill Wirtz's leadership, let alone multiple. His son (thankfully) "gets it" and knew what was wrong with his Dad's BS approach to hockey ownership, fixed everything in the span of about 2 seasons and now they're a model franchise pretty much. Their fans deserve it. The other Wirtz treated them like absolute CRAP. For years and years. He was a greedy POS as an owner, and I don't care if he's dead / it's considered tabboo -- he can roll all he wants. The guy had Burkle money and then some but... awe **** it. I won't go into it. Suffice it to say he makes our owners look like Santa Clause. So it definitely COULD be worse, I guess is one silver lining you could take.
Yep. Except that one series of events that led to the summer sell-off after the first Cup, they've managed things really well.
66-30-33
Registered User
M0NTY26
Force from Ma'gorsk
- Feb 27, 2010
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The best part of this video is Button eating and then Hayes and O'Neill just look at him like wtf are you doing man.
M0NTY26
Force from Ma'gorsk
- Feb 27, 2010
- 4,789
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Seriously? They're going to magically not suck next year because lovey dovey super positive homerism? Jesus christ is this r/penguins?
Here's a prediction and quote it when it comes true 12 months from now, hint it's no different then what was said 12, 6, 3, 2 or 1 month(s) ago. They have no forward talent in the pipeline, no assets to acquire said talent that won't take away equal talent from what they already have and said talent already here is old, slowing down or constantly injured. They're going to eventually lose early in the playoffs or not even make them. Their junior dimwit coach's (who they're keeping in favor of not even trying to court a vastly superior one simply to not hurt feelings) system will fail once again, sucking all offense out of the team because it relies on skilled players in key positions to even work. Which is all well in good in fantasy land, too bad here in reality said players filling those roles on this team are consistently and annually injured with serious (letang) or nagging minor injuries (malkin, seriously his conditioning is pathetic, I'd take 100 fat ovechkin's over malkin's scrawny ass who can't play 70 games let alone 82 without suffering some knee, ankle, shoulder, elbow, name a body part injury every single year).
So when the exact same excuses are used next year to excuse the slow, old, same oft injured roster and dumbass zero, I mean one year of experience coach with whichever gm chooses to take responsibility this time around, just remember not everyone was oblivious to what anybody with a functioning brain could see coming a mile away.
Isn't 5 games in the first round early? So, what's with "eventually"? They just did!
Bennett Brauer
Registered User
Seriously? They're going to magically not suck next year because lovey dovey super positive homerism? Jesus christ is this r/penguins?
Here's a prediction and quote it when it comes true 12 months from now, hint it's no different then what was said 12, 6, 3, 2 or 1 month(s) ago. They have no forward talent in the pipeline, no assets to acquire said talent that won't take away equal talent from what they already have and said talent already here is old, slowing down or constantly injured. They're going to eventually lose early in the playoffs or not even make them. Their junior dimwit coach's (who they're keeping in favor of not even trying to court a vastly superior one simply to not hurt feelings) system will fail once again, sucking all offense out of the team because it relies on skilled players in key positions to even work. Which is all well in good in fantasy land, too bad here in reality said players filling those roles on this team are consistently and annually injured with serious (letang) or nagging minor injuries (malkin, seriously his conditioning is pathetic, I'd take 100 fat ovechkin's over malkin's scrawny ass who can't play 70 games let alone 82 without suffering some knee, ankle, shoulder, elbow, name a body part injury every single year).
So when the exact same excuses are used next year to excuse the slow, old, same oft injured roster and dumbass zero, I mean one year of experience coach with whichever gm chooses to take responsibility this time around, just remember not everyone was oblivious to what anybody with a functioning brain could see coming a mile away.
No I don't think they even suck to begin with. There is no magic involved, I think we would have been a great team if we were fully healthy, it's not an excuse, it's a probability. We will get rid of some of our aging players, they'll add younger players to the lineup and I'm hoping they can stay healthy with Gary Roberts overseeing our training habits.
I disagree about not having any forward talent In the pipeline. We're not rich but I consider Kapanen and Sundqvist good forward prospects and have others who can contribute. Just have to wait and see. This "junior dimwit coach" is actually very respected in the hockey community. He has coached and had success at most levels, he was an NHL assistant twice before being a junior coach and GM who led his team to multiple WHL titles and Memorial Cup appearances, received high praise from Gretzky himself, but you're right, he's a total dud. We need Mike Babcock, someone who Dan Bylsma is a product of, who is 3-5 in Game 7's, who has had less playoff success recently than Dan Bylsma. Not too long ago, he had a 3-1 series lead against Chicago, his teams biggest rival. The Hawks forced Game 7 and won (sound familiar? Last year vs the Rags perhaps?) all Babcock had to say was "Game 7's are fun" and then lost the game, Hawks went on to win the Cup. Imagine if Dan Bylsma was up 3-1 against Philly, lost the next 2, called Game 7's "fun" then lost and watched the Flyers raise the Cup? Yeah, Babcock lived that. So excuse me for not being on Team Babcock lol, also please don't mention Team Canada Gold. The Pens are NOT Team Canada and I bet any Canadian coach can win Gold with that talent.
You can save and quote this as well, I think we will be a better team next year, as long as we don't lose key players long term.
Like I said, I look at the brighter side of things, this team isn't as bad as some people make them out to be. Just wait and see what happens this offseason. You guys can be negative all you want.
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Honour Over Glory
#firesully
- Jan 30, 2012
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Dreger even laughed at keeping Johnston over Babcock...can you blame him?
Isn't that under the assumption that Babcock even wants to come here? If I was Babcock, I wouldn't, too many idiots with power running the show for the Pens.
Honour Over Glory
#firesully
- Jan 30, 2012
- 81,391
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Yeah Dollar "Bill" was a ******. I don't see our ownership as a silver lining. They basically swapped out faces but the problem still lies with the power struggle that goes on up in head office and ownership with this team. You can't have a sit down and say it was weird how Despres was treated and then allow that trade to happen and still not answer to it.
I like another mentioned, love this team, but the people that run it, I've developed some animosity towards them, including Mario Lemieux...a person I idolized as a youngster.
66-30-33
Registered User
True. Before you know it, we will have traded all our young players for old guys and our youngest player will be Crosby.
Iffyiffiffer
Moo
- May 10, 2010
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So they got rid of 2 of the 58 people? That fixes nothing, especially when you see the GM hemming and hawing about 9 people and the Despres trade. Adding a figurehead to the disfigured monster fixed nothing.
BrookswasHere44
Registered User
- Jun 22, 2009
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Bennett Brauer
Registered User
They got rid of the GM and replaced him with another GM who addressed plenty of needs for this team in the one year that he's been here. They got rid of the head coach and his two assistants and IMO upgraded. I would take Johnston and Agnew over Bylsma and Granato. Tocchet and Reirden are 3rd wheels to both staffs so it's whatever. Then there is the on ice product, we got rid of 12 players from our playoff roster last year. Stempniak, Jokinen, Neal, Glass, Gibbons, Vitale, Goc, Orpik, Niskanen, Bortuzzo, Engelland, and Zatkoff. We replaced them with Hornqvist, Spaling, Ehrhoff, Comeau, Greiss, Downie, Perron, Lapierre, Winnik and Cole.
To me that's way more of a change than "2 of the 58 people". Like I said earlier, we can complain about the one bad trade JR made, it deserves a ton of criticism, even HE knows that! (Which is why I don't see it happening again).
I trust Rutherford and I think he deserves more than one year. Nobody is more experienced at his job than he is. His team was struggling in Carolina but the situations are very different. He watched our playoff games on TV and saw the things we struggled with, he knew what needed changed, the moves he made improved us in those areas, minus the Lovejoy acquisition. He wasn't brought here to prepare us for life after Crosby. He was brought in to build around an elite core, something he has proven he can do. There were times where I envied Carolina's moves, JR almost always found gems. He traded Jamie McBain for Andrej Sekera (Bortuzzo for Cole could be similar) I wanted guys like Jussi Jokinen and Tuomo Ruutu on the Pens for years. He found gems in trades, like Jiri Tlusty and Nathan Gerbe. He made a big trade that is actually helping the Canes moving forward, the Staal trade! Now Staal was going there anyways but still he deserves credit for getting it done and not giving much in the process. I remember the Jeff Skinner pick was raved about as one of the more underrated picks in 2010, everywhere I turned people were calling it a steal. I hope the Kapanen pick gives us similar results minus the injury history of course.
So yeah, Rutherford makes bad moves from time to time, every GM does. Rutherford traded Jack Johnson for Tim Gleason, Andrew Ladd for Tuomo Ruutu and Simon Despres for Ben Lovejoy, but even though he has made some bad moves, he makes pretty good moves also.
Basically doubts Babs is going back to DET now that they've allowed him to shop around.
Thinks it will be min 5mil per yr.
Brought up St Loo or ANA (should they crash, unlikely) as possible destinations.
Says EDM or BUF or other desperate teams like PHl may throw huge bucks. Pegula is loaded.
However thinks Babs wants a Cup sooner rather than later.
As dark horse mentioned PGH, said (with a chuckle while the group shook their heads and smiled) that every time he talked to JR, JR insisted MJ was safe. Said that could change only if Burkle or Mario picked up the phone, but said he didn't know if that would happen.
Actually they all said 5mil was low end and expected more than that.
Suggested that desperate teams would go much higher than 5.5mil.
I'd love to know the contracts for our 79AGMs and if they're guaranteed, or if not, how much we might save if we fired all their *****.
I'm pretty fed up with this team, so it could just be me, but I read Dreger's tone plus the body language of the hosts, when talking about the Pens, to basically be "these guys in Pittsburgh are an embarrassing clown-show"
Suggested that desperate teams would go much higher than 5.5mil.
I'd love to know the contracts for our 79AGMs and if they're guaranteed, or if not, how much we might save if we fired all their *****.
I'm pretty fed up with this team, so it could just be me, but I read Dreger's tone plus the body language of the hosts, when talking about the Pens, to basically be "these guys in Pittsburgh are an embarrassing clown-show"
ColePens
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