Speculation: Roster Building Thread : Part XV (Light em up!)

[GoAwayPanarin]

Smart teams do not trade prospects with high ceilings for veterans.

I asked this yesterday when everyone was hemming and hawing that we'd trade Bread, Lindgren, Trocheck, Kreider, Smith and Vesey and receive all picks in the first 3 rounds for the next 4 years:

Which high end or elite-ceiling prospect (at time of trade) in the past 3 years has been moved for a veteran?

Define veteran.

 

[GAGLine]

Bennett has been good for the Panthers, but he seems like Goodrow 2.0. He's a better offensive player than Goodrow, but like Goodrow, we'd be getting him at the wrong time. We'd be making the same mistake, overpaying for what he has become rather than finding him and cashing in on that potential when he was significantly cheaper.

Can we be more forward thinking? Can we target a player who may be the next Bennett? Maybe Frederic is that player, I don't know, but I'd rather be proactive than reactive.

 

[haohmaru]

The Rangers are not trading for a bucket or two of draft picks.

 

[noncents]

Define veteran.

let's call it someone on a UFA contract or in UFA years via extension

 

[MrAlmost]

Smart teams do not trade prospects with high ceilings for veterans.

I asked this yesterday when everyone was hemming and hawing that we'd trade Bread, Lindgren, Trocheck, Kreider, Smith and Vesey and receive all picks in the first 3 rounds for the next 4 years:

Which high end or elite-ceiling prospect (at time of trade) in the past 3 years has been moved for a veteran?

Teams trade prospects of all types and draft picks in every round every single year. Before the deadline. At the deadline. Before the draft. At the draft. There are trades to be had.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Teams are not going to trade for Kreider, his back injury is basically a full NMC

conveniently enough for him right

 

[GAGLine]

Smart teams do not trade prospects with high ceilings for veterans.

I asked this yesterday when everyone was hemming and hawing that we'd trade Bread, Lindgren, Trocheck, Kreider, Smith and Vesey and receive all picks in the first 3 rounds for the next 4 years:

Which high end or elite-ceiling prospect (at time of trade) in the past 3 years has been moved for a veteran?

David Edstrom has been traded twice since being drafted. The first time, he was traded for Hertl.

Maybe there's some question on his ceiling, I don't know, but he seems to fit the bill.

Edit: Going back a bit further, Nick Suzuki was traded for Pacioretty.

Both of these are Vegas though, so maybe that says more about them than the league in general.

That said, top prospects do get traded for a variety of reasons. Just because we'd be trading a vet for a top prospect doesn't mean we have to limit the probability to that exact scenario.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

let's call it someone on a UFA contract or in UFA years via extension

Claude Giroux returned a boat load a few years ago as a rental fronted by Owen Tippett.

That was a Bill Zito trade too.

 

[noncents]

Bennett has been good for the Panthers, but he seems like Goodrow 2.0. He's a better offensive player than Goodrow, but like Goodrow, we'd be getting him at the wrong time. We'd be making the same mistake, overpaying for what he has become rather than finding him and cashing in on that potential when he was significantly cheaper.

Can we be more forward thinking? Can we target a player who may be the next Bennett? Maybe Frederic is that player, I don't know, but I'd rather be proactive than reactive.

bennett also has 4th Overall pedigree. we should be in on those guys

 

[GAGLine]

bennett also has 4th Overall pedigree. we should be in on those guys

Seattle has a guy that was taken 2nd overall...

 

[Machinehead]

Bennett profiles as a guy that ages extremely poorly and has a terrible contract within a couple of years.

You never pay for somebody else's grit. You find your own.

 

[noncents]

Teams trade prospects of all types and draft picks in every round every single year. Before the deadline. At the deadline. Before the draft. At the draft. There are trades to be had.

David Edstrom has been traded twice since being drafted. The first time, he was traded for Hertl.

Maybe there's some question on his ceiling, I don't know, but he seems to fit the bill.

Edit: Going back a bit further, Nick Suzuki was traded for Pacioretty.

Both of these are Vegas though, so maybe that says more about them than the league in general.

MrAlmost didn't answer the question, and GAG you're correct - it's a Vegas thing. they're the wheelers and dealers.

Claude Giroux returned a boat load a few years ago as a rental fronted by Owen Tippett.

That was a Bill Zito trade too.

Tippett was similar to Kakko - a significant disappointment with production. Zito made the move much earlier than Drury did - pre-emptying the loss in value that Machinehead talks about.

These are not examples that are reassuring. Teams are getting smarter about trading high end prospects. Even the dumb teams. Especially high end defense prospects.

conveniently enough for him right

it's not an accident. he doesn't want to leave.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Sam Bennett hasn't played a full slate of games since the Rangers sent out the letter.

Guys who miss a ton of games in their 20's are a pretty sure bet to miss even more in their 30's.

Now remember that and repeat it when someone brings up Eichel.

 

[bernmeister]

Smart teams do not trade prospects with high ceilings for veterans.

I asked this yesterday when everyone was hemming and hawing that we'd trade Bread, Lindgren, Trocheck, Kreider, Smith and Vesey and receive all picks in the first 3 rounds for the next 4 years:

Which high end or elite-ceiling prospect (at time of trade) in the past 3 years has been moved for a veteran?

It is correct that the bold is a rule.
There can be ISOLATED exceptions, based on specific circumstances.

A team that screwed itself and is too old to retool and wants more shot before tearing it all down is a more obvious one [think of CHI late after cup runs].

There may be others

But another is the price paid vs what is obtained.
We got Vats for a 4th, should have extended
We pissed away picks on several rentals which was bad biz

Here I am asking one primo prospect and a flip on 2 picks [not the surrender of 2 picks w/nothing going the other way] for a retained Panarin for 2 runs
bread is not just a generic "veteran" he is elite
that justifies a higher price.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

MrAlmost didn't answer the question, and GAG you're correct - it's a Vegas thing. they're the wheelers and dealers.
Tippett was similar to Kakko - a significant disappointment with production. Zito made the move much earlier than Drury did - pre-emptying the loss in value that Machinehead talks about.

These are not examples that are reassuring. Teams are getting smarter about trading high end prospects. Even the dumb teams. Especially high end defense prospects.


it's not an accident. he doesn't want to leave.

He's not similar to Kakko. He was on the last year of his ELC, Kakko is a year away from UFA.

His playoff history here is shit, but Panarin would be the biggest name to move at the deadline in forever. There isn't a one to one comp.

 

[MrAlmost]

MrAlmost didn't answer the question, and GAG you're correct - it's a Vegas thing. they're the wheelers and dealers.
Tippett was similar to Kakko - a significant disappointment with production. Zito made the move much earlier than Drury did - pre-emptying the loss in value that Machinehead talks about.

These are not examples that are reassuring. Teams are getting smarter about trading high end prospects. Even the dumb teams. Especially high end defense prospects.


it's not an accident. he doesn't want to leave.

I wasn't aware there was a question. Just stated the fact that trades happen every year and it is very possible we could be apart of that this year.

 

[Siddi]

Bennett profiles as a guy that ages extremely poorly and has a terrible contract within a couple of years.

You never pay for somebody else's grit. You find your own.

I dont understand the hype for Bennett. Never cracked 50 points and a liability defensively. Are people dick riding because that one time he cheapshotted Marchand?

 

[Levitate]

conveniently enough for him right

IMO If his back injury is that bad then they should LTIR him for the rest of the season

enough of this bullshit. If you can't play worth a shit then sit down and heal up and stop trying to act like you're worth a shit on the ice

 

[Profet]

IMO If his back injury is that bad then they should LTIR him for the rest of the season

enough of this bullshit. If you can't play worth a shit then sit down and heal up and stop trying to act like you're worth a shit on the ice

The NHLPA has entered the chat.

 

[Machinehead]

I dont understand the hype for Bennett. Never cracked 50 points and a liability defensively. Are people dick riding because that one time he cheapshotted Marchand?

Short answer: yes.

We're still talking the same old good body nonsense. Like we're selling jeans. Like we're looking for Fabio.

 

[Profet]

We're re-arranging the deck chairs on the titanic until/unless we get a true #1 center.

#1 center + #1 d-man

You can have whatever else, but you need those two things.

 

[SA16]

The Rangers will not be placing Kreider on LTIR, even if hurt, because there is zero reason to do so at any point with the amount of cap space they have.

 

[UnparalledPark]

This is one of the scenarios where the other team hangs up if the offer doesn't start with Perreault.

Perrault doesn’t have the size Boston typically looks for.

 

[Machinehead]

Perrault doesn’t have the size Boston typically looks for.

Boston hasn't been a big team in like, a decade. This is a meme.

 

[DanielBrassard]

If McAvoy was a possibility we need him to do us a solid and make it known he’d only accept a trade here lol.