Speculation: Roster Building thread: Part XIX (Thanks, Sam)

[HatTrick Swayze]

I’ve seen Hagens ranked as low as 6 which is sort of wild because he was the guy a few months ago

I can understand why Hagen's is falling. His offensive game left a lot to be desired. Had a tough time producing on his own away from Leonard and Perrault. He'll be an NHLer but might be closer to a middle six two way C than an elite franchise defining player.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

Can you share where you see that posted?

It's everywhere...here's your personalized Google search:

Rangers are set up to face a brutal draft choice conundrum

There is an interesting scenario regarding the Rangers and their overall position in the standings.

nypost.com

 

[Mac n Gs]

I can understand why Hagen's is falling. His offensive game left a lot to be desired. Had a tough time producing on his own away from Leonard and Perrault. He'll be an NHLer but might be closer to a middle six two way C than an elite franchise defining player.

I’ve said it before, but he’s going to be good, but he’s going to be in the tier of Cs closer to Hischier than Jack Hughes. It’s still a very valuable piece to have for your organization, but you’re going to need that additional higher end piece to truly put your core over the top.

The top guys this year are Schaefer and Hagens. The next is Frondell, who has been absolutely unreal since coming back from injury. He’ll need time to cook in Sweden, but that kid is gonna be a stud.

 

[duhmetreE]

I'd take Hagens 1st overall AINEC. He reminds me of both Hughes & Eichel, he's the exact type of player we never get. Back to back lottery picks and neither of them are even NHL average skaters and have no stand out tools. Misa is yet another guy who isn't a great skater. Schaefer coming out of nowhere to being ranked higher than these guys in a season he played 17 games is bizarre. Go read the first several pages of his thread on HF, people barely talked about him until this season where he barely even played.

I thought Misa was a great skater

 

[mrmovies779]

You take Shaefer and there's your partner for Fox for the next 10 seasons

 

[Boris Zubov]

Is it still broken more than 8 weeks later? A fractured finger is usually fully healed in 5 weeks or so. Pan, Troch, Zib, Kreider, Laf have ALL regressed this season. Before, during and after any injuries. In any case the only two I suspect may NOT decline even further next year are Troch and Laf.

This question is best answered by the HFNYR Docs. I'll defer to them, other than to say he was favoring it pretty obviously two games ago against the Canes when he basically gave up on a play which lead directly to a goal.

 

[LokiDog]

This question is best answered by the HFNYR Docs. I'll defer to them, other than to say he was favoring it pretty obviously two games ago against the Canes when he basically gave up on a play which lead directly to a goal.

It’s a perfectly fair question, but I’d wager that - especially without knowing the extent of the break - it’s harder to heal when you’re actively using it, getting slashed, shooting pucks, taking hundreds of face offs, than whatever the normal healing time is for just putting a splint on it. I’d also wager that, even if “healed” it’s about discomfort and whether or not it’s throwing “off” fine motor skills. But moreover, Trochek didn’t really “regress” that much. Last year was a career year and Panarin had 120 points. Trochek averages 60 points per season in an 800 game career and he has 58 points with a game to go. He also had 64 his first year as a Ranger. 60-65 should be the expectation, so 58 isn’t really a down year. He is the player we SHOULD be expecting him to be. High rate of work, dominant on face offs, good two way player who is good for 60-65 points. People expecting otherwise are setting themselves up for disappointment.

 

[LokiDog]

You take Shaefer and there's your partner for Fox for the next 10 seasons

I don’t think Hagens or Misa are near locks to be star forwards. You take Schaefer all day. 6’2 185lb LHD at 17 years old. Plenty of room to grow and he’s shown tremendous character being as good as he has been considering his mom died of cancer last year. If we had the pick that could land us Schaefer it should be a no brained. He pairs with Fox til the day Fox retires.

 

[Fitzy]

I’ve seen Hagens ranked as low as 6 which is sort of wild because he was the guy a few months ago

Lucas Raymond effect yeah

 

[maddskkilz]

Leaning more and more towards Schaefer if we win the lottery.
Him, Fox, Schneider, and KAM can anchor your backend.

Up front we have to hope Drury makes smart UFA signings to plug in holes and replace any traded players.

I have a bad feeling that the market for Kreider is nonexistent and we will either need to retain salary or add a sweetener.

Harder salary to move out would be Zibanejad since he still has 5 years left. Will have to be for another underperforming vet on a long contract.
Not sure if maybe Nashville would be interested in moving either Stamkos, Marchessault, or both for Zibanejad.

It’s not ideal return but being able to get out of the term on Zibanejad would be helpful. I think ideally we should target lottery teams that are looking to rebound and seeking vets to protect their youth.

 

[will1066]

You take Shaefer and there's your partner for Fox for the next 10 seasons

I don't want Fox for 10 more seasons

 

[mrmovies779]

I don't want Fox for 10 more seasons

You will take the chin and like it!

 

[McRanger92]

Would love to draft Schaefer but unless we're getting a pick in the top 2 its pie in the sky stuff. Between the 2026 draft allegedly being better and the idea that we need next years 1st and 3rd to be involved in the RFA 4.5M-6.8M range, I'm starting to think we may hand over this years pick to Pittsburgh. I have no issue with that whatsoever.

 

[GAGLine]

Would love to draft Schaefer but unless we're getting a pick in the top 2 its pie in the sky stuff. Between the 2026 draft allegedly being better and the idea that we need next years 1st and 3rd to be involved in the RFA 4.5M-6.8M range, I'm starting to think we may hand over this years pick to Pittsburgh. I have no issue with that whatsoever.

I wouldn't take Vince's tweet as any sort of indication that we are going to offer sheet someone. We don't have the cap space, for one thing, and for another, we have our own RFA offer-sheet target to worry about.

If Drury gets Cuylle under contract and clears cap space by moving vets, maybe, but I'll believe it when I see it.

 

[McRanger92]

I wouldn't take Vince's tweet as any sort of indication that we are going to offer sheet someone. We don't have the cap space, for one thing, and for another, we have our own RFA offer-sheet target to worry about.

If Drury gets Cuylle under contract and clears cap space by moving vets, maybe, but I'll believe it when I see it.

My assumption would be this is high on the organizations priority list, if not at the top. Regardless, keeping their options open for next year is probably a better move than making the 11, 12, 13th pick in a relatively weak draft. The interest in Peterka at the deadline adds some credence in my mind to what Vince said.

 

[LokiDog]

Just because I feel like being my best self today, I just wanted to reiterate, entirely for fun, that Mika’s raw career points per game is .7933 and Trochek’s is .7213. They’ve both played over 800 NHL games. It’s a .072 point per game difference. Less than 1/10th of a point per game. Roughly 7/100ths. 72/1000ths. Of 1 point. That’s seventy-two one-thousandths. Per game. Over 800+ games.

 

[Siddi]

If Player A and Player B have played 800+ games and average damn near the same number of points, THERE is your answer. Peaks and valleys really don’t matter when the result over a 800 game sample size is less than 6 points per 82 different. Player A is inconsistent and player B is consistent, but on average they get you the same damn thing. We’re literally not even arguing opinions here. This is like trying to argue days in the summer have more actual hours because the sun doesn’t go down as early.

Again, Mika’s raw points per game is .7933 and Trochek’s is .7213. They’ve both played over 800 NHL games. We’re not comparing Bedard and Celebrini here on some absurdly small sample size before either has reached their prime. It’s a .072 point per game difference. Significantly leas than 1/10th of a point per game. Roughly 7/100ths. 72/1000ths of 1 point. That’s seventy-two one-thousandths in case numbers were hard. Per game. 800+ games.

You can’t even possibly, remotely, truly be as inept as you’re coming across. Go tribute your Mika Z poster and come back with some post nut clarity.

Mika’s “worst” season this year is also Tage Thompson’s career average, so Mika’s better than him as well.

I am glad you brought up Thompson. According to your calculations all 3 players are the same caliber no? Nothing differentiates except small insignificant variations.

 

[effen]

Whoever takes James Hagens is very likely getting something akin to Matty Beniers. What pick that corresponds to is a matter of opinion but for me wouldn't be in the top 3.

 

[LokiDog]

It is very disingenuous of you to shadow edit your post after your original post made it clear that you were leaving the conversation.

I am glad you brought up Thompson. According to your calculations all 3 players are the same caliber no? Nothing differentiates except small insignificant variations.

We’ll see when Tage gets to 800 games

Mika’s at 929 games. Average is exactly 65.05 points per 82. Is that sample size big enough? Vinny’s is 59.14 per 82.

Do you wanna show us where the facts hurt you, or is it a mental owie?

 

[UnSandvich]

Schaefer > Misa > Hagens > Frondell i guess?

I could be wrong but I dont really see a ton of upside in this draft beyond Schaefer and Misa. I think whoever drafts Hagens will be disappointed, especially if it's us.

 

[Boris Zubov]

If Player A and Player B have played 800+ games and average damn near the same number of points, THERE is your answer. Peaks and valleys really don’t matter when the result over a 800 game sample size is less than 6 points per 82 different. Player A is inconsistent and player B is consistent, but on average they get you the same damn thing. We’re literally not even arguing opinions here. This is like trying to argue days in the summer have more actual hours because the sun doesn’t go down as early.

Again, Mika’s raw points per game is .7933 and Trochek’s is .7213. They’ve both played over 800 NHL games. We’re not comparing Bedard and Celebrini here on some absurdly small sample size before either has reached their prime. It’s a .072 point per game difference. Significantly leas than 1/10th of a point per game. Roughly 7/100ths. 72/1000ths of 1 point. That’s seventy-two one-thousandths in case numbers were hard. Per game. 800+ games.

You can’t even possibly, remotely, truly be as inept as you’re coming across. Go tribute your Mika Z poster and come back with some post nut clarity.

Mika’s “worst” season this year is also Tage Thompson’s career average, so Mika’s better than him as well.

This tells me Vinny needed a better agent. He's grossly underpaid.

 

[UnSandvich]

I'd take Hagens 1st overall AINEC. He reminds me of both Hughes & Eichel, he's the exact type of player we never get. Back to back lottery picks and neither of them are even NHL average skaters and have no stand out tools. Misa is yet another guy who isn't a great skater. Schaefer coming out of nowhere to being ranked higher than these guys in a season he played 17 games is bizarre. Go read the first several pages of his thread on HF, people barely talked about him until this season where he barely even played.

I thought Misa was a great skater

Scott Wheeler - The Athletic - March 25th: "Misa is a beautiful skater with some quiet explosiveness and a real knack for weaving, cutting, turning and spinning in control of the puck to either shake defenders under pressure in the offensive or defensive zone or slip past them in transition with his speed and agility. He’s also a very smart player who makes his linemates better with his playmaking, vision and ability to execute while tightly covered."
Smaht Scouting - March 23rd: "He reads the ice better than any other forward in this class, processing plays before they happen and staying a step ahead of the opposition. His processing speed matches his high pace of play, making him a uniquely special prospect. Much of the attention he’s been receiving this season is around his impressive goal-scoring ability."
Joseph Aleong - FC Hockey - March 9th: "Misa is a versatile and dangerous forward with elite agility and vision, complementing his high-end skating ability and impressive puck skills. He has taken a significant step forward in consistency and production this season."

Tony Ferrari - The Hockey News - February 28th: "Misa is among the most intelligent and methodical players in the draft class. His ability to leverage his brain at such a high pace makes him special. Although his goal-scoring has been getting much of the attention, deservedly so, his playmaking is impressive as well."

Sam Cosentino - Sportsnet - February 26th: "His goal scoring element has taken centre stage as he has entered the OHL history books with a goal per game pace through 54 games. Off the rush, on the power play, one-on-one, he can burn defenders in a multitude of ways. "

Adam Kimelman - NHL.com - February 21st: "Misa (6-1, 184), who has earned comparisons to John Tavares for his high-end skill and hockey IQ ... and he’s done it with strong skating, vision and creativity in the offensive zone."

Mike Morreale - NHL.com - February 21st: "What he lacks in size he makes up for in dynamic skill and skating. He's consistently played and succeeded against older competition. Misa has a high hockey IQ and exhibits patience and poise with the puck in big moments."

Michael Misa | Michael Misa Profile | Michael Misa Scouting Report 2025

Michael Misa scouting report for NHL Draft. Profile contains Michael Misa stats, videos and written bios

www.mynhldraft.com

 

[QJL]

Kakko's production has been basically what it was here with extra minutes & some power play time. He has 14 goals combined for the season. He's a 3rd liner.

135th amongst forwards in p/60, better than Giroux, O’Reilly, Barzal, Schwartz, Norris, Schenn, Lundell, Couturier, Trocheck… all of whom who have produced better than Lafreniere.

Define third line forward production?

 

[EdJovanovski]

Scott Wheeler - The Athletic - March 25th: "Misa is a beautiful skater with some quiet explosiveness and a real knack for weaving, cutting, turning and spinning in control of the puck to either shake defenders under pressure in the offensive or defensive zone or slip past them in transition with his speed and agility. He’s also a very smart player who makes his linemates better with his playmaking, vision and ability to execute while tightly covered."
Smaht Scouting - March 23rd: "He reads the ice better than any other forward in this class, processing plays before they happen and staying a step ahead of the opposition. His processing speed matches his high pace of play, making him a uniquely special prospect. Much of the attention he’s been receiving this season is around his impressive goal-scoring ability."
Joseph Aleong - FC Hockey - March 9th: "Misa is a versatile and dangerous forward with elite agility and vision, complementing his high-end skating ability and impressive puck skills. He has taken a significant step forward in consistency and production this season."

Tony Ferrari - The Hockey News - February 28th: "Misa is among the most intelligent and methodical players in the draft class. His ability to leverage his brain at such a high pace makes him special. Although his goal-scoring has been getting much of the attention, deservedly so, his playmaking is impressive as well."

Sam Cosentino - Sportsnet - February 26th: "His goal scoring element has taken centre stage as he has entered the OHL history books with a goal per game pace through 54 games. Off the rush, on the power play, one-on-one, he can burn defenders in a multitude of ways. "

Adam Kimelman - NHL.com - February 21st: "Misa (6-1, 184), who has earned comparisons to John Tavares for his high-end skill and hockey IQ ... and he’s done it with strong skating, vision and creativity in the offensive zone."

Mike Morreale - NHL.com - February 21st: "What he lacks in size he makes up for in dynamic skill and skating. He's consistently played and succeeded against older competition. Misa has a high hockey IQ and exhibits patience and poise with the puck in big moments."

Michael Misa | Michael Misa Profile | Michael Misa Scouting Report 2025

Michael Misa scouting report for NHL Draft. Profile contains Michael Misa stats, videos and written bios

www.mynhldraft.com

I’ve read others and watched videos where they said the opposite, and how his best attribute is by far his hockey IQ rather than his skating or physical tools. Some even said he was slow not just average. I’ll do more research but looking at the two Hagens appears to be the much better skater.

 

[Boris Zubov]

Better p/60 than Giroux, O’Reilly, Barzal, Schwartz, Norris, Schenn, Lundell, Couturier, Trocheck… all of whom who have produced better than Lafreniere.

Define third line forward production?

He has 14 actual goals in 78 games. P/60 is a decent tool, but they still play the games for a reason.

If you want to believe Kakko is a low tier 2nd liner, that's your prerogative. I think he's a solid 3rd liner on a good team. Seattle isn't a good team. Regardless, we might be splitting hairs... IMO, he's never going to be an all star, but can be a solid contributor on a contender.