Speculation: Roster Building Thread : Part XV (Light em up!)

[CasusBelli]

I'm sort of leaning towards more of a soft reset for a couple of reasons. One, like you said, there needs to be a vision. A full teardown gives you a vision with no pieces in it. That's much harder to complete. Two, there's already a solid group of young players existing, which again, is hard to replace if you have to do everything.

The thing that gives me pause is that the existing group of young players is mostly depth. We need to bring in the entire core group of forwards (only 1D and G are penciled in) and that's the hardest to acquire.

That being said, I don't think the Alexis Lafreniere/Will Cuylle Rangers are preventing us from getting good draft picks tbh.

If they want to step back for a couple of years and hit the 2026 UFA class, the #1 goal is to get rid of Zibanejad's contract before that by any means necessary.

I know this wasn’t directed at me, but I wanted to emphasize the need for a vision (management and coaching), and then roster building around it, but noting that you can’t teach an old dog new tricks. So we need to start by asking: what is our identity? Physicality? Speed? Shutdown defense? We need to pick one area and just drill into it; be the best at it (my thinking is conditioning and defense). Then out with the lazy guys and the low IQ guys. Out with Igor because he’s a locker room cancer. That probably puts us at bottom-five for the next five years, but a combination of prudent drafting, UFA signings and development could put us back in playoff contention by the end of the decade. Best case.

Just a shame to think that we’ll likely be a lottery team on our centennial season at this rate.

 

[NYR Viper]

Only Kreider + Lindgren being dealt would probably be the softer reset option I suppose. Probably the bare minimum at this point, no?

Add Smith to this group and likely yes, that’s the bare minimum

 

[Machinehead]

i wanna hear more about the machinehead lokidog meetup and ensuing beef

There's no beef.

I'm tired of the high school shit posting about players' personal lives and I'm going to continue calling out everyone who does it like I've been doing for years.

That's welcome on Twitter if you feel the need to do it.

 

[Boris Zubov]

There's no beef.

I'm tired of the high school shit posting about players' personal lives and I'm going to continue calling out everyone who does it like I've been doing for years.

That's welcome on Twitter if you feel the need to do it.

Is it a rumor that Loki doesn't eat beef?

 

[Filip Chytil]

Whoever is on the roster, it involves acquiring a young center to build around. A true top center.

You need that player for a successful rebuild.

McDavid, Hughes, MacKinnon, Crosby, Matthews. All #1 overall picks.

Barkov. 2nd overall.

Eichel. 1st overall.

Point was a 3rd round pick.

Maybe they win the lottery and get the #1 overall pick and grab an elite C. I'm not banking on getting a Point in the 3rd round.

Hintz was a 2nd round pick. He's not Mackinnon, but a damn good player. Aho. 2nd round pick.

If the goal is a mutant 1C like Mackinnon, then we're probably going to need to get a #1 overall pick. Either by sucking that bad or getting some lottery luck.

Add Smith to this group and likely yes, that’s the bare minimum

I forgot about Smith. Yes, him too.

 

[FIRE DRURY]

 

[Machinehead]

I know this wasn’t directed at me, but I wanted to emphasize the need for a vision (management and coaching), and then roster building around it, but noting that you can’t teach an old dog new tricks. So we need to start by asking: what is our identity? Physicality? Speed? Shutdown defense? We need to pick one area and just drill into it; be the best at it (my thinking is conditioning and defense). Then out with the lazy guys and the low IQ guys. Out with Igor because he’s a locker room cancer. That probably puts us at bottom-five for the next five years, but a combination of prudent drafting, UFA signings and development could put us back in playoff contention by the end of the decade. Best case.

Just a shame to think that we’ll likely be a lottery team on our centennial season at this rate.

The identity I want to develop is a high IQ team that plays fast.

A team I always go back to really liking stylistically is the 2014 into most of 2015 run. Everyone talked about how fast that team was.

Not f***in Brad Richards! Sure as hell not Derek Stepan, my God. Rick Nash wasn't that fast. Kevin Hayes was pretty slow. The defense was completely immobile outside of McDonagh.

That team played fast because almost everyone on the roster excelled at processing the game.

This team sucks at it. The only guys I really like under pressure with a hundred things being thrown at them are Fox and Chytil. Even Panarin leans way too much on "let me stand here and wait for a pass that only I can hit" and if it doesn't materialize, it's a turnover. He doesn't come up with alternatives on the fly. Kreider is smart in between games in terms of understanding his abilities and how to apply them, and he deserves a lot of credit for re-inventing himself as he lost his speed. In game, he's pretty meh at reading and reacting. I'd throw Cuylle into the same boat. Everyone else is a brainlet.

That's why our offense is so boring and ineffective at 5v5. They don't see opportunities develop. They play catch until the other team makes an obvious mistake, and if they don't, we just don't score. The powerplay got by on talent for a few years but it's becoming the same paint by numbers bullshit. They can't move their feet and get chaos going on the powerplay like good teams do, because they can't process that.

 

[Machinehead]

View attachment 953067

With the Temu ad and everything!

 

[Machinehead]

Guys, I'm not reading about DeAngelo today. I'm just not doing it.

 

[TGWL]

I know this wasn’t directed at me, but I wanted to emphasize the need for a vision (management and coaching), and then roster building around it, but noting that you can’t teach an old dog new tricks. So we need to start by asking: what is our identity? Physicality? Speed? Shutdown defense? We need to pick one area and just drill into it; be the best at it (my thinking is conditioning and defense). Then out with the lazy guys and the low IQ guys. Out with Igor because he’s a locker room cancer. That probably puts us at bottom-five for the next five years, but a combination of prudent drafting, UFA signings and development could put us back in playoff contention by the end of the decade. Best case.

Just a shame to think that we’ll likely be a lottery team on our centennial season at this rate.

I'm not sure if you just mean for this season or in general, but in general you can't just pick one of those and say "We're going to be the best at it" and expect results will completely be in your favor. That's a big commitment to completely mismanage into another disaster. If you say we're going to be fast, play fast, skate fast, forecheck fast, everything at sonic speed, that doesn't just remove flaws or shoot you to cup contenders. I have no doubt that this team isn't looking for a 5 year plan to be contenders at the end of the decade.

 

[UAGoalieGuy]

Kreider, Lindgren, Borgen, Smith and Vesey should be gone by the TDL. See if Quick wants one more kick at a championship as a backup on a contender.

Summer the team needs to take a hard look at capitalizing on Panarin and what they can do to fill that void (a void that seems to be growing smaller by the game at this point). Then figuring something out with Zib. Might as well move Jones in the summer as well.

In my opinion, the only players that should be with the team that are currently rostered are:

Zib (not by choice but by contract), Shesh, Laff, Trocheck, Chytil, Fox, Miller, Schneider, Vaak, Cuylle, Edstrom, Rempe (if he doesn't get perma-banned before the end of the season), Carrick (13th/14th forward) and Berard.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

If they were truly committed to righting the ship, you fire Drury and tell the next guy “these players need to go, figure out how to get it done”

if they allow Drury to trade all these pieces there is no point in firing him after the work is done.

 

[RangerBoy]

Buffalo won their third straight game today. They had have played two more games than the Rangers and are one point behind them. Buffalo lost 13 or 14 games in a row and they are right there with the Rangers. Detroit is winning. They could be one point behind the Rangers too. Montreak is up 1-0 on TB. Montreal is tied with the Rangers in points. 33.

 

[Machinehead]

If they were truly committed to righting the ship, you fire Drury and tell the next guy “these players need to go, figure out how to get it done”

if they allow Drury to trade all these pieces there is no point in firing him after the work is done.

Who would be telling him? Dolan?

I don't necessarily buy into the meme that Dolan wouldn't know who Mika Zibanejad is, but he definitely doesn't have a professional understanding of who's bad and why.

This is why I hate the idea of the GM also being the president.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Only Kreider + Lindgren being dealt would probably be the softer reset option I suppose. Probably the bare minimum at this point, no?

Yeah I’d say so.

Panarin Kreider and Zibanejad would be half the top 6 and your 3 highest paid forwards. That would be drastic.

 

[lakeshirts37]

A top 5 pick is an absolute pipe dream. You know this team is going to go on a little winning streak and ruin those chances

 

[JohnC]

"Ownership and management had no stomach for this. The hierarchy was not going to allow this flawed core to fire another head coach less than two years after beseeching GM Chris Drury to dismiss Gerard Gallant in May of 2023, 11 months after going to the conference final."

The Original Sin was allowing this group of loser snowflakes to fire Gallant after they quit on him, each other, the sweater, the fans, and the city two games into the first round of the 2023 playoffs against the Devils.

Revisionist history. The Rangers were the better team in the first 3 games of the Devils series, lost a back breaker of a game 3 in OT, then got outplayed and out coached in games 4-7.

That’s the story of this core, they completely fell apart after they hit a speed bump in any situation where they had control.

 

[CasusBelli]

The identity I want to develop is a high IQ team that plays fast.

A team I always go back to really liking stylistically is the 2014 into most of 2015 run. Everyone talked about how fast that team was.

Not f***in Brad Richards! Sure as hell not Derek Stepan, my God. Rick Nash wasn't that fast. Kevin Hayes was pretty slow. The defense was completely immobile outside of McDonagh.

That team played fast because almost everyone on the roster excelled at processing the game.

This team sucks at it. The only guys I really like under pressure with a hundred things being thrown at them are Fox and Chytil. Even Panarin leans way too much on "let me stand here and wait for a pass that only I can hit" and if it doesn't materialize, it's a turnover. He doesn't come up with alternatives on the fly. Kreider is smart in between games in terms of understanding his abilities and how to apply them, and he deserves a lot of credit for re-inventing himself as he lost his speed. In game, he's pretty meh at reading and reacting. I'd throw Cuylle into the same boat. Everyone else is a brainlet.

That's why our offense is so boring and ineffective at 5v5. They don't see opportunities develop. They play catch until the other team makes an obvious mistake, and if they don't, we just don't score. The powerplay got by on talent for a few years but it's becoming the same paint by numbers bullshit. They can't move their feet and get chaos going on the powerplay like good teams do, because they can't process that.

Hard to disagree with any of that. Looks like we’d need to follow the mold of the Panthers, since we don’t have the speed-skill combination for Oilers or Devils hockey. I’m thinking north-south hockey, with aggressive (and physical) forecheck with a trap at the blue line, zone defense collapsing in front of the net. Basically frustrate the hell out of the opponents until they make a mistake.

 

[Filip Chytil]

Bring back Sather as GM!!!

 

[HFsNumber1Heel]

Only Kreider + Lindgren being dealt would probably be the softer reset option I suppose. Probably the bare minimum at this point, no?

Kreider/Lindgren/Smith/Quick/Vesey/Vakaanainen/Borgen and maybe Jones and Carick. That's basically between 30-39% of the roster.

Hard to disagree with any of that. Looks like we’d need to follow the mold of the Panthers, since we don’t have the speed-skill combination for Oilers or Devils hockey. I’m thinking north-south hockey, with aggressive (and physical) forecheck with a trap at the blue line, zone defense collapsing in front of the net. Basically frustrate the hell out of the opponents until they make a mistake.

Drury favors players like this based on his drafting.

 

[CasusBelli]

I'm not sure if you just mean for this season or in general, but in general you can't just pick one of those and say "We're going to be the best at it" and expect results will completely be in your favor. That's a big commitment to completely mismanage into another disaster. If you say we're going to be fast, play fast, skate fast, forecheck fast, everything at sonic speed, that doesn't just remove flaws or shoot you to cup contenders. I have no doubt that this team isn't looking for a 5 year plan to be contenders at the end of the decade.

We have to play the chips we’re dealt. No doubt. We can’t play Florida style hockey with our roster. Nor can we play Oilers or Devils hockey. But I don’t see why we can’t focus on quick north-south puck movement and simple defensive zone collapses. This would take away missed assignments and minimize cross-ice pass interceptions. Also consider leaving one defenseman back / limit the pinching. The current system works if you have excellent skating defensemen who can recover from bad pinches in the offensive zone. That’s not us.

So all this to say: maybe a problem — not the problem — is in fact the coaching staff. The system just doesn’t work with this roster. So change the roster or change the system. Changing it won’t make us a Presidents trophy winner, but it will certainly make this season far more respectable, at least until we figure out this roster.

Drury favors players like this based on his drafting.

But it doesn’t match the coaching staff. And it contrasts sharply with the existing roster to boot. It’s just a cacophony.

 

[Machinehead]

Hard to disagree with any of that. Looks like we’d need to follow the mold of the Panthers, since we don’t have the speed-skill combination for Oilers or Devils hockey. I’m thinking north-south hockey, with aggressive (and physical) forecheck with a trap at the blue line, zone defense collapsing in front of the net. Basically frustrate the hell out of the opponents until they make a mistake.

Florida's very aggressive but they're not just a bunch of big idiots (ok, Sam Bennett is). For the most part, they're really good at processing the game and playing with speed even though they're not fast.

Their forecheck gets a lot of attention but their ability to move the puck away and get back on the forecheck is overlooked.

Not being able to stop defending is as much a problem with our offense as anything.

 

[n8]

Just thinking about total teardowns dream scenario on this lovely Sunday
The principle trade would be:
Artemi Panarin for WSH 2025 1st, Ryan Leonard
with the auxiliary part being:
(retained X%) for WSH 2025 2nd, Andrew Mangiapane (cap)

Of course we draft Hagens so we can run the Leonard-Hagens-Perrault line for years to come.
Vesey for a 6th
Carrick for a 6th
Smith for a 3rd
Lindgren for a 3rd
Borgen for a 3rd
Kreider (retained) for Bichsel + 2026 2nd. but I have no idea how this deal could work for Dallas cap-wise. I guess if we take Dumba? Kreider at 50% evens out.
Zibanejad (50% retained) for Oskar Sundqvist + Theo Lindstein

TDL-Tank roster would be:
Cuylle-Trocheck-Laf
Mangiapane-Chytil-Berard
Brodzinski-Sundqvist-Othmann
Edstrom-Sykora-Rempe
Belzile/Groulx

Miller-Fox
Schneider-Mancini
Vaakanainen-Dumba

Play 2026 to suck
Sign Eichel or McD that next summer after
Cuylle-McD-Laf
Leonard-Hagens-Perrault
Berard-Trocheck-Othmann
4th line rotation of Edstrom-Sykora-Roobroeck-Rempe

Bishsel-Fox
Miller-Schneider
UFA*-Mancini

*Lauzon, Logan Stanley, Andrew Peeke types on like a 3yr contract.
assuming Lindstein, Fortscue, Emery all not ready yet.
Open to trading Miller but not really sure what to do with him and what sort of deal would make sense there. Probably something lateral like i dunno, to BUF for Samuelsson? Jabait Gorton: to MTL for Guhle? Less likely to UHC for a Simashev or Lamoureux? A Miller trade could go in so many directions. Also not super sold on Mancini so that is another area to upgrade. Basically we need to rip the core out and redo our entire blueline.

 

[haohmaru]

That Brooks article was the most entertaining thing about the Rangers since mid October.

 

[LaffyTaffy13]

Guys, I'm not reading about DeAngelo today. I'm just not doing it.

He’d bring the team some much needed fire. That would be his main value but again, its a pointless convo as its never gonna happen.

Team needs more guys with fire hence the types of former players I pointed to in barnaby, theo fleury, sean avery, tda, lemeiux, callahan, dubinsky etx.