Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XIV (To trade or not to trade is the question)

[Mosby]

 

[JimmyG89]

Some dates to keep in mind:

• Trouba Trade: December 6 (24 GP, played that night)
• December 20-28: Holiday Roster Freeze
• January 9: Game 41 (Halfway point of the season)
• February 9-21 - 4 Nations Faceoff
• March 8: Trade Deadline

After the 4 Nations Faceoff, there is roughly 2 weeks until the deadline. Of course the cap strapped teams will want to delay things to gather as much deadline space as possible, the Rangers don't have to now that Trouba is gone (if they plan on adding salary back just for this season).

Drury said he wanted to let things play out further before any more moves. I don't think we see a meaningful transaction before Friday. The 4 Nations Faceoff is too far away from the end of the freeze for this team to not make a move between now and then.

So the question is, what is the point of no return? It all sounds like it is right now, but does Drury give them another 10-15 games before making a move? Feels like that would be more of the course of action.

Since the Trouba trade, 2-4-0. Wins are an overcooked Pens team and the 10 game winless streak Sabres.

You don't want to have a situation where the players feel like they are waiting for the shoe to drop (again), but with this response I could see a pre-halfway mark deal.

 

[Kocur Dill]

I had that in mind when I wrote my post. The issue in this thought exercise is that Fox's NMC kicks in on July 1st; which is only an issue if the Rangers actually do consider moving him (they don't). The point about his susceptibility to wear and tear still stands though.

Agreed. Its hard to ignore that every year he gets targeted in the first round and injured enough that it affects his offence, which, if he isnt the best he can be, hurts significantly. His elite offense is what makes him forgivable for his lack of recovery on D with his mediocre foot speed.

Im in the same boat. Not looking to give him away, but...the NMC lingers at a time when this team is at a nexus of roads to take going forward.

Its not a Hard No if a ridiculous return is tabled as you said a young stud 1c+

 

[Savant]

Gus isn’t good. Re signing Lindgren and not getting Roy/Walker/Chychrun and letting them all go to division rivals was the mistake

They would have had at least one of those three guys if Trouba didn’t knee cap them.

 

[Captain Monglobster]

No matter what moves are made all I care about is that whoever is brought in is a hard working high motor type player. I understand puck possession is huge in the modern game, but this teams fatal flaw is its inability to switch from East West to North South when the middle of the ice is taken away.

We need more Trocheck types and less Kreider types.

 

[Levitate]

Agreed. Its hard to ignore that every year he gets targeted in the first round and injured enough that it affects his offence, which, if he isnt the best he can be, hurts significantly. His elite offense is what makes him forgivable for his lack of recovery on D with his mediocre foot speed.

Im in the same boat. Not looking to give him away, but...the NMC lingers at a time when this team is at a nexus of roads to take going forward.

Its not a Hard No if a ridiculous return is tabled as you said a young stud 1c+

He was hurt last year but I'm not remembering an injury in the previous years?

and his elite D is what makes up for his foot speed

 

[kovazub94]

re-signing Lindgren and letting Gus go was suuuuuch a mistake. Stralman/Staal all over again.

Not even close.

 

[UnSandvich]

Reposting from the other thread:

Kakko is 4th on the team in P/60 at 5v5 this year.
Kakko is 1st on the team Primary assists/60 at 5v5 this year.
Kakko is 4th on the team in A/60 at 5v5 this year.
Kakko is 2nd on the team in Rebounds Created/60 at 5v5 this year.

At 5v5, Kakko's linemates are:
1 & 3 in ixG/60
1 & 4 in iSCF/60
1 & 3 in i HDCF/60

maybe, just maybe. some of that is b/c of Kakko. And yet we have posters here who'd trade him for future considerations if they could

 

[eco's bones]

Gustafsson was a pretty decent third pairing defensemen. Most of the 30 points or so he put up last year came in the first half of the season. Better than Jones is right now? I don't know about that. In any case I don't think if Erik was still with us things would be all that much different with our team than we're seeing now.

 

[kovazub94]

Theres way more to it than this but it's worth nothing that everything went out the window once Lindgren was re-inserted back into the top 4. It really threw off the balance of a top 4 that was actually working (one that had Trouba in it!)

I don't think that they would have sustained what they were doing (both in analytics and in actual output where they were scoring 293239 goals a game with the expected numbers to match) but Lindgren really threw off the balance of the D and there was some obvious trickle down which has turned into people basically vacillating between doing their own idea of what hockey is (Panarin) to basically panic plays because they don't want the puck to be their problem (Kreider, Zibanejad... Really most of the team.)

Which leads into point #2...

If there were any hurt feelings over Goodrow, the team had gotten over them because they started on fire and were what, 12-4-1 at one point? The leaked memo was either leaked by some other team or by the Rangers themselves as a ploy to get the guys going (it didn't and the severity in which it didn't may have unintentionally worked as well as we now know what kind of group we have here.)

The lack of accountability is also a joke. Kakko, Jones, Berard, Smith, Mancini - Those are EASY guys to scratch.

Where are the scratches for Zibanejad? Kreider? Lindgren? Did RL even miss a shift after that laughable play he made yesterday where he's basically trying to improv a jazz concierto like a master pianist when he's a guy who just sucks at the recorder? You aren't Adam Fox, you aren't making that play. Just hot cross buns that puck off the glass and let the other players on the ice try to keep you afloat until your shift is over.

Dropping Kreider and Zibanejad in the lineup has zero effect when you have them out there as your go to players in a game where they've heavily been outplayed by other guys. I get it, they're part of a grouping that has been successful in the past and has gotten the job done in that situation, but they aren't a successful group anymore and those 2 in particular are a big reason why. Cuylle and Berard? Probably not ever going to be those guys long term but they have been consistent in their play and actually earned a look there. Why not at least reward them for that?

@ThePeoplesPeople give us something please lmao.

Don’t think the team got over the emotional damage of offseason, rather fast start masked or buried the lingering issue that was bound to manifest at some point. Lindgren’s premature return was a trigger (he’s been awful) but did he directly responsible for Miller’s regression (or more like a free fall) because he’s been looking over his shoulder and it became a self fulfilling prophecy, or it would’ve happened regardless on its own as we’ve seen with Miller?

One way or another I’m expecting Drury to deal with Miller, Kakko, Lindgren and maybe Smith in no particular order but wouldn’t be surprised that it’s easier to find trade partners for Kakko and Miller and thus these two being first outs.

Reposting from the other thread:

Kakko is 4th on the team in P/60 at 5v5 this year.
Kakko is 1st on the team Primary assists/60 at 5v5 this year.
Kakko is 4th on the team in A/60 at 5v5 this year.
Kakko is 2nd on the team in Rebounds Created/60 at 5v5 this year.

At 5v5, Kakko's linemates are:
1 & 3 in ixG/60
1 & 4 in iSCF/60
1 & 3 in i HDCF/60

maybe, just maybe. some of that is b/c of Kakko. And yet we have posters here who'd trade him for future considerations if they could

Not for future consideration - he should be bringing back more value than other available trade baits.

 

[mike14]

Reposting from the other thread:

Kakko is 4th on the team in P/60 at 5v5 this year.
Kakko is 1st on the team Primary assists/60 at 5v5 this year.
Kakko is 4th on the team in A/60 at 5v5 this year.
Kakko is 2nd on the team in Rebounds Created/60 at 5v5 this year.

At 5v5, Kakko's linemates are:
1 & 3 in ixG/60
1 & 4 in iSCF/60
1 & 3 in i HDCF/60

maybe, just maybe. some of that is b/c of Kakko. And yet we have posters here who'd trade him for future considerations if they could

Of course some of it is because of KK, and on a team with terrible 5v5 issues we shouldn't overlook any production we can get there.
But at the same time as we assume that someone that success is due to him, we can also assume that a lot of it is due to one of his linemates in particular being on an absolute heater.
Almost all agree KK is a 'useful' NHLer, but is his 3pts in thr last 11, or is hot start what we can expect going forward? And how much is a better Vesey actually worth to the team, as a cap number, and as the opportunity cost of trading him?

 

[Bob Richards]

It’s been as bad as I can remember. Even the very disappointing 2015-2016 campaign had some more energy behind it.

Agreed. The 15-16 is a regular reference point for me in bad Rangers teams I disliked but even that didn't feel like this. The 15/16 badness had some comical intrigue to it and they actually did win games! They'd get outshot by 50 but still pull out wins. This team might genuinely bottom out and miss the playoffs.

 

[Vitto79]

Would Nashville move Forsberg ?
They gotta do something too

 

[Machinehead]

Agreed. The 15-16 is a regular reference point for me in bad Rangers teams I disliked but even that didn't feel like this. The 15/16 badness had some comical intrigue to it and they actually did win games! They'd get outshot by 50 but still pull out wins. This team might genuinely bottom out and miss the playoffs.

A favorite of mine is a 6-2 win over Dallas in January.

Everyone was mad at AV because he absolutely refused to play Emerson Etem. He proceeds to scratch Etem for Jayson Megna, who immediately has a two-point game. He went on to play five more times, not recording another point.

 

[Crease]

Any legit rumors out there?

 

[mas0764]

Drury has a chance to do something REALLY funny, which is trade Fox and Igor before their NMCs kick in.

Who's with me.

Igor yes, Fox no.

 

[UAGoalieGuy]

Any legit rumors out there?

Nope.

 

[Kocur Dill]

He was hurt last year but I'm not remembering an injury in the previous years?

and his elite D is what makes up for his foot speed

He's been behind the player on a few goals this season alone.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Any rumors in the mill?

Drury enjoying his 4 day weekend

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Where does the balance sit in a Kreider vs Cozens trade and what are the extra pieces and from who

 

[jay from jersey]

Igor yes, Fox no.

Def no to moving Fox…

Igor is elite, but don’t need an elite goalie to win in the NHL.
It certainly helps, and goes a long way when there consistency in the net and a guy that can keep you in all games.
I don’t like spending high on goalies, seems like you can get quality for 6-7 mill that will get the job done. Won’t be as elite as Igor, but it will go a long way spending the extra cap on the roster.
It’s never a horrible thing having a top 3 talent in net on any given season. I wouldn’t give Igor away by any means, but if they can get a haul, I’d think long and hard about it.
Norris caliber D are very hard to find.
We haven’t had a true #1D since Brian Leetch. That’s a lot of years between him and Fox.

You also gotta remember, playing in NY is a different kind of animal.
It’s the big stage where winning is expected and performing is key.
Both these guys have delivered and shown us that already. Countless times we have seen other good players come here and just can’t deliver.
They winding up wilting under the pressure on the big stage with the original 6 aura.
Some also can’t handle the amenities and perks of the city…
They are given more anonymity they other high profile athletes in Football/BBall/baseball/etc.
Not a Canadian city when it comes to press and hockey.
Sure there’s media, but you guys know what I’m talking about.
All things to consider

 

[Chalfdiggity3]

I really hope this isn’t true, I really like garand and I think he’s going to be good.

Wish we didn’t sign Igor to his contract

 

[Mikachu93]

I really hope this isn’t true, I really like garand and I think he’s going to be good.

Wish we didn’t sign Igor to his contract

I’d move Garand in the right deal. He will hold a lot of value in a package for a good player

 

[Hire Sather]

Are we even allowed to make a move without the PA complaining that we traded a guy?

It really is getting ridiculous

 

[Hire Sather]

I really hope this isn’t true, I really like garand and I think he’s going to be good.

Wish we didn’t sign Igor to his contract

The move was to trade Igor or let him walk.

Rebuild or even just try to retool and hope Garland is decent enough..

I'd never sign any goalie to a long term deal. Just try to churn out decent ones on ELCs/first contracts until they reach FA.

It's just not worth it. Teams will realize it soon enough. The position will one day not be paid like it is now

The extension was franchise breaking. Unless we luck into a franchise center somehow