Speculation: Roster Building Thread LXXX: Going 8-0 to close out might not be enough!

[mas0764]

Ummm.....let's try this one again, shall we? First of all, Gomez was not traded for McD one on one. Second of all, at the time of the deal he was already FAR from being a in your prime elite top line players. Third of all, Zibanejad was FAR from an unproven prospect who has never played a second of the NHL.

Try again.

I don't need to try again, you have (deliberately?) missed the point. It is you who may need to try again.

A trade scenario being rare does not mean that it never happens or would never happen. Established NHL players DO get traded for prospects who have never played in the NHL, in fact, it happens often at the trade deadline. And while it would be rare to see Buch traded for a prospect, the scenarios line up where in this instance it would make sense for both parties and is something worth discussing.

The hangup you have, besides being (1) overly attached to our current roster players (remember when you wouldn't trade DeAngelo for a top 5 pick? That position aged real well), and (2) overly intransigent in admitting and/or discussing possibilities you think are unlikely, and (3) having a forum truth enforcement messiah complex, is that what you are actually trying to argue is not the same thing as what you are typing.

What you are trying to say is that you find it unlikely the Rangers would trade Buch for an unproven prospect who hasn't played in the NHL before and that you don't think it's a good idea. Fair enough, and we have gone around and around that this is your opinion.

But as Edge has recently posted, he believes the Rangers realize that Kakko and Kravtsov are going have to "step up," as he put it, that this means Buch is on the outside looking in, in regards to the top 6, that if they don't move him now they may regret it later, and that they prefer to move him for a young top-6 centerman with "runway," (ie, someone who projects to grow into a 60-ish point center).

So you can kindly stop blathering falsehoods like "these trades don't happen," and trying to shout down everyone else who wants to talk about it.

We are discussing it; if you'd like to not discuss it, take a hike. You don't have to police the board for everything that you don't personally think is realistic, as you always feel you have some sort of calling to do with trades, position changes, coaching evaluations, and any other topic that sticks in your craw.

 

[mas0764]

That is part of what I mean when I say that the roster diversification may come via a trade that most will hate the return for. Trading Buchnevich may not bring back a 50 point center.

I think we got that this outcome was a possibility when Edge said it before you.

 

[CLW]

I'm looking at the Pacioretty trade that sent Suzuki (+Tatar, 2nd) to Montreal for a winger. Montreal, for example, is a team that have Suzuki, Kotkaniemi with Poehling about to make the jump. They could use an experienced offensive C (R. Strome) to help rather than go with three kids, especially if they lose Danault to UFA (I'm not keen on Danault for age/cap reasons for the Rangers), or a Buchnevich upgrade for their wing post Armia (UFA). Bergevin needs to make a mark soon or his job will become precarious.

There are a lot of teams that have issues and question marks with their roster and/or cap problems. And rebuilding teams are no doubt looking to stack up on picks for the strong 22/23 drafts. I'm sure there are lots of opportunities out there for Gorton to pursue.

 

[mas0764]

You must be a real hit at parties.

If the stick up is that it doesn't often happen 1-for-1 then fine, we can discuss that, instead of saying "It doesn't happen, so shut up about it already."

Like, oh no, we're gonna be mad if we'd have to adjust a trade that is centered around Buch for Lundell.

We've been over this too. He thinks Florida should have to add to that deal. I'm fine with them not adding, in fact, I'm kinda ok if we have to add a small bit.

The trade would be adjusted, I'm sure there are other assets we could use that Florida could throw in that would help make up a value difference. The point of this exercise isn't to finalize the trade as we obviously don't know exactly what the Rangers and Florida would each want and each value.

The point is discussing the concept of a Buch for young center trade, identifying possible options, and going from there.

I'm sure there's a deal SOMEWHERE that makes sense for both teams that revolves around Buch for Lundell. Mix and match accordingly.

Now obviously we are not saying it will happen, but Buch is clearly a player that would have appeal to Florida and in such situations (acquiring a top line 26 year old RW who has some control), a first round prospect in return, as part of a package or not, is not uncustomary compensation. And like it or not - as we are discussing - Buch's future as a top 6 player here is pretty much non-existent. The team is gonna commit to Kakko and Kravtsov on that side. Time for Buch to be parlayed into the best value we can get.

It's no thought crime to be exploring young top-6 center options.

 

[NYSPORTS]

Our 4th line in a year or so when Karl Henriksson is centering Austin Rueschhoff and Adam Edström

playoff beards?

 

[Savant]

Shut em down

 

[NYSPORTS]

Well, in that line of thinking:

Its probably best we sell Buch now before his "lock up term" contract then we move on from Zibanejad down the road and Buch isn't living up to the AAV.

Maturity is not going to be enough. I think we all see this roster is going to need changes. The Isles did the same thing to the Rangers as Carolina did during the play in. It’s obvious this is not a team which can play physical or skate when the ice shrinks.

 

[BBKers]

More Blackbeard

 

[NYSPORTS]

Anybody know the eta for Edstrom?

 

[tomobson]

I'm not in love with the Danault idea but it might be necessary at this point with the gaping hole the rangers have left themselves at with actual centers, but it depends on how much he wants obviously. Also, I love Buch but it's time for him to go and luckily for us his value should be pretty high and we have two young wingers who have the upside and need his minutes anyways. The rangers definitely have the pieces and cap space available to start stabilizing this roster a bit this offseason. The front office will be busy this summer.

 

[mas0764]

I'm not in love with the Danault idea but it might be necessary at this point with the gaping hole the rangers have left themselves at with actual centers, but it depends on how much he wants obviously. Also, I love Buch but it's time to for him to go and luckily for us his value should be pretty high and we have two young wingers who have the upside and need his minutes anyways. The rangers definitely have the pieces and cap space available to start stabilizing this roster a bit this offseason. The front office will be busy this summer.

I'm not either, I'd really rather go younger and bank on some potential growth rather than ready-to-contribute-at-a-second-line-level-now but is 29 years old.

I am still seeking the center to play with Kakko and Lafreniere. Really the two centers if Chytil isn't one of them.

 

[Kocur Dill]

I'm not either, I'd really rather go younger and bank on some potential growth rather than ready-to-contribute-at-a-second-line-level-now but is 29 years old.


I am still seeking the center to play with Kakko and Lafreniere. Really the two centers if Chytil isn't one of them.

Not for nothing, but wasn't Rucchin Kariya and Selanne's center?

Not advocating for Denault, just saying. A guy who is defensively responsible and can hang in the top 6 has value with the right type of wingers.

 

[mas0764]

Not for nothing, but wasn't Rucchin Kariya and Selanne's center?

Not advocating for Denault, just saying. A guy who is defensively responsible and can hang in the top 6 has value with the right type of wingers.

Sure but they were all within like 3 years of each other which is more the point I'm making.

 

[jay from jersey]

rather get Barkov. better player and plays a 200 foot game

I don’t think there’s 1 person on this board that would take Eichel over Barkov. Why did the damn panthers have to be good this year. Everything was working out according to plan Barkov should be watching the playoffs from his couch stewing that the panthers are going no where and he’s wasting his prime. Then the rangers open the brinks truck just in time for him to be a UFA. But noo, Barky of course has to be a stud and Will that team into the playoffs with very marginal talent and unproven youngsters

 

[leetch99]

Tkachuk is another LW, I don't see how he fits here even though I would love him.

Well...we could trade Kakko or Kravs for him and whatever we need to add ...first round pick and or a D prospect ...various ways to do it probably . He would become our #2 LW...or #1 keep reading ....and then I move Lafreniere to C or the off wing . We have no LW's to move as they are unmovable unless you want to deal Laf.....which is always a risk and CK can't be dealt . Although other moves are also possible ......for which I will be trampled on LOL.....

Myself...I would trade Panarin while I could because in 3-4 years time who knows what he will be like..other than being 33-34 ? I'd take that risk versus moving Laf . Panarin turns 30 in October of next season . If we add Tkachuk and move Panarin for a decent center .....that fills some needs in a hurry . I'm banking we would make up for Panarin offense with the youth evolving and Tkachuk added . Saying all that...with the NMC it does tend to make guys almost unmovable for the most part....but always fun to speculate .

 

[Synergy27]

Not for nothing, but wasn't Rucchin Kariya and Selanne's center?

Not advocating for Denault, just saying. A guy who is defensively responsible and can hang in the top 6 has value with the right type of wingers.

I don’t think anyone is against the concept. Is the price that’s in question.

 

[Ruggs225]

Shut em down

why cant quinn just put Gaut on the third line instead of blackwell? Play the young guys! Season is over. There is no need for Blackwell to play 19 min. None!

On top of that, i would start trying to get players like chytil and kakko or Kravtsov on the PK to get them more experience.

 

[LOFIN]

 

[jay from jersey]

Well...we could trade Kakko or Kravs for him and whatever we need to add ...first round pick and or a D prospect ...various ways to do it probably . He would become our #2 LW...or #1 keep reading ....and then I move Lafreniere to C or the off wing . We have no LW's to move as they are unmovable unless you want to deal Laf.....which is always a risk and CK can't be dealt . Although other moves are also possible ......for which I will be trampled on LOL.....

Myself...I would trade Panarin while I could because in 3-4 years time who knows what he will be like..other than being 33-34 ? I'd take that risk versus moving Laf . Panarin turns 30 in October of next season . If we add Tkachuk and move Panarin for a decent center .....that fills some needs in a hurry . I'm banking we would make up for Panarin offense with the youth evolving and Tkachuk added . Saying all that...with the NMC it does tend to make guys almost unmovable for the most part....but always fun to speculate .

Nah forget that. Panarin gonna age like Marty St. Louis. He doesn’t rely on speed or heavy hitting or anything that really takes a toll on his body. In fact, it’s crazy how he avoids contact. He has a great shot and great vision and he slows the entire ice down to his pace like all the greats do. At 33-34 I bet he’s still a PPG player.
I would love to add Tuch and Krebs for Buch and??? Tuch on a great contract and would be a real good add to this line up. Plays a more north south game the Buch. While he may not be as talent as Buch he makes up for it in other areas of his game. Think he would look good on a line with panarin too

 

[EdJovanovski]

I don't hate it

 

[Edge]

Shut em down

More Blackbeard

See now this is an example of the duality in which I view Quinn.

On the one hand, I look at that defense and I make a gulping sound. I say to myself, "Winning this game is hard to expect."

On the other hand, I see Blackwell in the top 9 and on the top powerplay and I say to myself, "This is why DQ gets reamed."

 

[True Blue]

If they are trading Buch 1 for 1 it needs to be for either a player that does something that the Redundant Rangers don’t do well and/or a guy on their second contract as opposed to Buchnevich going on his third contract. You aren’t getting value on any other kind of Buchnevich trade.

I am. But mostly it would be good to show up to an argument with facts.

 

[jay from jersey]

See now this is an example of the duality in which I view Quinn.

On the one hand, I look at that defense and I make a gulping sound. I say to myself, "Winning this game is hard to expect."

On the other hand, I see Blackwell in the top 9 and on the top powerplay and I say to myself, "This is why DQ gets reamed."

Doing the same think over and over again when you know it’s wrong is the definition of insanity

 

[jay from jersey]

Not for nothing, but wasn't Rucchin Kariya and Selanne's center?

Not advocating for Denault, just saying. A guy who is defensively responsible and can hang in the top 6 has value with the right type of wingers.

Yea screw that. Danualt turned down 6 yrs 5 mill per from Habs. I want no part of that. He can shove it. Good little center though. After I saw this I’m sure strome and Zibby are going to look to cash in, hardcore. Anyone who doesn’t think so is just foolish

 

[BobMarleyNYR]

Well...we could trade Kakko or Kravs for him and whatever we need to add ...first round pick and or a D prospect ...various ways to do it probably . He would become our #2 LW...or #1 keep reading ....and then I move Lafreniere to C or the off wing . We have no LW's to move as they are unmovable unless you want to deal Laf.....which is always a risk and CK can't be dealt . Although other moves are also possible ......for which I will be trampled on LOL.....

Myself...I would trade Panarin while I could because in 3-4 years time who knows what he will be like..other than being 33-34 ? I'd take that risk versus moving Laf . Panarin turns 30 in October of next season . If we add Tkachuk and move Panarin for a decent center .....that fills some needs in a hurry . I'm banking we would make up for Panarin offense with the youth evolving and Tkachuk added . Saying all that...with the NMC it does tend to make guys almost unmovable for the most part....but always fun to speculate .

The Bern returns