Speculation: Roster Building Thread - Part XIII (Nanaki edition)

[alkurtz]

This is beginning to look so familiar, especially rooting for a team with an extended period of success.

You go into a season with high expectations although there are some lagging doubts about an aging core.

The team struggles, especially that aging core.

First, you think that some tinkering, lines, available personnel, will help and it might a bit but not enough to tamp down what is no longer doubts, but major concerns.

Finally, there is acceptance that this period of success is over, this iteration of the team has run its course, and it is time to address the future.

Sound familiar? All teams with extended success go through this. It is becoming clear that this is where we are at.

The problem today, as opposed to the "old days," is there is a cap that makes it hard to make trades, there are NMC and NTCs. There are untradable big contracts in a time when many teams are pushing at cap limits. Extensive scouting results in all other teams seeing what we see.

It's not 1975 where in a few days you could trade Ratelle and Park, lose Giacomin, in an attempt to shake up a team.

It's disheartening, in particular, that this really good team that has given us so much success, so much happiness, was unable to take that final step.

For me, who does go back to the end of the Francis era and those trades, it is about changing expectations, taking my happiness where I can, rooting for younger players, and beginning to focus on the future.

Maddening, frustrating, disappointing....for sure.

 

[alkurtz]

Just to continue for a second: the great danger to me is that we fall into the "mushy middle," not bad enough to draft at the top and too good to be drafting at the bottom of the first round...to fall into just being mediocre. That is the great danger that I see: we don't have an abundance of top flight prospects and, beyond the first round we don't have many selections. If we continue to struggle, this trade deadline might provide the only chance for us to recoup draft picks. But the draft is always such a crap shoot. Hard not to feel distress this morning/

 

[RangerBoy]

Teams were surprised to hear about Kreider being available.

Why? The Rangers management needs to make significant changes.

Panarin is signed for one more season. He has the full NMC. He isn't leaving.

Cuylle is the Rangers best player. Great for Cuylle. Bad for the Rangers. The Rangers can bump up Cuylle's responsibility and they have. Cuylle is being used on the PK with Carrick. Get him some PP time like last night. Cuylle has no arbitration rights this summer. Might be time to break the bridge contract pattern. Cuylle is the best prospect. 2nd round pick. 20% of second round picks play 100 NHL career games. Good junior career. Got better. Played for Canada in the WJC. Turns pro. Very good first year pro in Hartford. Cuylle wasn't expected to make the Rangers but he forced them to keep him last season. Very good first full NHL season. Great second full NHL season. The Rangers need size, strength and edge in their top 6. Cuylle brings them those elements.

Perreault is coming. It wouldn’t be surprising if Perreault turns pro this spring. Othmann is a LW.

Kreider has two more seasons on his contract and it appears the player has a lot of fans around the NHL. The Rangers need to shake up the team and they need players. Allowing Kreider's contract to expire in two seasons isn't ideal. The Rangers will get cap space with Panarin's contract expiring in 2026. The salary cap will be increasing so much in the next few seasons. The cap will be $110M in two years(EF on 32T last week). $97M next season. $110M the following season. All of these players will be overpaid like the baseball players. $40M players. Ridiculous. Drury or whomever will be running the team better not think about a Panarin contract extension.

Kreider for a player who is due a contract and that team doesn't want to pay or can't pay or for a signed player who more term remaining on his contract than Kreider.

I thought of Vegas because they are always involved. Their PP is very good and they can score goals. Maybe not.

 

[cheech70]

Prophecy by GG

 

[gump116]

Kreider is worth more than that. He has the 8th most goals in the league over the last 3+ seasons, and the 4th most playoff goals. He's locked up at a good number for the next 2 1/2 years.

If Drury does trade him, he isn't going to be looking for picks and prospects. He's going to be looking for NHL players.

Package Kreider + Lindgren for the best LHD you can get. Retain on Lindgren and throw in this years first if necessary to get the right player.

 

[cheech70]

The new collective bargaining agreement is coming up and potential buyouts and increase in cap. As Drury lays out his plans these factors are huge. I read on X that the NHL wants more player movements between teams to generate buzz. NBA trades very good payers all the time and it is good overall for the league. One way is to shorten contracts to 5 years. Also need to deal with these NMC etc. This year is shot. We are not competing for anything. Cash out by selling assets and build up equity by preserving cap space and draft playoff type players with the asset sale. With the increase in cap space we could be on the upswing by 2026. I will be 66 yrs old and hopefully have 1 more NYR run to watch.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

Will be a crime if Kreider is off the NYR before Zibanejad, Trouba, or Lindgren

 

[mandiblesofdoom]

Drury isn’t being fired midseason. The biggest problem with this organization and roster build is Trouba’s contract and Drury didn’t hand that one out.

Mika's contract is looking worse, and that one is Drury's doing.

 

[cheech70]

Will be a crime if Kreider is off the NYR before Zibanejad, Trouba, or Lindgren

Best sellable asset

 

[Cuckoo4Kakko]

Mika's contract is looking worse, and that one is Drury's doing.

Not looking worse. It's worse in every measure. We can escape Trouba.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

This is beginning to look so familiar, especially rooting for a team with an extended period of success.

You go into a season with high expectations although there are some lagging doubts about an aging core.

The team struggles, especially that aging core.

First, you think that some tinkering, lines, available personnel, will help and it might a bit but not enough to tamp down what is no longer doubts, but major concerns.

Finally, there is acceptance that this period of success is over, this iteration of the team has run its course, and it is time to address the future.

Sound familiar? All teams with extended success go through this. It is becoming clear that this is where we are at.

The problem today, as opposed to the "old days," is there is a cap that makes it hard to make trades, there are NMC and NTCs. There are untradable big contracts in a time when many teams are pushing at cap limits. Extensive scouting results in all other teams seeing what we see.

It's not 1975 where in a few days you could trade Ratelle and Park, lose Giacomin, in an attempt to shake up a team.

It's disheartening, in particular, that this really good team that has given us so much success, so much happiness, was unable to take that final step.

For me, who does go back to the end of the Francis era and those trades, it is about changing expectations, taking my happiness where I can, rooting for younger players, and beginning to focus on the future.

Maddening, frustrating, disappointing....for sure.

Mostly agree but, this window was like 3-4 years at best lol

 

[McRanger92]

Kreider has massive value imo. He's 34 but teams trading for him arent going to care about age when he's got 3 seasons of control at a very reasonable price tag. He's a veteran with a ton of experience and clutch play. Contenders and teams on the outside looking in should be interested.

Trouba has lost a huge step that he couldnt aford to lose. He also is quite obviously mentally checked out. There were a lot of team's interested in him this summer (allegedly), not sure if that's changed after watching his play thisyear. I still think the most obvious place for him is Detroit or Buffalo type team that needs leadership and toughness (lol).

Lindgren would be addition by subtraction. Can look back at the downfall of this team and hard not to pinpoint the fact that they've been playing their team mascot on the top pair for a year+. Id strongly consider waiving him if a trade can't be found.

Reilly Smith can go at any time, get back a 3rd rounder or something, Berard & Othmann will need that spot as the season presses on.

Zibanejad is the white whale. I firmly believe if you move kreider and limit Mika's role, he will not only waive his NMC, but he will request a trade this summer. Too trade him they'd have to take back another albatross. Norris makes sense (im not that interested), maybe if Nashville is having buyer's remorse on Stamkos?

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Poor play from Lindgren, Trouba, and Zib aside, something is terribly wrong with this team. They look lost. Drury tried something risky and it seems to have backfired. A lot of this could have been avoided by simply not resigning Lindgren this offseason. Maybe they would have still been in this spot but they played ok when he wasn’t in the lineup. If you’re going to put two well liked, respected guys on blast they way he did, you better hope it works. He might be over his head in this role.

 

[RGY]

Not looking worse. It's worse in every measure. We can escape Trouba.

Oh really? Like how we escaped Trouba’s this past offseason? After making it to the ECF and badly needing that cap space to build the roster for this year? Trouba who cost this team dearly against FL and TBL?

 

[GAGLine]

Poor play from Lindgren, Trouba, and Zib aside, something is terribly wrong with this team. They look lost. Drury tried something risky and it seems to have backfired. A lot of this could have been avoided by simply not resigning Lindgren this offseason. Maybe they would have still been in this spot but they played ok when he wasn’t in the lineup. If you’re going to put two well liked, respected guys on blast they way he did, you better hope it works. He might be over his head in this role.

If he didn't re-sign Lindgren, he would have signed some other plug to a multi-year deal.

 

[McRanger92]

Poor play from Lindgren, Trouba, and Zib aside, something is terribly wrong with this team. They look lost. Drury tried something risky and it seems to have backfired. A lot of this could have been avoided by simply not resigning Lindgren this offseason. Maybe they would have still been in this spot but they played ok when he wasn’t in the lineup. If you’re going to put two well liked, respected guys on blast they way he did, you better hope it works. He might be over his head in this role.

Im going to speculate here, but it seems like the root of the problem was how the Goodrow situation was handled. I had no problem with it personally. Guy gets to go back to the place he debuted with the same albatross contract instead of a buyout? Seems like a win to me. if it was unexpected by the players, it shouldnt have been. Same with the Trouba trade talks. I get that the guys is the Captain, but lets not pretend that wasnt chosen by default (looking at you Kreider and Mika). Not to mention Trouba was a complete zero in every playoff run he participated in. We'll never know what really happened but Drury shouldve ripped the band-aid off then.

The Lindgren stuff is a legit criticism of Drury. My guess is after alienating the Trouba/Kreider/Mika/Trocheck/Panarin (to varying degrees), he didnt want to further turmoil among the younger core (Fox's bestie and Lafreniere's, who was still unsigned, roommate). It was a poor choice. A half measure. Maybe they thought he'd bounce back. I don't think Drury is in over his head at all, but I think he has work to do to fix the problem. I think he has the rest of this season to figure it out or he and Laviolette are gone and a new braintrust will come in to extract the cancers, and go forward with the young core.

 

[Mac n Gs]

If he didn't re-sign Lindgren, he would have signed some other plug to a multi-year deal.

See, I don’t think this was necessarily true. Edmonton was cap strapped going into the year and there were rumors of them potentially needing to move Brett Kulak for cap reasons. Why couldn’t Drury have just traded Lindgren’s rights for a pick and worked out a deal with Edmonton? He’d fit perfectly in at LD and is a boring, but very good defensively dman. Dumoulin? Vaakanainen? All boring, but have length, can make a first pass, and can skate

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Im going to speculate here, but it seems like the root of the problem was how the Goodrow situation was handled. I had no problem with it personally. Guy gets to go back to the place he debuted with the same albatross contract instead of a buyout? Seems like a win to me. if it was unexpected by the players, it shouldnt have been. Same with the Trouba trade talks. I get that the guys is the Captain, but lets not pretend that wasnt chosen by default (looking at you Kreider and Mika). Not to mention Trouba was a complete zero in every playoff run he participated in. We'll never know what really happened but Drury shouldve ripped the band-aid off then.

The Lindgren stuff is a legit criticism of Drury. My guess is after alienating the Trouba/Kreider/Mika/Trocheck/Panarin (to varying degrees), he didnt want to further turmoil among the younger core (Fox's bestie and Lafreniere's, who was still unsigned, roommate). It was a poor choice. A half measure. Maybe they thought he'd bounce back. I don't think Drury is in over his head at all, but I think he has work to do to fix the problem. I think he has the rest of this season to figure it out or he and Laviolette are gone and a new braintrust will come in to extract the cancers, and go forward with the young core.

Every attempt he’s made to remake this team has failed. Too much stuff ends up out in the public, namely Trouba and Igor situations. If this latest misstep was to get the team to play better, it doesn’t seem like it’s working. If he’s looking to make a trade, he should have shut up and made the trade. Personally, I think the team deserved half a season to right the ship. And if changes needed to be made, do it in the offseason. They’ve have a pretty good run the last few years, they deserved the opportunity to figure things out. Trouba less so, but floating Kreider name out there was wrong. They are the two undisputed leaders on this team, and they’re well respected, well liked guys. He misplayed his hand here.

 

[Machinehead]

Othmann is a LW.

Big if true

 

[duhmetreE]

-Lindgren
-Trouba
-Zibs ( not going to happen though )

The alternate for Zibs is to put him to RW.

Get the much needed upgrade at LHD

Try to identify a serviceable middle 6 center. Maybe McLeod from buffalo? Having an off year. Trouba can get his wish and stay in New York

 

[McRanger92]

Every attempt he’s made to remake this team has failed. Too much stuff ends up out in the public, namely Trouba and Igor situations. If this latest misstep was to get the team to play better, it doesn’t seem like it’s working. If he’s looking to make a trade, he should have shut up and made the trade. Personally, I think the team deserved half a season to right the ship. And if changes needed to be made, do it in the offseason. They’ve have a pretty good run the last few years, they deserved the opportunity to figure things out. Trouba less so, but floating Kreider name out there was wrong. They are the two undisputed leaders on this team, and they’re well respected, well liked guys. He misplayed his hand here.

Drury has a job to worry about too. He gave the players this season as one final kick at the can and they've been apathetic at best. He hasn't been able to remake the team at all. Literally the only seismic move he made was swapping out Buchnevich for Trocheck. The rest have been relatively minor signings and deadline trades. The team is in a very good spot long term outside of the Mika contract (also a knock against him I admit).

I've always defended Drury and I have no issue with how he has handled calling out the veterans. It was long overdue. I also have no issue firing him if he turns around and does nothing after having his bluff called. Firing him now would be a catastrophe because you'd just be telling the veterans everything is roses.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

Poor play from Lindgren, Trouba, and Zib aside, something is terribly wrong with this team. They look lost. Drury tried something risky and it seems to have backfired. A lot of this could have been avoided by simply not resigning Lindgren this offseason. Maybe they would have still been in this spot but they played ok when he wasn’t in the lineup. If you’re going to put two well liked, respected guys on blast they way he did, you better hope it works. He might be over his head in this role.

What did he try that was risky? The issue is he played it way too safe and left the entire rotten core together and now it's crumbling down. Don't know how back to back playoffs of watching that core give up and lay down when things got too tough didn't wake Drury up sooner to change it up. At least he realized it early enough this season to potentially do something good.

Getting Kreider and his lack of leadership off this team is the step in the right direction. Hopefully he is able to bring back a good young piece that will be part of the younger core we have.

 

[bernmeister]

Wonder if there is a trade to be made with Florida? They've lost 6 out of 7. It's looking like they're coasting after winning the cup. Too much time on the beach and not enough time practicing. Did anyone watch the Amazon show? Matthew Tkachuk spends his time hanging out in his pool and driving his golf cart around. Verhaeghe signed his new long term deal and took that as a sign that he doesn't need to work anymore. Bob is back to playing like the player that got benched prior to the start of the playoffs two years ago.

could be wrong but bread + bob famously fast friends
so it might be one place other than local he might waive for now

bread retained 1.6x to an even 10 per x 2
Vesey
Ruehedel

for

Ekblad + acceptable futures

Drury has done nothing up to this point to suggest to me he’s a great GM. Any idiot could see this core wasn’t going to get it done.

And yet, when I said let's get ahead of this, I did not get props I deserved.
rant time properly in order...

Before I get started, where the eff was everybody when bern was preaching fluidly repurpose vets into youth while they still have value?

Thanks to the handful of you who gave props
and the usual suspects = handful of my detractors, I, who laugh last, laugh in your win now face.

The great majority of our base,
please recognize:
time to learn with the bern!

Bingo. Core is soft both physically and mentally. It wouldnt be the worst idea to do a quick rebuild.

If at the TDL we decided were going to enter a short little 2 year re-tool if we made sheshty, kreider and panarin available at 50% retained (I know you can only have 2 guys retained on the books), we could absolutely load up on top tier prospects, draft picks and young nhl players who are on the precipice of being ready to compete at the nhl level

We should move older vets other than Kreider [barring crazy good offer]

Shesty + big ++s and get Byfield and be done and over with it
That will hurt but should be doable and = long term problems resolved

could be wrong, think it's 3 you can retain

There are worse ideas. Wouldn’t be a kings ransom but a Marner for Shesty blockbuster would be a shake things up move for both teams. Both FAs, both considered Cornerstones, both teams need the position they’d be getting.

NO
do not want
mustn't just shake up, esp w/a core piece like Igor

get a good piece, pref add + get foundation piece

Todays leak was a warning shot. I dont think this is a team culture that will respond to such a call out positively.

Drury didn't have to sign Lindgren. Walker was right there. Roy was right there. Chychrun was available. Trouba stuff aside, i think this is significantly on him.

Trade Kreider for an LHD. Would love someone young or at least with term. I'll give up the 1st too if it's the right guy. Kreids/1st is a pretty good package. Waive Lindgren.

Cuylle Kakko Lafreniere
Panarin Chytil Trocheck
Berard Zibanejad Smith
Edstrom Carrick Vesey/Brodz

Miller Fox
LHD Schneider
Jones Trouba

Again no
also lose Vesey, add Rempe

No no no no. If you move igor you do so at the deadline at 50% retained to maximize value. Itd be the biggest deadline haul in a VERY long time. You could probably get from the leafs

2026&2027 1st round pick
2025 2nd round pick
Easton Cowan
Fraser Minten

Kreider I’d trade to Boston for Trent Frederic and 2025 1st

Panarin I’d move at 50% retained for a kings ransom as well. And if that means waiting until TDL 2026, I’m fine with that too.

Teams needs to re-tool

every deal is dif
teams doing deal now benefit from use of asset being acquired sooner than later
so don't wait if decent deal is there

Kreid gets more, and he is the one we retain unless crazy good offer
that is not close to enuf

bread MIGHT consider waiving now for FL
or nearby NJ or LI

Package Kreider + Lindgren for the best LHD you can get. Retain on Lindgren and throw in this years first if necessary to get the right player.

no x 3
Lindgren almost costs to remove, packaging does not help, works vs return and diminishes CK value
don't listen to foolishness forcing specific return = LD
go for best return
and again, at this pt, no on moving Kreider
move everybody else, then see

also no on moving first
top giving out that shit like it was candy

learn baby learn

Best sellable asset

not relevant b'c it does not overcome the reality = need to cut fat, not healthy parts
move everybody else, then see

 

[McRanger92]

What did he try that was risky? The issue is he played it way too safe and left the entire rotten core together and now it's crumbling down. Don't know how back to back playoffs of watching that core give up and lay down when things got too tough didn't wake Drury up sooner to change it up. At least he realized it early enough this season to potentially do something good.

Yeah I dont understand the people who think Drury has been riverboat gamblng with this team. We've made a 1st round pick in every draft he has been in charge. He's been very disciplined and patient regarding the young players. I agree that if you want to criticize him its been that he has been too patient. Credit to him for publicly calling out a 12-6-1 team because we all know that record is fugazi. I think he is actually one of the better GMs in the league and seems to genuinely care.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

at this stage it’s obvious what Drury did during the summer to multiple members of the veteran core and leadership has reverberated and killed the vibe amongst them. The first few games was fine but they’ve hit a skid and it’s snowballed from there. The fact that none of them came out last night to speak (besides Bread) says a lot.

Idk what he does to fix it in season. What team is falling over themselves to take one of these guys.

Drury is going to have to thread the needle to find a deal that wants one of these shit contracts and also doesn’t totally screw the Rangers