Rumor: Rumors & Proposals Thread | The Oilers Biggest Roster Need Is?

[jukon]

Lol so you don't want give up a prospect that has top four potential for a prospect with number 1 d potential makes sense.

Like Reinhart??

Some people think that when a highly ranked prospect struggles in the NHL, it's a great buy low opportunity. Maybe they are just a bust and you are trading your valued asset on magic beans.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

No actually I think it proves my point perfectly.

Unless you pay absolute top-dollar for established, elite-level, goaltending... then your goaltending is likely not going to be a difference maker.

To my point: you can't expect difference making goaltending unless you pay top dollar. You may or may not get lucky depending (perhaps) on the talent of your goaltending evaluation and coaching... which again, is to my point... we don't make it a priority (as you allude, our 20-year history)

So what HAVE we made a priority to? OFFENSE. We spend a TONNE. We have arguably the best on-paper offense ever assembled. That's our priority. That's where we spend our money. That's what we deem to be worthwhile, perhaps because it is more predictable. How can you possibly say that investment is not the problem? It's sitting 21st !!!

Yeah I mean goaltending could be better but that our offense is so bad is mindboggling.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

The 4 teams that are spending less according to your list are:

4th, 7th, 11th and 13th in save percentage this season. Oilers are down in 27th.

You’ve disproved your own point. You absolutely can pay bottom dollars and get good goaltending. You’ve just got to find the right goalies at the right time. Something this team hasn’t been able to do in more than 20 years with the exception of the odd season here or there.

I think it shows how voodoo goalie are

Gustavsson had .899 save % last year and this year its at .924
Cam Talbot, who was one of main reason why the Oilers stunk in 2017-18 and everyone around here wanted an upgrade on him, has a .921 save %
Vejmelka, a dude with a career save % of .898...has a .926 this year...I'm sure everyone saw that coming lol

 

[Scrapin Ice]

Just reading about that new plane that goes like a bat outta hell.

Maybe its time to start talking about a Euro Division. Maybe a 10 team division.

Sorry kinda tired of reading we need a top 4 and a goalie (and sometimes a bottom 6 guy) in 42 million different ways.

 

[McTonyBrar]

Okay nvm looks like false alarm on Jiricek

 

[TopShelfGloveSide]

Yeah I mean goaltending could be better but that our offense is so bad is mindboggling.

Lol oilers goaltending is the worst in the NHL and it “could be better”

Oilers are 15th in the league in Goals For and it’s “mind boggling bad”

Right….. obviously we should be top in the league in goals but goaltending has been much worse.

 

[iCanada]

Wow... you win the prize.

Now I know WTF Kulak was doing!

I'd honestly never noticed that... now that I have seen it... you can even see Reinhart looking pass (hard-sell) and then on the overhead view it's pretty telling that Kulak was taking that pass away... ugh... you kinda just wish he jammed the breaks on a bit earlier to allow Skinner to stop at the top of the blue, but it's a fast game.

Thanks for that. Very solid.



Wow... are you really doubling down?

The dump in by Draisaitl is the same xGoal as the Reinhart goal and you are ok with that?

lol....

That's not what I said.

I also already noted that I was incorrect and both are just less than 0.01 xGF, is rounding error on display.

The Draisaitl goal is 0.003 xGF, 1/300.

The Reinhart goal is 0.008 xGF, 1/125.

Regardless - it's not a good goal to give up compared to even the chance by Holloway literally 30 seconds earlier on the other end of the rink.

 

[OilerTyler]

He also had better stats than the other final 4 goalies in that stretch. So yes, after a rough series with the Nucks where he recovered, he gave us winnable goaltending in the final four, which is why the cup was winnable for us.

Yeah, he did his part in rounds 3 and 4. People can harp on him for the second goal against in game 7 but to me the bigger concern is that our highly vaunted superstar offence didn't show up. McDavid, Draisaitl and friends get paid a lot more money than Skinner to do their jobs and they failed a lot worse.

Hopefully Skinner can bounce back.

 

[McDNicks17]

I'm kind of surprised Tomasino went for so cheap. Especially since he's leaving a rebuilding team that should have plenty of time for him.

I feel like he's going to have a career like Ryan Strome. Just needs some time to figure out how to play with the lack of foot speed. Too much skill, smarts and work ethic, to completely fail, IMO.

 

[Soundwave]

Skinner is great when the puck is in the zone and he can set himself.

Off the rush is where he struggles hard.

2nd poor start from the entire team. That's the more concerning thing to me.

The poor starts are tied to goaltending at its root IMO.

Team has to play perfect in front of these shoddy goalies, but you need to be in mid-season/late season form generally to play that well, since the goalies don't give you enough leeway.

Then the goalie shits the bed to start, then the other players are all gripping their sticks too tight which then impacts the offense and then pile on big expectations for the team and the results are some what predictable. Throw in inexperienced coaches who haven't run NHL level training camps in their career and other teams playing 110% against us to start against us because they're trying to make a name for themselves.

You need to have a goalie that will give the team some goddamn leeway at the start of the year.

Until we get a better brand of goalie I wouldn't be surprised if these poor starts continue pretty much every year.

 

[Soundwave]

I think it shows how voodoo goalie are

Gustavsson had .899 save % last year and this year its at .924
Cam Talbot, who was one of main reason why the Oilers stunk in 2017-18 and everyone around here wanted an upgrade on him, has a .921 save %
Vejmelka, a dude with a career save % of .898...has a .926 this year...I'm sure everyone saw that coming lol

Cam Talbot has been good in 5 of his last 6 seasons, so no it isn't really much voodoo.

When looking at goalies on bottom ranking teams/teams that have been tanking or perpetually rebuilding you have to look beyond just save percentage.

Vejmelka has had good seasons in GSAA in the past, it's not a total shocker to me he's having a good year this year where the Coyotes are actually some what trying.

Gustavsson had a .931 season just two years ago, so him being .924 this year isn't maybe that mind blowing.

 

[iCanada]

Yeah, he did his part in rounds 3 and 4. People can harp on him for the second goal against in game 7 but to me the bigger concern is that our highly vaunted superstar offence didn't show up. McDavid, Draisaitl and friends get paid a lot more money than Skinner to do their jobs and they failed a lot worse.

Hopefully Skinner can bounce back.

No offense is "showing up" in game 7 of a Stanley Cup final dude. Pretty much the last 10 of them have been tight as hell 1 goal games, most of them 2-1, that you could easily mistake for a street fight.

 

[TheNumber4]

Yeah, he did his part in rounds 3 and 4. People can harp on him for the second goal against in game 7 but to me the bigger concern is that our highly vaunted superstar offence didn't show up. McDavid, Draisaitl and friends get paid a lot more money than Skinner to do their jobs and they failed a lot worse.

Hopefully Skinner can bounce back.

There’s many ways to win games. Many ways to lose them too. We didn’t score enough. We also messed up defensively. We also could have won with a couple extra saves. I just find it silly to blame everything on one player when there are so many ways a game can go.

 

[Soundwave]

No offense is "showing up" in game 7 of a Stanley Cup final dude. Pretty much the last 10 of them have been tight as hell 1 goal games, most of them 2-1, that you could easily mistake for a street fight.

Pretty much been pointed out, but a SCF Game 7 is basically "whoever scores the 2nd goal wins the Cup".

Been 9 SCF game 7s in 44 years, in all 9 of them the team that gets to 2 goals first, wins the Cup.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

Cam Talbot has been good in 5 of his last 6 seasons, so no it isn't really much voodoo.

When looking at goalies on bottom ranking teams/teams that have been tanking or perpetually rebuilding you have to look beyond just save percentage.

Vejmelka has had good seasons in GSAA in the past, it's not a total shocker to me he's having a good year this year where the Coyotes are actually some what trying.

Gustavsson had a .931 season just two years ago, so him being .924 this year isn't maybe that mind blowing.

but he was bad last year is my point...he's up and down

same with Vejmelka and yes even Talbot

if they were consistent goalies, they'd making money in the Hellebuyck, Vasilevskiy range

 

[Soundwave]

There’s many ways to win games. Many ways to lose them too. We didn’t score enough. We also messed up defensively. We also could have won with a couple extra saves. I just find it silly to blame everything on one player when there are so many ways a game can go.

If you let in the 2nd goal of a Cup Final game 7, you basically lose the Cup.

Every game 7 of the SCF has gone by that blue print in the modern era (last 45+ years). When a team gets that second goal, they shut it down. Game 7 of a SCF is not a normal game.

 

[Canovin]

I'm starting to think McDavid need someone like Kaapo Kakko on his wing

Lots of similarity to Drai's game pre-draft

Jeff Skinner+ for Kakko?

 

[TheNumber4]

Sent NYR into an existential management crisis with that win lol.

Although I wouldn’t be surprised if they are just using this loss as an excuse to put Trouba back on the market. One of the worst D-man in the NHL. Can’t believe he’s so bad.

If you let in the 2nd goal of a Cup Final game 7, you basically lose the Cup.

Every game 7 of the SCF has gone by that blue print in the modern era (last 45+ years). When a team gets that second goal, they shut it down. Game 7 of a SCF is not a normal game.

And if you score the 3rd goal, you basically win. Could have done that too.

 

[VeteranPresence]

Cam Talbot has been good in 5 of his last 6 seasons, so no it isn't really much voodoo.

When looking at goalies on bottom ranking teams/teams that have been tanking or perpetually rebuilding you have to look beyond just save percentage.

Vejmelka has had good seasons in GSAA in the past, it's not a total shocker to me he's having a good year this year where the Coyotes are actually some what trying.

If anything Vejmelka's numbers should sell people on the forecasting power of GSAx. We want goalies with bad surface level stats but great underlying ones because they're cheap to pay (right now) and cheap to acquire (right now). You know what you get when the underlying numbers match the boxcars? Shesterkin and Hellebuyck, who are not available and won't be for years if ever.

However, I don't care what analytics Bowman uses at this point. We know what Stuart Skinner is, the numbers know what Skinner is, the league knows what Skinner is. Roll the dice on whoever else your data people (you have data people, right?) say is worth a shot and just see what happens. Not doing so is choosing to forfeit a run at the Cup.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Lol oilers goaltending is the worst in the NHL and it “could be better”

Oilers are 15th in the league in Goals For and it’s “mind boggling bad”

Right….. obviously we should be top in the league in goals but goaltending has been much worse.

Considering the talent we have up front? Yeah that's not great. Too many forwards with offensive numbers behind noted offensive juggernaut Mattias Janmark.

No offense is "showing up" in game 7 of a Stanley Cup final dude. Pretty much the last 10 of them have been tight as hell 1 goal games, most of them 2-1, that you could easily mistake for a street fight.

The Bruins won 4-0. The Devils won 3-0. The Blues won 4-1. The Avs won 3-1. No team in history has won a game 7 of the SCF while only scoring once, and only 6 game 7s all time have ended 1-0.

 

[Soundwave]

but he was bad last year is my point...he's up and down

same with Vejmelka and yes even Talbot

if they were consistent goalies, they'd making money in the Hellebuyck, Vasilevskiy range

Talbot should be making more money than he does, he's one of the most underrated players in the league.

In a 12 seasons, he's had a save percentage below .908 twice only and he's put up good numbers on multiple teams.

 

[TheNumber4]

Just reading about that new plane that goes like a bat outta hell.

Maybe its time to start talking about a Euro Division. Maybe a 10 team division.

Sorry kinda tired of reading we need a top 4 and a goalie (and sometimes a bottom 6 guy) in 42 million different ways.

NHL is over expanding as it is.

 

[K1984]

No offense is "showing up" in game 7 of a Stanley Cup final dude. Pretty much the last 10 of them have been tight as hell 1 goal games, most of them 2-1, that you could easily mistake for a street fight.

Game 7's of the SCF are unique to themselves even across multiple eras.

They are either a blow out for one team or a dog fight that ends up 2-1 without anything in between. Even the 1987 Game 7 was as much of a late 90's style slug fest as you'll ever see for that entire decade.

 

[Behind Enemy Lines]

That's not what I said.

I also already noted that I was incorrect and both are just less than 0.01 xGF, is rounding error on display.

The Draisaitl goal is 0.003 xGF, 1/300.

The Reinhart goal is 0.008 xGF, 1/125.

Regardless - it's not a good goal to give up compared to even the chance by Holloway literally 30 seconds earlier on the other end of the rink.

Ridiculous comparison. One in a complete fluke, the other is a mid-range goal by a cumulative 69 goal scorer last year regular season & playoffs aided and abetted by poor gap by Kulak; the late forward support by Foegele; and can probably add bad line change by Holloway which reduced Oiler defending numbers on Florida's rush chance. You'd like the stop but there are also compounding team coverage issues that are contributory factors

Reinhart is not an NHL average shooter at mid-range.

Last season Reinhart was a 57 goal scorer; 13 regular season mid-range goals NHL 96 percentile on 21% ninety-four percentile. Playoffs he added another 10 goals; 3 mid-range goals 98 percentile on 15.8% shooting 76 percentile. 69 total goals last year.

Reinhart's an even better mid-range shooter this season with a 6 goal NHL 98 percentile scoring success. His 16 goals has him in the NHL 99 percentile.

Weakens your credibility trying to equate two entirely different random hockey events. There's alot of information needed to overlay in evaluating performance.

 

[Soundwave]

Considering the talent we have up front? Yeah that's not great. Too many forwards with offensive numbers behind noted offensive juggernaut Mattias Janmark.


The Bruins won 4-0. The Devils won 3-0. The Blues won 4-1. The Avs won 3-1. No team in history has won a game 7 of the SCF while only scoring once, and only 6 game 7s all time have ended 1-0.

Because if you give up that 2nd goal, you're not getting it back in a Cup Final game 7. It's over.

If a team gets up 2-0 or 2-1 ... they're winning the Cup. They will play balls to the wall, every fancy pants scorer even will play like a 3rd/4th liner grinder for 20-40 minutes if they have to when they can taste a Cup.

They will trap, trap, trap and their goalie will play hyper alert. Getting that goal back requires a mini-miracle.

No team that has given up the 2nd goal in SCF game 7 has ever come back to even tie I believe in the modern era.


I believe the Oilers are kind of a rarity in that they're one of the few teams that actually tied the game after getting down in a game 7 of SCF. The only other case where that has happened in modern history I believe was the 87 Oilers where Philly scored 1st in the 1st period, but they were able to tie 1-1 and then go up 2-1 and that was basically the Cup right there, Philly could not get that goal back.