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Speculation: Roster Building thread - Part XVII - (TDL is March 7th)

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Trade everything you can. Make room for othmann berard jones for playing time. And recoup as much futures as we can. This roster sucks
 
I honestly just do not like a single player on this team anymore. Cuylle came back to earth. He was always going to be more of a third liner that can slot up. He is what he is. I’m fine with it. Guys like Trochek, even Borgen, turn in solid efforts but they’re just not cogs. Same with the Carricks and Edstroms. They’re fine. Whoopty-doo.

The rot is so deeply ingrained that it really is essentially inescapable. If this were a house, it would not be refurbished or renovated. No one would say “it’s got good bones” and clean it up. They would say “the foundation is rotten” and tear it down. I’m sorry, that is simply the truth. The rot runs so deeply it is not possible to fix. It has to be torn down or it will just spread to any “fixes” and “additions” that you make to it.

Every player who is making more than $4M or has a term of more than 4 years is an absolute cancer. It’s not even their own faults. They were inducted into a club and culture when they got that paycheck. They assimilated into the prevailing culture. Fox, Lafreniere, Shesterkin? It isn’t their faults. They could probably each go and be great (for Fox and Shesterkin, be great AGAIN) elsewhere, completely separated from their “homies” and the NYR country club culture. While here? None of them will improve from what we are currently getting. It doesn’t matter if you move 2 or 3 of the guys I’m talking about. Every player earning more than 4-5M or who is on a long term deal is part of rot. Because the rot spreads.

Not one of them has avoided becoming infected with it. Fox could probably go to a different team and win another Norris one day. Here he will slide from top D in the league to top 3, top 5, top 10, top 20 until he’s no longer even viewed as elite. Lafreniere will never be remotely close to a 1OA. Shesty will never win another Vezina, though he might elsewhere. This team cannot ever be better than the sum of its parts until it’s all been purged, and that includes moving players who SHOULD be untouchable like Fox. Does anyone think the 4 Nations tournament improved Fox’s value? Your team is having an absolutely unforgivably horrible year and you, with a still mostly intact reputation as a top 5 D in the world, go play in a best on best tournament and average the least minutes of ANY D on your team while putting up zero points and being on the ice for zero goals for? You think the hockey world doesn’t take you down a few pegs in their rankings? That will continue for EVERY Rangers player until this entire culture is purged and given a fresh start, because regardless of what they could be doing or are capable of, what they ARE doing, is being dog shit nightly. The end.
 
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LokiDog said:
That will continue for EVERY Rangers player until this entire culture is purged and given a fresh start, because regardless of what they could be doing or are capable of, what they ARE doing, is being dog shit nightly. The end.
Click to expand...

Well, the good thing is that we could get a franchise-changing player in the first round next ye....oh, right.
 
LokiDog said:
I honestly just do not like a single player on this team anymore. Cuylle came back to earth. He was always going to be more of a third liner that can slot up. He is what he is. I’m fine with it. Guys like Trochek, even Borgen, turn in solid efforts but they’re just not cogs. Same with the Carricks and Edstroms. They’re fine. Whoopty-doo.

The rot is so deeply ingrained that it really is essentially inescapable. If this were a house, it would not be refurbished or renovated. No one would say “it’s got good bones” and clean it up. They would say “the foundation is rotten” and tear it down. I’m sorry, that is simply the truth. The rot runs so deeply it is not possible to fix. It has to be torn down or it will just spread to any “fixes” and “additions” that you make to it.

Every player who is making more than $4M or has a term of more than 4 years is an absolute cancer. It’s not even their own faults. They were inducted into a club and culture when they got that paycheck. They assimilated into the prevailing culture. Fox, Lafreniere, Shesterkin? It isn’t their faults. They could probably each go and be great (for Fox and Shesterkin, be great AGAIN) elsewhere, completely separated from their “homies” and the NYR country club culture. While here? None of them will improve from what we are currently getting. It doesn’t matter if you move 2 or 3 of the guys I’m talking about. Every player earning more than 4-5M or who a long term deal is part of rot. Because the rot spreads.

Not one of them has avoided becoming infected with it. Fox could probably go to a different team and win another Norris one day. Here he will slide from top D in the league to top 3, top 5, top 10, top 20 until he’s no longer even viewed as elite. Lafreniere will never be remotely close to a 1OA. Shesty will never win another Vezina, though he might elsewhere. This team cannot ever be better than the sum of its parts until it’s all been purged, and that includes moving players who SHOULD be untouchable like Fox. Does anyone think the 4 Nations tournament improved Fox’s value? Your team is having an absolutely unforgivably horrible year and you, with a still mostly intact reputation as a top 5 D in the world, go play in a best on best tournament and average the least minutes of ANY D on your team while putting up zero points and being on the ice for zero goals for? You think the hockey world doesn’t take you down a few pegs in their rankings? That will continue for EVERY Rangers player until this entire culture is purged and given a fresh start, because regardless of what they could be doing or are capable of, what they ARE doing, is being dog shit nightly. The end.
Click to expand...
It's a deeply unlikable group of players. Makes me not really give a shit whether they win or lose.
 
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NickyFotiu said:
I'm sure they care enough to be crazy frustrated. Doesn't mean its enough.
Click to expand...

You don’t think Laffy is chewing bubble gum and cracking jokes on the plane right now with an ear to ear smile? Zib is asleep with his head on Kreider’s shoulder. Fox is sitting in Lindy’s lap kicking his feet like a toddler. JT is probably fuming and ready to ask for another trade. Shesterkin is deciding which hair band looks best.
 
Kakko was never gonna grow here anyways, he said it himself. At this stage the only thing people should be mad about in regards to him is that Drury dragged his ass trading him.

He should been traded f***ing 2 years ago
 
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LokiDog said:
I mean, 17 points in 24 games is far out pacing anything he ever did in NY, but whatever helps ya sleep.
Click to expand...

Except that it isn't?

He had 22 over a 34 game stretch in 2022-23.

Hell if I drop the final 10 games from that exact stretch its 16 in 24.

Considering the TOI difference, thats basically the same thing. It's easy to forget because of how much of a cluster f*** that season turned into but Kakko had a stretch where he really looked like he turned a corner and then... just fell back into old habits.

This is 6 in his last 11 with him and his line being caved along the way. It's almost as if his absurd OISH% wasn't going to hold up and *gasp* it hasn't.

That 11 game stretch is about half of his stay in Seattle mind you. IF you want to give a ton of weight to the games that proceeded it, then you have to give equal footing to this current stretch that he's in the midst of (if not more, because this actually lines up with what hes done over the other 300+ games he's played in the NHL)

Looks like more of the same. He's an NHL player and a pretty good one but he isn't the superstar or even sure fire top 6 player you and others are trying to wish cast him into.
 
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Please trade the UFAs and Kreider. Please trade Igor. Please...

If we get a top pick this year better hope we are great next year cause that draft is loaded.
 
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LiveLongandProspal said:
I don't know if I hate Drury as much as I hated Sather, but it's definitely up there. I got the sense that Sather was somewhat lazy in his old age and resting on his laurels. Drury is just flat-out not good at his job. He's just objectively bad.



Why would he? Drury has to prove himself to Dolan and he just traded our first round pick next year (let's face it, we're going to keep our pick this year because we're not making the playoffs). He extended Igor, he traded for Miller, he extended Borgen...these are not rebuild-signaling moves.

It's like Joe Schoen with the Giants. Everyone knows he's on the hot seat, so why would he care if he went all-in on this season? What does he have to lose? He either wins and keeps his job or he loses and doesn't. He's not looking 2-3-4 years into the future.

Desperation can make a man do drastic (and stupid) things.
Click to expand...

You can't compare the situation of a team in the Rangers' shoes and the Giants' shoes, The Giants have been a laughing stock for over a decade.

I have legit beef with two moves that Drury has ever made but they were huge blunders. The Buchnevich trade and the absolute bain of my existence Igor Shesterkin's signing. He literally moved Trouba's contract just so he could sign Shesterkin because he was worried he would let the Rangers' Saquon Barkley go or something. Shesterkin is an absolute stain on this organization and I have literally never hated a player more. And I have to look at hist stupid f***ing face until I'm more than halfway in the ground (if I'm lucky). He f***ing SUNK this organization with this signing. It was atrocious beyond belief.
 
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MrAlmost said:
Please trade the UFAs and Kreider. Please trade Igor. Please...

If we get a top pick this year better hope we are great next year cause that draft is loaded.
Click to expand...
Might as well give the pick to Pittsburgh this year and then really let the bottom fall out after this season.
 
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MrAlmost said:
Please trade the UFAs and Kreider. Please trade Igor. Please...

If we get a top pick this year better hope we are great next year cause that draft is loaded.
Click to expand...

I have a feeling that some of the things that snowflake Ranger fans cry about with Drury is Drury putting his nuts on the table. You know being ruthless and getting rid of bad contracts. Now is his opportunity to do the ultimate nuts on the table move and trade the stain that is Shesterkin before his toxic NMC kicks in.
 
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LokiDog said:
You don’t think Laffy is chewing bubble gum and cracking jokes on the plane right now with an ear to ear smile? Zib is asleep with his head on Kreider’s shoulder. Fox is sitting in Lindy’s lap kicking his feet like a toddler. JT is probably fuming and ready to ask for another trade. Shesterkin is deciding which hair band looks best.
Click to expand...
No probably not. They are probably really frustrated and mad at themselves and each other.
 
GoAwayPanarin said:
Except that it isn't?

He had 22 over a 34 game stretch in 2022-23.

Hell if I drop the final 10 games from that exact stretch its 16 in 24.

Considering the TOI difference, thats basically the same thing. It's easy to forget because of how much of a cluster f*** that season turned into but Kakko had a stretch where he really looked like he turned a corner and then... just fell back into old habits.

This is 6 in his last 11 with him and his line being caved along the way. It's almost as if his absurd OISH% wasn't going to hold up and *gasp* it hasn't.

That 11 game stretch is about half of his stay in Seattle mind you. IF you want to give a ton of weight to the games that proceeded it, then you have to give equal footing to this current stretch that he's in the midst of (if not more, because this actually lines up with what hes done over the other 300+ games he's played in the NHL)

Looks like more of the same. He's an NHL player and a pretty good one but he isn't the superstar or even sure fire top 6 player you and others are trying to wish cast him into.
Click to expand...
Except that it is. His pace over a selection of games in a larger sampling of games while a Ranger is irrelevant. Doing 22 in 34 and finishing with only 40 in 82 is meaningless. In no season as a Ranger did he finish with a better point per game than when he did 40 in 82. Thus far as a Kraken he is pacing for 55. If he continues that pace until the end of the season, that will be what he has paced for as a Kraken. It won’t be an isolated “I remember when he had X points in Y games (but still finished with A in B)” and it won’t be “if you subtract the last X games where he only had 2 points, he had Y in Z”. It will simply be, as a Kraken, this is what he has done. So far, as a Kraken, he has 18 points in 25 games. And I’m not wish casting him as anything - certainly not a star and barely a fringe second line winger, if that. It’s a skating league. He doesn’t have the skating, nor the compete to make up for it. I’m simply comfortable acknowledging he’s been better since he got out of the situation in NY. I don’t need to put down every other team and player in the league to feel good about our guys.

The same people who think it’s sacrilege to criticize certain Rangers also think it’s sacrilege to give any non Ranger an ounce of credit. Jack Hughes? Too small and soft, wouldn’t even want him. Matthews? Playoff choker, would never want him here. Draisaitl? Without McDavid he would just be another Zibanejad if we got him. Kucherov? He’s just Panarin, if it wasn’t for Hedman and Point he has the same number of Cups. Makar? Well if Fox played with Mackinnon he’d be averaging 90 points a year. Tkachuk? Overrated. Other Tkachuk? Overrated. Stutzle? Soft diver, no need.

I personally don’t give a shit that Kakko was traded. He wasn’t ever going to be an impact player here and I don’t really love his game even if he is pacing better now. But I have no problem accepting that he is looking a lot more likely to achieve 50-60 points now that he’s gotten out of NY. I’m not complaining about the trade at all. Never have. I’m not pining for Kakko, or even talking shit about Drury. I just don’t have the fragility to be incapable of allowing players who aren’t Rangers to have accomplishments. In addition to hating our team and its rotten culture (warranted) we may also be the most insecure fan base when it comes to denying that any player on any team other than ours is truly deserving of any praise they receive.
 
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LokiDog said:
I honestly just do not like a single player on this team anymore. Cuylle came back to earth. He was always going to be more of a third liner that can slot up. He is what he is. I’m fine with it. Guys like Trochek, even Borgen, turn in solid efforts but they’re just not cogs. Same with the Carricks and Edstroms. They’re fine. Whoopty-doo.

The rot is so deeply ingrained that it really is essentially inescapable. If this were a house, it would not be refurbished or renovated. No one would say “it’s got good bones” and clean it up. They would say “the foundation is rotten” and tear it down. I’m sorry, that is simply the truth. The rot runs so deeply it is not possible to fix. It has to be torn down or it will just spread to any “fixes” and “additions” that you make to it.

Every player who is making more than $4M or has a term of more than 4 years is an absolute cancer. It’s not even their own faults. They were inducted into a club and culture when they got that paycheck. They assimilated into the prevailing culture. Fox, Lafreniere, Shesterkin? It isn’t their faults. They could probably each go and be great (for Fox and Shesterkin, be great AGAIN) elsewhere, completely separated from their “homies” and the NYR country club culture. While here? None of them will improve from what we are currently getting. It doesn’t matter if you move 2 or 3 of the guys I’m talking about. Every player earning more than 4-5M or who is on a long term deal is part of rot. Because the rot spreads.

Not one of them has avoided becoming infected with it. Fox could probably go to a different team and win another Norris one day. Here he will slide from top D in the league to top 3, top 5, top 10, top 20 until he’s no longer even viewed as elite. Lafreniere will never be remotely close to a 1OA. Shesty will never win another Vezina, though he might elsewhere. This team cannot ever be better than the sum of its parts until it’s all been purged, and that includes moving players who SHOULD be untouchable like Fox. Does anyone think the 4 Nations tournament improved Fox’s value? Your team is having an absolutely unforgivably horrible year and you, with a still mostly intact reputation as a top 5 D in the world, go play in a best on best tournament and average the least minutes of ANY D on your team while putting up zero points and being on the ice for zero goals for? You think the hockey world doesn’t take you down a few pegs in their rankings? That will continue for EVERY Rangers player until this entire culture is purged and given a fresh start, because regardless of what they could be doing or are capable of, what they ARE doing, is being dog shit nightly. The end.
Click to expand...
Cuylle had a solid rookie year, then a very good first half of this year and is still paced for 21 goals and 43 points in his 2nd year after turning 23 less than a month ago

"always gonna be" is a wild statement with that as your metrics to go off of lol

No reason you can't easily see a world where his prime years are a very good 2nd liner that score 25-25 with strong forechecking and solid defense.
 
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