Roster Building Thread - Part XII(Training Camp/Preseason)

[majordomo]

Anyone know what happened to Panarin?

 

[RangersFan1994]

Rangers Assign Five Players to Hartford | New York Rangers

New York Rangers President and General Manager Chris Drury announced today that the team has assigned forward Anton Blidh, defensemen Casey Fitzgerald and Brandon Scanlin as well as goaltenders Louis Domingue and Dylan Garand to the Hartford Wolf Pack of the American Hockey League (AHL). The...

www.nhl.com

 

[WojtekWolski86]

Just caught up on watching the last couple of games that I missed. These are the prevailing thoughts I have:

Edstrom should make the team. He's ready. Maybe even for a top 9 role. I can absolutely see stretches where he outplays Cuylle and he's the 3LW by Christmas with Chytil and Kakko.

Carrick is the definition of mid. If a kid earns a call up and outplays him, he should be in Hartford. Even would prefer Brodzinski against certain teams in that 4C role. We're screwed if any of our centers go down and he needs to play a role more than a 10 minute a night guy on the 4th line.

Othmann isn't ready yet. He needs at least another year in the minors but I would consider trading him in a deal that lands a good young defenseman or middle 6 forward with term.

Kakko has done nothing to show that he's ready to take the next step, but neither did Lafreniere last preseason and we saw how that turned out. Still, I'd offer him the Jarnkrok contract. 8 years, $2.5 million AAV, take it or get traded over the summer. No one is going to give him a contract with more money over the long term. There's still a place for him on this team on the 3rd line.

I'd love to see what Garand can do. If Igor goes down at all with injury this year, I'd see what he can do for a stretch of a few games and keep Quick the back up. I know it's preseason, but based on what I've seen so far, I'm not giving Shesterkin the bag.


Brady Tkachuk and Shane Pinto for those three and our 2025 1st and another prospect.


I've already come to accept that this is happening at the deadline or over the summer.

Hank sucked in preseason too. Getting back into a goalies "routine" is more important than the play itself sometimes. Plus there's something to be said of tendencies and maybe not giving the other guy enough credit.

Igor for anything with 2 numbers annually scares me. Give him 8x$9 and call it a deal.

 

[WojtekWolski86]

So Panarin started but didn’t finish the game last night despite not being involved in another play that looked to potentially cause an injury? Is that where we’re at?

He looked slow as well. Like 22-23 Panarin

 

[leetch99]

We may be able to get by with Zibs sucking and Panarin being less effective in the playoffs.... But Tuba and Lindgren have got to go.

The next big move needs to be for a top4LHD.... after dumping the dead weight.

Also doesn't help that our coaching staff does not put the best players on the ice because of 'reputation' and 'ego'. There's no overthinking it. Play your best players. Laffy was that guy last playoffs.

I agree on playing the hot hands . The kids are like horses....they want to be fed minutes and in all situations for the most part . They should feed Laf -Kakko- Cuylle and Schneider /Miller a ton of minutes for the start of the season and their effort/vigor might push the whole team to a higher pace ......and carry it into the playoffs .

 

[bhamill]

My take this year has less depth and complexity behind it than in the past, partially because life hasn’t afforded me as much time to ponder the roster, partially because we’re running it back with a similar group for the umpteenth time and I don’t have the energy to dissect the same group over and over again - we can all debate third pairing D or the composition of the pairs and who should be playing in the bottom six but ultimately we’re almost a guaranteed playoff team and far more likely to live or die according to whether Zibanejad plays like 2021 or 2024, or what kind of Panarin makes his way into the post season.

That said:

Edstrom has made the team and deserves a spot.

Rempe is on the team, like it or not. His play may dictate if he stays up the full 82 but I see no scenario where he isn’t on the opening roster.

Jones definitely has looked good enough to play, especially with Lindgren possibly missing time.

We should be willing to completely shuffle the pairs and the line combos. There is no need to cling to what hasn’t gotten us across the line yet… I’m fine with sticking with the familiar, but we don’t have to be married to it. Let’s see how people perform and be willing to adjust. We definitely do not need to see another full season of Mika regression to decide whether he’s “our Ovie” on the PP unit. They’re either hitting the net/going in or they’re not.

Kakko is on his last chance and he’s not helping his case at all so far. It’s time to put up or shut up. Personally I’d rather have Cullye, Edstrom and Rempe all in the bottom six and package Kakko for a player like Pinto who can slide into the 3RW spot Kakko occupies but also can takeover the 3C if (when) Chytil misses time.

Ultimately I don’t think we have a prospect in the system with top six potential at this point - middle six tweener at best - so I’m okay with moving Kakko, Lindgren, Otthman, etc. in a deal that brings in a ~24 or under player who actually looks like a realistic Smith replacement in that top six going forward. Smith will be fine/adequate for his time here but we’re going to have Zib, Kreider, Bread, Tro all getting older and honestly Laf is the only one who has shown he’s genuinely top six worthy. Chytil has the talent, but regardless he can’t be pencilled into taking over that type of role until he can play at least 75 games.

I’m a lot less married to any of our guys than I have been in the past. Honestly I don’t care who is moved anymore. We’re at a point where we are a contender that can’t get over the hump and all of the star power is getting older now but the cupboard has mostly depth players without anyone to really start picking up the slack if those guys begin to slow down in the next couple years so… this is the year to put it all on the table and see where the cards fall. In the past my attitude was like no I love Miller and Lindgren, I love Zib, I don’t want to move them. Now I’m more like “you’re wearing a Rangers jersey, so help us win” I don’t really care what the back of the sweater says anymore.

Gabe Perrault has definitely got top line potential.

 

[majordomo]

Hank sucked in preseason too. Getting back into a goalies "routine" is more important than the play itself sometimes. Plus there's something to be said of tendencies and maybe not giving the other guy enough credit.

Quick had a horrendous preseason last year.

 

[TominNC]

For the regular season? Push them to a higher place? They set the team record for points last year. Just what do you expect this reg season? The postseason is a different animal.

 

[will1066]

bernmeister

Tob

 

[kovazub94]

Trochek has a role on that PP because he defers but he is also pretty sneaky good at retrieving pucks, supporting pucks, supporting players in that high slot area and winning faceoffs. All of which help that PP hum along.

In Trocheck’s case let’s bring his salary into equation and then find a more effective bumper for his AAV.

 

[LokiDog]

Gabe Perrault has definitely got top line potential.

Good call out, I overlooked him. My general thesis stands - we thought we had some locks for top line and top six positions in guys who look much more plausibly to be third liners (Kakko, Othman) or too often injured to be a full time solution in the top six (Chytil). But yes, Gabe is legit and that’s a good point - and nice to have one in the system.

 

[bhamill]

Good call out, I overlooked him. My general thesis stands - we thought we had some locks for top line and top six positions in guys who look much more plausibly to be third liners (Kakko, Othman) or too often injured to be a full time solution in the top six (Chytil). But yes, Gabe is legit and that’s a good point - and nice to have one in the system.

I think Kakko, Chytil and Othmann have top six POTENTIAL… But it’s very arguable that they will fulfill it, so I take your point.

 

[TheDirtyH]

I feel like it's just really safe to assume Kakko is going to have a much better offensive season this year next to the center he's had his best offensive numbers next to and who in any case is not either Mika "anything but 5v5" Zibanejad or the ghost of Nick Bonino. Like even if it's brodzinski, he'll be fine.

 

[UnSandvich]

I feel like it's just really safe to assume Kakko is going to have a much better offensive season this year next to the center he's had his best offensive numbers next to and who in any case is not either Mika "anything but 5v5" Zibanejad or the ghost of Nick Bonino. Like even if it's brodzinski, he'll be fine.

In the limited minutes Cuylle-Brod-Kakko got together, the line actually looked pretty good. A lot of Kakko & Cuylle's offense was opened up by having a relatively quick C who was decisive on offense. Nick Bonino and Alex Wennberg on the other hand, they couldn't find the offensive zone if you glued them to the opposing goalie

 

[Alluckks]

Putting Laf on the PP is tricky. He probably deserves to be on it but if you're making the decision with his next contract in mind, it's the wrong reasoning.

Now, if Mika's one timer is still as ineffective as it was last year, he needs to come off the PP1. He is essentially useless sitting on the perimeter hoping to score from such a predictable area. He'll get his ice time in other situations. If he or anyone starts griping about being pumped off the PP, it would just tell me the team is serious about personal stats and not winning.

Move Mika to PP2 and just have the 30 second PP2 be solely based on feeding Mika a one timer. That's about as good as you can ask for from a sparingly used 2nd PP.

It also spares PP1 from the nightly feed Mika a one timer that misses the net and ropes around the boards all the way back to our own zone.

 

[Kaapo Cabana]

If he is this team is cooked.

It’s an opportunity for somebody to step up. Big boy time.

If nobody does, then yes we’re f***ed.

 

[Kaapo Cabana]

This team needs to seriously ask itself if Kakko+Lindgren+Othmann can get them a serious center/RW.

I'd rather watch Mancini and Jones play 60 minutes together straight than watch Lindgren with Fox anymore. And I like lindgren.

Does that get us Zegras?

 

[TominNC]

Move Mika to PP2 and just have the 30 second PP2 be solely based on feeding Mika a one timer. That's about as good as you can ask for from a sparingly used 2nd PP.

It also spares PP1 from the nightly feed Mika a one timer that misses the net and ropes around the boards all the way back to our own zone.

Not how it works

 

[Zalos]

Noooo! Panarin! I was expecting another 100+ points season for him. Is this injury going to be a problem?

 

[zlev]

Prediction: If Panarin is out long term, the Rangers 5v5 numbers will improve. We will also lose a lot more games. Will be quite a conundrum for people.

lol are you f***ing kidding me. Panarin was our best 5v5 forward last year by a long way.

 

[Bacon Artemi Bravo]

If Panarin is out long term, the Rangers will be very medicore. We'll all see how much he's dragging this team up the standings. Shame he cant do it in the playoffs!

 

[bernmeister]

ok here's a bern special...

DEAL 1
rights to Anton Silavey LD 10OA 2024 draft 6'7 [elc deal once signed]
Simon Nimec RD 2OA 6'1 elc 2 yrs remaining 918,333 x 2
Palat LW 6m x 3
Haula C/LW 3.15m x 2

for

Panarin W 11,642,857 reduced 5,642,857 to 6m per x 2
Trouba RD 8m reduced 3m to 5m x 2
Jones LD plays either side, 812,500 elc expiring -> rfa

4 players for 3 — cap ballpark assumes Silavey not yet signed
2 elcs almost cancel out
Rs are sending Ds just under 20m value reduced to 11 for 2 yrs
to get close, Jersey sends NY 9.15
this puts Devils 1.85 in the hole [half of which would go when Silavey is signed]
they have currently 1.75m cap space per capwages.com and they want a small cushion regardless but obv they can move some small contracts and be there easily

Assessment:
NJ gets immediate help for 2 yrs on current window
NY more for flexibility but with youth added for age, extends its window = better

Jersey -
Panarin younger much better than Palat, who is not bad
Trouba not as good as Nemic but as 3RD behind Pesce and Hamilton anyway mitigates loss of 3RD
Jones is useful, they are thin in lefthanded backliners
can absorb loss of extra F from within, esp since bread is currently best player in the deal

Gotham -
paying a high price, but get younger replaces Trouba w/better RD, ends drama now
Silavey is a stud LD, some thought he would go higher, will help when he gets here 1-2 yrs
see Palat Haula moved subsequently

Rangers D now =
Fox (switched to LD) - Schneider
KAM - Nemic
Scanlin/bpa - Mancini


DEAL 2
Shesty 5,666,667 currently, reduced by 2.666,667 to 3.0 x 1, expiring (permission granted to set extension in advance, retained by Leafs going forward)
Zib 8.5 x 6
Haula C/LW 3.15m x 2
total cap 14.15
for
Nylander 11.5 x 8
Knies 925k elc expiring ->rfa
Liljegren 3m x 2 expiring
tml 2027 1st
total cap 15.425

Leafs have close to zero cap space, Rangers get paid to accommodate
besides using last retention are now under 1m deficit cap on this deal

to recover, Rs will move Lindgren 4.5 expiring, and probably Palat 6m and Liljegren, Vesey, etc

rationale: Leafs cannot do another yr more of the same. They have to take a bold initiative. Shesterkin could be dif on cup, Zib replaces most of Nylander, Haula is ok 3rd line pivot/F stopgap

Rs get better pure scorer in Nylander which helps now, 6-8 yrs hence maybe/maybe not, but overall recovering value for Shesty, can promote Garand backed by Quick, reinforced by Domingue
add a promising younger W in Knies

=================================

post trade Rs are handcuffed 2 seasons cap wise as to retained $$$, but get out from under long term structural cap = mo important, add high quality youth for vets, some vets remaining can be moved for futures

Kreider - Edstrom - Nylander
Knies - Tro - LaF
Cuylle - Chytil - Kakko
Smith- Brodz - Rempe
Carrick, Groulx
presumes Palat is moved

Fox (switched to LD) - Schneider
KAM - Nemic
Scanlin - Mancini
but around the corner Silavey, Emery, Fortescue

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Who stays if Panarin is out for a while, or do they plug and play ahl superstar and nhl tweener Brodz the bod in the top 6?

 

[Clark Kellogg]

Bad feeling about Panarin.

Just feels like he's gonna be out months

Not a problem. Barely an inconvenience.
Just put Rempe on the right of Trocheck and Lafreniere back to his natural left.
Rempe will eat those minutes and not even break a sweat.


Couldn’t resist.

Yes you are correct. If the Panarin is out for a considerable period, the team is in trouble.