Roster/Rumors/Speculation/Trade Talk - 2023-24: Hotel California

[doublechili]

Well, there is this

That Aho makes about $8.5M per year. There's a really nice restaurant up in the Eiffel Tower. By all means have a picnic if that's what you want to do, but not sure it's worth sharing with the world a video sitting on the ground with a mini-bottle of Champagne.

 

[Glory Days]

Kessel signs with VGK for 1 year, 1.5M per.

Seems like he likes the desert, I guess you are what you eat (i.e. a 'hot dog').

Isn’t Vegas over the cap? Putting Lehner on LTIR still doesn’t get them cap compliant. Signing Kessel seems to make the problem harder.

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

He has 52 goals in those 234 games, which translates to 18 goals per 82 games

Why are we assuming he's a pure goal scorer at this point? If we get another 13 goals this year out of him, we might have to accept he's a 3rd liner at best. Raty had 23 goals in 67 games at all levels last year. If Wally can't outplay Raty in camp, he has no excuses left.

However, he was drafted as a pure goal-scorer. He was a goal-scoring machine for the USNTDP, which is naturally one of the absolute most topflight producers of NHL talent on the planet.

He already had 14 goals for the U18 team in 27 games as an underager (including 4 in 7 U18-WC games as an underager), then popped in an insane 77 goals in 95 total games in his draft year, including a 7-goal, 9-point performance at the U18 Worlds.

The belief was there that he'd be doing no less than what Kyle Connor has been doing for Winnipeg, or even the much smaller Cole Caufield has done for the Canadians.

Yes, some of the draft pundits had their doubts and we've come to see exactly why. He has the shot and the body, but just how much will and wherewithal was questioned by many. Maybe that's ultimately why he was there for the plucking in 2018.

Because we're Islander fans and already lucked out immensely for our one time per decade with Barzal (ok, we're spoiled now with Dobson too), it's only logical that Wally has had his problems establishing himself at the NHL level. We just don't get that lucky.

When his confidence is low, he's not shooting. He hangs onto the puck too much. He tries to do one thing to much on his own. He ends up being a turnover machine. And whatever is going on with his flopping all over the ice at times, it's becoming disturbing. It's like he often trips over himself like some kind of doofus.

Has he taken any steps to alleviate all that? Is it an engrained, coordinative problem?

The shot alone should mean that he gets 30 per 82-game season. It's that lethal if taken enough. His one-timer is wicked and he can even blister it at goalies when the pass isn't perfect. He can wrist that puppy with authority too.

Can Lambert now tickle that out of him? Who does he have to play with for that to happen?

Well, there is this

He's not the only one there in Paris at the moment:

 

[19 in a row]

I think the chances are basically zero to nil that Martin will be out of the picture sans injury and if he ever were to be, then it's Johnston who is filling in for him on that very specific thorn-in-your-side fourth line.

In addition, the jokers for the line-up are already on the Island in Bellows and Wahlstrom, who Lambert HAS to find a role for. That's one of his chief tasks heading into the season.

Seeing guys like Holmstrom and Raty on this team just won't be possible anything short of 4-5 injuries at any one time.

BTW, Holmstrom is far closer to the NHL than Raty is. The young Finn is promising and exciting, but needs to come into the NHL as a scorer. He needs to get there through AHL seasoning. You don't bring up these kids to replace a 4th liner. That's what Andreoff and Koivula and even Bardreau will be there for if the injury bug hits hard.

And not that it needs to be said, but everyone should bear in mind that this isn't 1985 or something. Camps are like two weeks long and feature 5-7 test games. There's no real "fighting for jobs". There's no coming in to get fit.

Their jobs are pre-determined and these guys come in fit. Camps are about getting on the same page and working the systems. Others are there for practice pace, team-building, and so that the NHL staff gets a chance to simply see them live as they don't have time to do so during the regular season.

Aside from PTOs for guys in a team's position of weakness, there is basically no coming in to win a job. Alone waiver wire concerns already determine several spots for the fringe players.

it is just my opinion but I believe the chance is much more than zero that Martin is sent through waivers to Bridgeport to start the season.. I have enjoyed him as much as anyone, and he has epitomized what Isles fans love in a player but unless he was injured last year, I think he is in a serious decline and am pretty confident in saying he was our worst regular forward last year, 7 points and 235 hits in 71 games and visibly slower. . As per cap friendly we have 14 forwards on the NHL roster including Bellows and Wahlstrom. I think they give Bellows a chance this year unless he falls on his face. If Raty or Holmstrom did push or if we bring someone in like Milano or someone else, I think it most likely that it is Martin or Johnston that will be the odd man out. Johnston and Martin serve a similar purpose and I think we are at a disadvantage if both are in the lineup together. Maybe you are right and they have an allegiance to Martin so he sticks, but if they are looking forward, I believe he is the most likely to be the first to go. .

 

[19 in a row]

I wouldn't be mad at this. With Uber & Lyft readily available at your fingertips, drunk driving is about the most selfish thing you can do.

One thing that is definitely better about the younger generation than mine (I am 55) is that my kids will not drink and drive at all. They may go out all night but it is always an Uber/ Lyft or getting a ride. Back in the 80s and early 90s , we never thought twice of going out to the bar all night and then driving home, it was not uncommon dare I say accepted. I.have to give credit to all of the efforts to make people aware of the ramifications. Even MAAD and "Blood on the Highways" lol the 1959 film they were still showing in drivers ed when I took it in the 80s. (anyone remember that film?)

 

[19 in a row]

Since his 2017-18 USNDP season, he has played 234 games at all levels . . . National team, Boston, College, Bridgeport, Sweden and the Island.

He has 52 goals in those 234 games, which translates to 18 goals per 82 games

Why are we assuming he's a pure goal scorer at this point? If we get another 13 goals this year out of him, we might have to accept he's a 3rd liner at best. Raty had 23 goals in 67 games at all levels last year. If Wally can't outplay Raty in camp, he has no excuses left.

Because of his shot and style of play. if he makes it , it will be as a goal scorer.
Wahlstrom had 12 goals in 44 games in 2020-21 year with the Isles (a 22 goals per 82 pace in his first full year) and slid back to 13 in 73 last year (most of our guys had a tough year last year). That is 17.5 goals per 82 over the last 2 years/117 games with us (he had 0 in 9 games 2 years ago I am not including). He is only 22 years old and could possibly take that next step as he develops, gets used to the speed and his body matures. My hope is with that shot he could be a force on the power play and a solid power forward at some point, but only time will tell. He is 22, there is time. I think he could be a 30+ goal scorer. I don't think that is a crazy thought but maybe I am an optimist.

 

[Mike C]

Since his 2017-18 USNDP season, he has played 234 games at all levels . . . National team, Boston, College, Bridgeport, Sweden and the Island.

He has 52 goals in those 234 games, which translates to 18 goals per 82 games

Why are we assuming he's a pure goal scorer at this point? If we get another 13 goals this year out of him, we might have to accept he's a 3rd liner at best. Raty had 23 goals in 67 games at all levels last year. If Wally can't outplay Raty in camp, he has no excuses left.


Yes, he's the Fauci of NYI draft picks

I'm hoping his lessons last season plus the addition of MacLean helps him. If not, I'd be OK with him on 3rd or even 4th line. He stepped into the physical aspect of the game last year and Wally and Beau were Barry's whipping boys. Couldn't have been tops for the young fellows' confidence

 

[Mike C]

I wouldn't be mad at this. With Uber & Lyft readily available at your fingertips, drunk driving is about the most selfish thing you can do.

Being sober now for many years and looking back at not only my own drunk driving but how many times I got in the car with other drivers who were drunk and/or high, I realize how not only selfish, but dangerous I was. Thankfully I never had any mishaps but that was all God.

 

[Mike C]

One thing that is definitely better about the younger generation than mine (I am 55) is that my kids will not drink and drive at all. They may go out all night but it is always an Uber/ Lyft or getting a ride. Back in the 80s and early 90s , we never thought twice of going out to the bar all night and then driving home, it was not uncommon dare I say accepted. I.have to give credit to all of the efforts to make people aware of the ramifications. Even MAAD and "Blood on the Highways" lol the 1959 film they were still showing in drivers ed when I took it in the 80s. (anyone remember that film?)

Sadly I was one of those idiots on the road back then. Never did I think about calling a cab or car service. Not only was it accepted but we wore it like a badge slurring " I drive better drunk than most people do sober"


I quit drinking in '96 and I am remorseful at my actions and feel grateful that God was looking after not only me, but all in my path!

 

[Mike C]

I think the chances are basically zero to nil that Martin will be out of the picture sans injury and if he ever were to be, then it's Johnston who is filling in for him on that very specific thorn-in-your-side fourth line.

In addition, the jokers for the line-up are already on the Island in Bellows and Wahlstrom, who Lambert HAS to find a role for. That's one of his chief tasks heading into the season.

Seeing guys like Holmstrom and Raty on this team just won't be possible anything short of 4-5 injuries at any one time.

BTW, Holmstrom is far closer to the NHL than Raty is. The young Finn is promising and exciting, but needs to come into the NHL as a scorer. He needs to get there through AHL seasoning. You don't bring up these kids to replace a 4th liner. That's what Andreoff and Koivula and even Bardreau will be there for if the injury bug hits hard.

And not that it needs to be said, but everyone should bear in mind that this isn't 1985 or something. Camps are like two weeks long and feature 5-7 test games. There's no real "fighting for jobs". There's no coming in to get fit.

Their jobs are pre-determined and these guys come in fit. Camps are about getting on the same page and working the systems. Others are there for practice pace, team-building, and so that the NHL staff gets a chance to simply see them live as they don't have time to do so during the regular season.

Aside from PTOs for guys in a team's position of weakness, there is basically no coming in to win a job. Alone waiver wire concerns already determine several spots for the fringe players.

The 4th line was a thorn in nobody's side but our own last season.i think it's time has come and gone. I'd like to see Bellows with a sprinkling of Ross replace Martin. Injured or not, 7 total points and 70 penalty minutes is a downright disgrace. I'm hoping he's in the press box most of the season

 

[The Real JT]

Sadly I was one of those idiots on the road back then. Never did I think about calling a cab or car service. Not only was it accepted but we wore it like a badge slurring " I drive better drunk than most people do sober"


I quit drinking in '96 and I am remorseful at my actions and feel grateful that God was looking after not only me, but all in my path!

Mike I would never question your faith and I’m glad you take comfort in it but I don’t have the same perspective regarding drunk driving and outcomes.

A while back I knew a salt of the earth, great person, great nurse. She had an 18 yo hard working son returning from work one evening when he was broadsided by a drunk driver. He’s now quadriplegic.

 

[Duanesutter12]

Hey curious. Is MDC still unsigned? Any chance we bring him back? Before he got hurt, I was actually thinking he could eventually be a 4th line grinder and take Clutterbuck's spot down the road. Forget his lottery selection now, he is not going to pan out as a 5th overall pick but still thought he might have some value if on the cheap. At a minimum some additional depth at Bridgeport.

While I always appreciated MDC's hustle given the fact he could've packed it in with his underwhelming offensive output, I just don't see him as a replacement for Clutter. He doesn't have the kind of hustle that runs into people night after night with uber agitation along the way. He can give decent minutes but if they want the identity of the fourth line to remain the same I don't see him as a potential replacement.

 

[Duanesutter12]

However, he was drafted as a pure goal-scorer. He was a goal-scoring machine for the USNTDP, which is naturally one of the absolute most topflight producers of NHL talent on the planet.

He already had 14 goals for the U18 team in 27 games as an underager (including 4 in 7 U18-WC games as an underager), then popped in an insane 77 goals in 95 total games in his draft year, including a 7-goal, 9-point performance at the U18 Worlds.

The belief was there that he'd be doing no less than what Kyle Connor has been doing for Winnipeg, or even the much smaller Cole Caufield has done for the Canadians.

Yes, some of the draft pundits had their doubts and we've come to see exactly why. He has the shot and the body, but just how much will and wherewithal was questioned by many. Maybe that's ultimately why he was there for the plucking in 2018.

Because we're Islander fans and already lucked out immensely for our one time per decade with Barzal (ok, we're spoiled now with Dobson too), it's only logical that Wally has had his problems establishing himself at the NHL level. We just don't get that lucky.

When his confidence is low, he's not shooting. He hangs onto the puck too much. He tries to do one thing to much on his own. He ends up being a turnover machine. And whatever is going on with his flopping all over the ice at times, it's becoming disturbing. It's like he often trips over himself like some kind of doofus.

Has he taken any steps to alleviate all that? Is it an engrained, coordinative problem?

The shot alone should mean that he gets 30 per 82-game season. It's that lethal if taken enough. His one-timer is wicked and he can even blister it at goalies when the pass isn't perfect. He can wrist that puppy with authority too.

Can Lambert now tickle that out of him? Who does he have to play with for that to happen?



He's not the only one there in Paris at the moment:
View attachment 579587

However, he was drafted as a pure goal-scorer. He was a goal-scoring machine for the USNTDP, which is naturally one of the absolute most topflight producers of NHL talent on the planet.

He already had 14 goals for the U18 team in 27 games as an underager (including 4 in 7 U18-WC games as an underager), then popped in an insane 77 goals in 95 total games in his draft year, including a 7-goal, 9-point performance at the U18 Worlds.

The belief was there that he'd be doing no less than what Kyle Connor has been doing for Winnipeg, or even the much smaller Cole Caufield has done for the Canadians.

Yes, some of the draft pundits had their doubts and we've come to see exactly why. He has the shot and the body, but just how much will and wherewithal was questioned by many. Maybe that's ultimately why he was there for the plucking in 2018.

Because we're Islander fans and already lucked out immensely for our one time per decade with Barzal (ok, we're spoiled now with Dobson too), it's only logical that Wally has had his problems establishing himself at the NHL level. We just don't get that lucky.

When his confidence is low, he's not shooting. He hangs onto the puck too much. He tries to do one thing to much on his own. He ends up being a turnover machine. And whatever is going on with his flopping all over the ice at times, it's becoming disturbing. It's like he often trips over himself like some kind of doofus.

Has he taken any steps to alleviate all that? Is it an engrained, coordinative problem?

The shot alone should mean that he gets 30 per 82-game season. It's that lethal if taken enough. His one-timer is wicked and he can even blister it at goalies when the pass isn't perfect. He can wrist that puppy with authority too.

Can Lambert now tickle that out of him? Who does he have to play with for that to happen?



He's not the only one there in Paris at the moment:
View attachment 579587

Do you think it could be an issue of the light simply not going on yet and that he just never meshed with Trotz and his system? Sometimes all that's needed is a change. One month ago Joey Gallo was a basket case getting booed nightly, now he's an important piece on the dodgers. Hoping we can get a similar bump out of Wally with Lambert at the helm!

 

[Mike C]

Mike I would never question your faith and I’m glad you take comfort in it but I don’t have the same perspective regarding drunk driving and outcomes.

A while back I knew a salt of the earth, great person, great nurse. She had an 18 yo hard working son returning from work one evening when he was broadsided by a drunk driver. He’s now quadriplegic.

I get it man. Some things have no answers. I learned that when my son was a medical patient instead of a little kid for the first 3 years of his life.


I've known many an instance where the good suffer much and the bad seemingly prosper.

Wish I could make sense of it all.

Always appreciate your thoughts and insight. Hope you're doing good JT

 

[BrockLobster]

One thing that is definitely better about the younger generation than mine (I am 55) is that my kids will not drink and drive at all. They may go out all night but it is always an Uber/ Lyft or getting a ride. Back in the 80s and early 90s , we never thought twice of going out to the bar all night and then driving home, it was not uncommon dare I say accepted. I.have to give credit to all of the efforts to make people aware of the ramifications. Even MAAD and "Blood on the Highways" lol the 1959 film they were still showing in drivers ed when I took it in the 80s. (anyone remember that film?)

Back in the day the rule was the driver couldnt do any shots. And the driver rotated each time we went out. Yikes

Now if im driving i have not even a sip.

 

[Mike C]

Back in the day the rule was the driver couldnt do any shots. And the driver rotated each time we went out. Yikes

Now if im driving i have not even a sip.

Wish I knew then what I know now!

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

it is just my opinion but I believe the chance is much more than zero that Martin is sent through waivers to Bridgeport to start the season.. I have enjoyed him as much as anyone, and he has epitomized what Isles fans love in a player but unless he was injured last year, I think he is in a serious decline and am pretty confident in saying he was our worst regular forward last year, 7 points and 235 hits in 71 games and visibly slower. . As per cap friendly we have 14 forwards on the NHL roster including Bellows and Wahlstrom. I think they give Bellows a chance this year unless he falls on his face. If Raty or Holmstrom did push or if we bring someone in like Milano or someone else, I think it most likely that it is Martin or Johnston that will be the odd man out. Johnston and Martin serve a similar purpose and I think we are at a disadvantage if both are in the lineup together. Maybe you are right and they have an allegiance to Martin so he sticks, but if they are looking forward, I believe he is the most likely to be the first to go. .

Well, for each, their own.

When I write a post like the initial response you're responding to here, I don't think so much about what I would do or would like to see. I'm thinking about what the NYI patterns and practices are under Lamoriello's guidance and responding accordingly.

We all saw that Martin looked sluggish and fading last season.

Then again, almost no-one looked to be up to his usual self with a few exceptions.

And we know that Lou doesn't just flip out 6-8 players every year like some other teams do, so he's giving all these guys a shot at a reboot.

The dynamics of the 4th line would indicate that, when all are healthy, we'll see the line as we know it and when someone needs a break - maybe even every week, in Martin's case - then Johnston will be the guy filling in. Injuries would demand other altercations and yes, that 4th line is more likely to be injured than any other. So sure, there may be a Wahlstrom, Bellows, or Parise on that line at times, and likely the Koivulas and Andreoffs of the world if particularly Cizikas is out for a good little bit.

With respect to Martin, if people think Lamoriello would send a guy like him through waivers to BPort because they see him as wearing down and a weak link, then they haven't been watching Lou's modi operandi the past four years.

That would essentially be a slap in the face to one of our chief warriors and figures of identity, one who is respected around the entire league. Heck, bringing him back to the Island was like the first thing Lou did here.

When the time comes where Martin can't do his job, you'll see him retire and join the organization in another capacity. It'd be shocking to see him disrespected with a demotion along the way.

 

[NC 1972]

While I always appreciated MDC's hustle given the fact he could've packed it in with his underwhelming offensive output, I just don't see him as a replacement for Clutter. He doesn't have the kind of hustle that runs into people night after night with uber agitation along the way. He can give decent minutes but if they want the identity of the fourth line to remain the same I don't see him as a potential replacement.

I never liked the fact that Clutter was the return for Nino , but I've always liked his game especially when Cal was a bit younger . Great wrist shot , hits, hustles pills penalties but just like the rest of his line they are all breaking down, the injuries continue to pile up hoping there's a plan in place for replacing what the 4th line has brought these past years as I can easily see Martin and Cal's careers ending shortly due to injury. Casey might have a few years left in him.

 

[TheWhiteWhale30]

I never liked the fact that Clutter was the return for Nino , but I've always liked his game especially when Cal was a bit younger . Great wrist shot , hits, hustles pills penalties but just like the rest of his line they are all breaking down, the injuries continue to pile up hoping there's a plan in place for replacing what the 4th line has brought these past years as I can easily see Martin and Cal's careers ending shortly due to injury. Casey might have a few years left in him.

I agree about MM and Clutter. Casey has more then a few years left. His game was never near as physical and he is talented. Cal has played 1,003 games including POs, Martin 896 and Casey 733. Not to mention casey is the youngest of the 3 by a couple years. If you put some fresh legs on his wings and you will see him benefit massively. I wouldn’t mind seeing Kyle Maclean and Bellows on his wings. Maclean stood out in every game I watched Bridgeport play this year and his game would suit a 4th line role. If Parise doesn’t mesh in the top 9 well but still has wheels and hustles I think him, Casey and bellows would make a good 4th line. Little speed, hustle, 2 way players. Just would no longer be the hard checking 4th line.

 

[beach]

I wouldn't be mad at this. With Uber & Lyft readily available at your fingertips, drunk driving is about the most selfish thing you can do.

I'm completely against driving while intoxicated. But I think Aho's being unnecessarily dragged. He drank the night before. Didn't drive until the next day. His BAC was .03. Breathalyzer tests can show BAC levels 12-24 hours after alcohol consumption. Aho probably felt fine the next day with no thought that his BAC would still register. In the U.S. his BAC could have been twice that number and still not have met the DUI threshold.

Yes, he broke Swedish law, and I'm sure he won't drive the morning after going forward, but this is the weakest infraction I could imagine, in terms of being crucified on Twitter.

 

[saintunspecified]

When the time comes where Martin can't do his job, you'll see him retire and join the organization in another capacity. It'd be shocking to see him disrespected with a demotion along the way.

While I agree that the Martin situation must be handled diplomatically (not only because of Martin's status, but because of his father-in-law's platform), it becomes a difficult situation if his speed/agility is the same (or worse) at camp, as it was last year when he simply could not keep up. If he can't play they'll have to make some arrangement, and I imagine that an LTI-Retriment + develoment or media job is the way to do it ... if they can get away with it.

ADHD runs in my family, an I have a kid who has ADHD, and his off-ball play (lacrosse) went from terrible to very good the moment he started getting treatment (huge improvement academically as well). The way Wahlstrom plays sometimes reminds me of this. It's either that he's lost +invisible, or he's forcing his involvement causing him to be reckless with the puck AND his body - going into corners without properly bracing, and the like. I feel like he's missing the abilty to slow down, calculate, do his job without forcing anything, move to space, and have the patience to realize the puck only has to touch his stick for a milisecond for him to contribute. He's done it before, but never consistently - a hallmark of ADHD.

And on Kessell - I have to say that I don't understand it for VGK. He's excellent on the PP, not very good at anything else, but his PP play is redundant given Eichel. But they can bury him if it doesn't work out, I suppose.

 

[gordie43]

Before we ship Matt Martin to the A let’s see what he’s got left. Much like Pageau he was coming off off season surgery. Maybe I’m just being optimistic, which is not normally a trait of an Islander fan, but I see him bouncing back, and doing his part in the fourth line.

 

[Mr Misunderstood]

I'm completely against driving while intoxicated. But I think Aho's being unnecessarily dragged. He drank the night before. Didn't drive until the next day. His BAC was .03. Breathalyzer tests can show BAC levels 12-24 hours after alcohol consumption. Aho probably felt fine the next day with no thought that his BAC would still register. In the U.S. his BAC could have been twice that number and still not have met the DUI threshold.

Yes, he broke Swedish law, and I'm sure he won't drive the morning after going forward, but this is the weakest infraction I could imagine, in terms of being crucified on Twitter.

I'm off the Twitter machine and life has been better.

I agree with you on all points.

 

[Mike C]

Well, for each, their own.

When I write a post like the initial response you're responding to here, I don't think so much about what I would do or would like to see. I'm thinking about what the NYI patterns and practices are under Lamoriello's guidance and responding accordingly.

We all saw that Martin looked sluggish and fading last season.

Then again, almost no-one looked to be up to his usual self with a few exceptions.

And we know that Lou doesn't just flip out 6-8 players every year like some other teams do, so he's giving all these guys a shot at a reboot.

The dynamics of the 4th line would indicate that, when all are healthy, we'll see the line as we know it and when someone needs a break - maybe even every week, in Martin's case - then Johnston will be the guy filling in. Injuries would demand other altercations and yes, that 4th line is more likely to be injured than any other. So sure, there may be a Wahlstrom, Bellows, or Parise on that line at times, and likely the Koivulas and Andreoffs of the world if particularly Cizikas is out for a good little bit.

With respect to Martin, if people think Lamoriello would send a guy like him through waivers to BPort because they see him as wearing down and a weak link, then they haven't been watching Lou's modi operandi the past four years.

That would essentially be a slap in the face to one of our chief warriors and figures of identity, one who is respected around the entire league. Heck, bringing him back to the Island was like the first thing Lou did here.

When the time comes where Martin can't do his job, you'll see him retire and join the organization in another capacity. It'd be shocking to see him disrespected with a demotion along the way.

Me thinks that time is now. Sometimes a player is the last to know when to hang 'em up

 

[Mike C]

I'm off the Twitter machine and life has been better.

I agree with you on all points.

Me too. I was asked, ok, kicked off, with a lifetime ban. Much better indeed!