Speculation: Roster Building Thread : Part XVI (Playoffs or Retool?)

[UnparalledPark]

Z isn't the worst player on the team. No one said that and it's silly to suggest it.

He is the 3rd worst player on the team. Behind Lindgren and Kreider, respectively. Haha

Wise guy. LOL

 

[Machinehead]

Not sure what you mean. Are you saying the only difference between 2025 Zib and 2020 Zib is shooting luck?

Partially, yes. His actual performance is somewhere in between pacing for 60 goals and pacing for 16. Cold take.

That's a fire-year difference, tho.

I thought we were talking about Cuylle where people have tried to explain his hot and cold runs all year and it's literally just shooting percentage.

Taking that line as a whole, that threesome [] has a 3.7% on-ice shooting percentage this year. Yes, that will normalize. I literally don't care if Zibanejad sucks. That shooting percentage is unearthly. Random kids playing in the CHL who won't go pro in North America would shoot better than that over 82 games. Tanner Glass shot 5.8%.

 

[bl02]

Trade for JT. Move Kreider in a separate deal. JT improves us in every area we are lacking(PP, top 6 finishing, leadership). Mika and Panarin are also playing for their Rangers careers imo and can and should be moved this summer if the trend continues.

I hear you but who is taking 93 this summer? Forget about the points or stats but if any GM watches the Rangers why would you want a guy that plays his style of hockey? He is allergic to winning any kind of 1 on 1 battle.

 

[bl02]

zib should go yesterday
our vets returning profit should be moved now
Kreider eventually but if he is healthy enuf by end of next year, and is willing to give us sweetheart deal 1 yr at a time like 3.5-4 per, I say he is worth keeping

Unless someone overpays for CK which I think is still a possibilty. It's definitely possible with his reputation around the league. Heck we got a decent deal for Trouba who's contract was 10x worse.

 

[Row I Goon]

PP1 will outlast time itself.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Partially, yes. His actual performance is somewhere in between pacing for 60 goals and pacing for 16. Cold take.

That's a fire-year difference, tho.

I thought we were talking about Cuylle where people have tried to explain his hot and cold runs all year and it's literally just shooting percentage.

Taking that line as a whole, that threesome [] has a 3.7% on-ice shooting percentage this year. Yes, that will normalize. I literally don't care if Zibanejad sucks. That shooting percentage is unearthly. Random kids playing in the CHL who won't go pro in North America would shoot better than that over 82 games. Tanner Glass shot 5.8%.

Oh. Well the Cuylle thing is easily explained , all his goals get waived off

 

[HockeyBasedNYC]

If he's playing so well why is he still at an Overall of 1?

He has 3 goals & 5 assists in 15 games since the Christmas break. That's not exactly lighting it up, but I know you'll tell us all just how good his x/GF numbers are. Regardless, he needs to score. He's paid as our 1C & the team relies on him to produce.

And 5 of those 8 points are PP points.

3 even strength points in the last 15 games.

Brett Howden has 5 more even strength points than Mika.

8.5 m. You can understand the frustration

 

[McRanger92]

I hear you but who is taking 93 this summer? Forget about the points or stats but if any GM watches the Rangers why would you want a guy that plays his style of hockey? He is allergic to winning any kind of 1 on 1 battle.

I dont envy Drury

 

[bl02]

And 5 of those 8 points are PP points.

3 even strength points in the last 15 games.

Brett Howden has 5 more even strength points than Mika.

8.5 m. You can understand the frustration

3 ES points lol But he's generating. What he's generating I have no idea.
He's just unlucky that's all.

 

[bl02]

PP1 will outlast time itself.

That is why I hope GP doesn't come here until Panarin, CK and somehow 93 are all gone. Even then I doubt he will be given a real chance on the pp.

 

[JimmyG89]

Partially, yes. His actual performance is somewhere in between pacing for 60 goals and pacing for 16. Cold take.

What's amazing is this isn't hyperbole either. Players that aren't playing well can also be unlucky.

I'd say for the last few weeks, he's been decent. 8.5M isn't supposed to be decent. Is it possible he keeps improving? Maybe 4 Nations will be a little wakeup call that it isn't just the Rangers going sour on you. Or it could give him new confidence if he does well.

If Mika had Chytil's deal, I don't think we'd be talking nearly as much about him.

 

[bernmeister]

Unless someone overpays for CK which I think is still a possibilty. It's definitely possible with his reputation around the league. Heck we got a decent deal for Trouba who's contract was 10x worse.

fair but as I posted earlier
actual damaged Kreider <<< than traditional recent Kreider

my pt is even for sake of argument you want to lean to a trade rather than keep and use with youth being added
even if you go there
does the value of what you get now greatly exceed [at least more than nominally] what you get later on a healthier kreider?
b'c if you (or anyone else) can't honestly demonstrate that objectively,
neither 'you nor anyone else should not be on a deal him now bandwagon

I honestly find it hard to believe Kreider gets more now
peeps pls feel free to suggest hypotheticals, but SUBSTANITATE

 

[bernmeister]

Yeah, Kreider needs to go, even though he leads team in GWG. But wait, now GWG is a meaningless stat. But hey, he’s 2nd on the team in goals. But hey 1/3 of his goals are on the PP so that doesn’t count, and besides, being on the PP is taking valuable time away from our young scoring juggernauts on the team.

Maybe getting rid of Kreider will allow some of the young guys to step up, but frankly I’m not overly confident about it. But won’t getting J.T cause the same problem. It seems Drury will keep the older guys around as long as they are performing, and the team is winning, but it doesn’t seem that the young guys are going to be given anything, they’re gonna have to earn it. I think Othman and Perrault may be the two that can do that. I hope to see Othman up here soon.

excellent post
only forgot to put in the sarcasm emoji to eliminate being quoted out of context

 

[Paulie Walnutz]

And 5 of those 8 points are PP points.

3 even strength points in the last 15 games.

Brett Howden has 5 more even strength points than Mika.

8.5 m. You can understand the frustration

I’m convinced that poster is either Mika himself, his agent, or a sibling at this point.

 

[Paulie Walnutz]

 

[will1066]

I’m convinced that poster is either Mika himself, his agent, or a sibling at this point.

Does he have ziblings?

 

[NickyFotiu]

Not sure what you mean. Are you saying the only difference between 2025 Zib and 2020 Zib is shooting luck?

Zib used to be a pretty good two way player. I could live with less offense but Ive been puzzled by his defense.

 

[mrmovies779]

Zib used to be a pretty good two way player. I could live with less offense but Ive been puzzled by his defense.

That's easy...he's getting out-muscled all over the ice and losing every puck battle...also has a hard time staying with his man.hes playing with the strength of a 5 year old this year.

 

[NickyFotiu]

That's easy...he's getting out-muscled all over the ice and losing every puck battle...also has a hard time staying with his man.hes playing with the strength of a 5 year old this year.

Vegan jokes aside where did his strength and determination go? This hasn't been the guy I saw in the playoffs vs Pitt 3 seasons ago.

 

[Alluckks]

Partially, yes. His actual performance is somewhere in between pacing for 60 goals and pacing for 16. Cold take.

That's a fire-year difference, tho.

I thought we were talking about Cuylle where people have tried to explain his hot and cold runs all year and it's literally just shooting percentage.

Taking that line as a whole, that threesome [] has a 3.7% on-ice shooting percentage this year. Yes, that will normalize. I literally don't care if Zibanejad sucks. That shooting percentage is unearthly. Random kids playing in the CHL who won't go pro in North America would shoot better than that over 82 games. Tanner Glass shot 5.8%.

Cuylle can clearly get himself into position to receive a pass for a high danger chance, and he clearly helps on defense and helps drive transition offense the other way. Maybe it is all just shooting percentage, but we can at least entertain the idea that there are things influencing the production beyond that. Like a teammate that has been god awful and at driving any play this year. A teammate who can't for the life of him carry the puck well, create offense, or complete a clean pass in the offensive zone at 5v5. Maybe those things influence actual production versus just high danger chance percentage. It may also influence shooting percentage, when the shots are now being forced in worse off ways.

Zib is such a common denominator between so many things going to complete f***ing ass. It cannot be ignored.

If there was a magical world where we got JT Miller and didn't give up Chytil, I earnestly believe that the team would be better off with Zib benched over any of our other 3 centers plus Miller. Zib and Kreider can take turns playing rock paper scissors before each game to see whose turn it is to go out there and bum around on wing while Lavi force feeds him 18 minutes.

 

[noncents]

I know there's a lot of frustration with Zibanejad. and I know this is the speculation thread where we postulate and fantasize, consort and bedevil.

But there's no way we're moving him. He's paid too much, buyout proof, he's fallen too far, he's ingrained in the leadership and culture, and he has a NMC.

I try to be positive about Zib. He's not going anywhere. Good thing is, with cap rising, a 2C overpaid at 8.5 isn't a killer. could also become a 1W at some point

 

[McRanger92]

I’m convinced that poster is either Mika himself, his agent, or a sibling at this point.

Webster part 2

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Cuylle can clearly get himself into position to receive a pass for a high danger chance, and he clearly helps on defense and helps drive transition offense the other way. Maybe it is all just shooting percentage, but we can at least entertain the idea that there are things influencing the production beyond that. Like a teammate that has been god awful and at driving any play this year. A teammate who can't for the life of him carry the puck well, create offense, or complete a clean pass in the offensive zone at 5v5. Maybe those things influence actual production versus just high danger chance percentage. It may also influence shooting percentage, when the shots are now being forced in worse off ways.

Zib is such a common denominator between so many things going to complete f***ing ass. It cannot be ignored.

If there was a magical world where we got JT Miller and didn't give up Chytil, I earnestly believe that the team would be better off with Zib benched over any of our other 3 centers plus Miller. Zib and Kreider can take turns playing rock paper scissors before each game to see whose turn it is to go out there and bum around on wing while Lavi force feeds him 18 minutes.

That would reflect in other areas and it just doesn't. You said it yourself, Cuylle puts himself in good positions to shoot. If he's doing that and he's putting pucks on net (and he has, he has the most individual high danger chances on the team since Jan 5) that means that the line is doing their job offensively and someone is getting him the puck in those areas.

Someone tried to compare what is happening with Cuylle to what happened with Kakko when he played with that line. It isn't a good comparison.

When you're dropping nearly a 4 piece per 60 and you've scored 2 as a group, thats not "hey they're not doing things the right way to score goals" thats "they're doing everything right to score goals except actually score." Players, lines and sometimes entire ass teams go through stretches like this. Jay Woodcroft lost his job last year because of this and the 2013-14 Rangers went through half a season where they collectively like a group shot like this (it turned around as well all know.)

The analysis you applied to Cuylle-Zibanejad-Smith would actually apply to Kreider-Zibanejad-Kakko. That was a line that didn't do enough to generate good offensive chances.

Now at a certain point, you need to start burying chances so on that end I agree. I just think that trying to pigeon hole Zibanejad as someone who has been problematic lately or that he's bringing Cuylle down is just horribly lazy analysis that isn't even close to accurate. No other line has come close to replicating the amount of chances that line has been able to put together, and our top 9 has more or less been pretty good during "the resurgence!"

He deserved all the flack in the world of how he played in Oct-Dec. If January is what is he is from this point forward I'd be more than okay with that. Not only is that a player who is going to end up lucking into points along the way, but thats also one who will start to produce through the strength of his own play.

Thats also someone another team will want to trade for in the summer.

 

[egelband]

Does he have ziblings?

We need a tomato emoji bad!

 

[Overcast]

I know there's a lot of frustration with Zibanejad. and I know this is the speculation thread where we postulate and fantasize, consort and bedevil.

But there's no way we're moving him. He's paid too much, buyout proof, he's fallen too far, he's ingrained in the leadership and culture, and he has a NMC.

I try to be positive about Zib. He's not going anywhere. Good thing is, with cap rising, a 2C overpaid at 8.5 isn't a killer. could also become a 1W at some point

This is about the only stance to take with his NMC. For whatever reason I always forget that he doesn't have a team-crippling cap hit, but regardless everyone wants more everything out of him the same way everyone wanted more everything from Trouba. That's not a big ask from guys that were labeled as team leaders and were supposedly here to be leaned on to win games.

He's going to be a Ranger for the foreseeable future, might as well hope that he gets better during that time and then figure out what to do once he's too sad to lace em up after Kreider gets traded.