Speculation: Roster Building Thread LXXX: Going 8-0 to close out might not be enough!

[Shesterkybomb]

That's kind of where I'm at.

Okay, you go with the hot hand. I get it.

Okay, you want to bring the kids along a certain way. I get it.

But there comes a point where enough is enough. Blackwell is a steak sauce. He's meant to compliment the meal. And kind of like a steak sauce, there is a point where you can over do it.

Give him 6-10 minutes a night, move him around if openings emerge. But he has 1 assist and is a minus two in his last 5 games, and has been getting anywhere from 13:34 to 19:24 a game --- including 15:27 last game.

There comes a point where we have enough young talent that is showing their potential and we need to be looking at them. The reasoning used to be that Blackwell was perceived to have a shorter leash and the kids needed to take advantage of their opportunities.

Well Blackwell's ice time is as high as ever, and the kids aren't moving.

The bigger issue is he's getting pushed around in corner battles that Panarin and Strome need him to win especially against bigger teams. That line needs a bigger player, a shooter, its obviously kravtsov.

 

[LiveLongandProspal]

Smith already got his first ufa contract. He’s overpaid at 4m a year. he’s looking at the jack Johnson special.

I don’t mind him as a 7d. I’m more worried the rangers don’t want to run two rookies on the third pair.

Why would he look for the Jack Johnson special if he's coming off a career year? Makes no sense...

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Regarding smith, i don't mind having him around on the cheap but im sure he can get a better contract somewhere else, like id want him at 1.2-1.5, i dont think he'd have a problem getting 2+ out of Edmonton, Ottawa, Detroit, Winnipeg etc etc.

 

[Daves a mess]

Isles fans complaining about Trotz? Some long time season ticket buddies of mine are. Some on their board? Yup.

Its his "system" apparently...

 

[Avery16]

If we give Smith another multiyear at a rate based on his play this season, this org deserves everything it gets.

 

[IDvsEGO]

Why would he look for the Jack Johnson special if he's coming off a career year? Makes no sense...

A career high in goals isn’t much when your career high is 5... he’s older, slower than he was when he signed his first big deal.
He’s may want more than 1m but that’s about the right number for him.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Isles fans complaining about Trotz? Some long time season ticket buddies of mine are. Some on their board? Yup.

Its his "system" apparently...

They're very reminiscent of the Trotz Preds. A few of their teams looked like world beaters half way through the regular season, dipped as the year went on and then were out in round 1 or 2. Covid helped them tremendously last year because they were on the verge of missing all together.

Wouldn't be at all surprised if they end up dipping to 4th and getting dropped in 5 vs who ever wins the division.

 

[Rangers in 7]

That's kind of where I'm at.

Okay, you go with the hot hand. I get it.

Okay, you want to bring the kids along a certain way. I get it.

But there comes a point where enough is enough. Blackwell is a steak sauce. He's meant to compliment the meal. And kind of like a steak sauce, there is a point where you can over do it.

Give him 6-10 minutes a night, move him around if openings emerge. But he has 1 assist and is a minus two in his last 5 games, and has been getting anywhere from 13:34 to 19:24 a game --- including 15:27 last game.

There comes a point where we have enough young talent that is showing their potential and we need to be looking at them. The reasoning used to be that Blackwell was perceived to have a shorter leash and the kids needed to take advantage of their opportunities.

Well Blackwell's ice time is as high as ever, and the kids aren't moving.

To be honest the true problem isn’t just Blackwell. It’s that the rangers have better options like kravtsov just f***ing sitting there

 

[huerter]

If we give Smith another multiyear at a rate based on his play this season, this org deserves everything it gets.

You just described a 2 year deal for like 2 mil which would be bazilly.

 

[MysticLeviathan]

Howden is fine when he’s the best option they have. He is not the best option they have. He should be sitting for Goth. Blackwell, Rooney, Goth on the 4th line is good enough.

It’s Tanner Glass all over again. I hope Howden is the one who gets drafted by Seattle.

 

[Ola]

I think we all would’ve been fine if went to Hartford for a season or two. But at first glance, some people might guess he’s the owners son.

Even if he’s improving, I’d rather cut bait and find someone with some more bite to their game.

I get what you mean, at the same time, Howden does have the wheels and ability to cover a lot of ice that definitely stands out and gives him a platform on which he can build a very solid base for a lower-end top 9 forward. He definitely doesn't start to hit a ceiling when he reaches McKegg level if you get what I mean. He is also obviously not the super early bloomer physically type, its not like he is the level of a teenager at 23 of course, but he is going to a get a little more firmer physically.

Ultimately I just see a kid were the penny is about to drop in a few areas when it comes to processing the game and so forth, someone who will become a little stronger and firmer, should be able to improve his FOs, who in addition to this should be very cheap and be able to provide stability more than anything else.

I just think it would be a pity to have invested in him to the extent we have -- only to lose him now before he even have started to have an impact.

 

[NYRFANMANI]

The line changes were desperately needed. That K-C-K line is beautiful and Kreider seems revitalized.

If we give Smith another multiyear at a rate based on his play this season, this org deserves everything it gets.

1m/1y or gtfo

 

[haohmaru]

I can’t really even begin to entertain your thoughts when you open with Gauthier “takes some lousy penalties”.

He took 6 minors. 6. 3 of which came in the same game. You take out that one bad game and he has 1 more minor than Howden has this year. Gauthier is a young, big, fast kid. He drives the net. He is physically stronger than a lot of players. Penalties are going to happen.

Just because an NHL coach favors one player or thinks one way, does not mean its the right way. The point being made is Blackwell can take Howden’s PK minutes and there very likely would not be a significant drop-off. But we will never know because this coach refuses to bench Howden.

Then don't entertain them. Excusing stupid penalties by counting minutes instead of looking at what the penalties were is being willfully ignorant. They were mostly careless and weren't in the vein tripping a guy to prevent a scoring chance. I think part of the expectation for Gauthier is that, given his frame, he SHOULD be a forward that's more physical than what he is and that is part of the reason he isn't playing.

Equally, I'd submit that just because a guy on a hockey forum favors one guy over the other doesn't mean it's "right" either and you really don't know Blackwell's PK capabilities and neither do I.

Gauthier is wing. Howden is a center. And, as pathetic as it is, Howden is our "best" face-off guy (%) which isn't on Gauthier's resume.

We're talking about 4th liners with limited roles on a team with playoff aspirations. I'm not sure what Howden's future is here. I'm not sure what Gauthier's is either. I know, however, that I'm not obsessing over which of these guys plays and I understand why Howden is the choice *right now*.

The Rangers are 7-2-1 in their last 10 in a playoff "run" and you're making changes to a lineup that's winning? See how that goes over if they lose. If the Rangers are out of it, then I rest somebody that's dinged up and give Gauthier a go at it.

 

[Kocur Dill]

I get what you mean, at the same time, Howden does have the wheels and ability to cover a lot of ice that definitely stands out and gives him a platform on which he can build a very solid base for a lower-end top 9 forward. He definitely doesn't start to hit a ceiling when he reaches McKegg level if you get what I mean. He is also obviously not the super early bloomer physically type, its not like he is the level of a teenager at 23 of course, but he is going to a get a little more firmer physically.

Ultimately I just see a kid were the penny is about to drop in a few areas when it comes to processing the game and so forth, someone who will become a little stronger and firmer, should be able to improve his FOs, who in addition to this should be very cheap and be able to provide stability more than anything else.

I just think it would be a pity to have invested in him to the extent we have -- only to lose him now before he even have started to have an impact.

If he could get better at FO, and play a little more of heavy game along the boards, its not far fetched that prime/senior Howden could carve out a role similar to Manny Malhotra, IMO.

 

[Synergy27]

If he could get better at FO, and play a little more of heavy game along the boards, its not far fetched that prime/senior Howden could carve out a role similar to Manny Malhotra, IMO.

Howden had a prime opportunity to lay a huge hit on someone last night on the forecheck. He declined to do so. If he doesn’t add that dimension to his game I don’t see how he stays in the league. He is bad to mediocre at everything else. Not a single plus quality.

 

[Off Sides]

Smith at like 1.075M is fine. Even if it's 2 years. If he can get more and wants to go, okay.

 

[RGY]

Then don't entertain them. Excusing stupid penalties by counting minutes instead of looking at what the penalties were is being willfully ignorant. They were mostly careless and weren't in the vein tripping a guy to prevent a scoring chance. I think part of the expectation for Gauthier is that, given his frame, he SHOULD be a forward that's more physical than what he is and that is part of the reason he isn't playing.

Equally, I'd submit that just because a guy on a hockey forum favors one guy over the other doesn't mean it's "right" either and you really don't know Blackwell's PK capabilities and neither do I.

Gauthier is wing. Howden is a center. And, as pathetic as it is, Howden is our "best" face-off guy (%) which isn't on Gauthier's resume.

We're talking about 4th liners with limited roles on a team with playoff aspirations. I'm not sure what Howden's future is here. I'm not sure what Gauthier's is either. I know, however, that I'm not obsessing over which of these guys plays and I understand why Howden is the choice *right now*.

The Rangers are 7-2-1 in their last 10 in a playoff "run" and you're making changes to a lineup that's winning? See how that goes over if they lose. If the Rangers are out of it, then I rest somebody that's dinged up and give Gauthier a go at it.

Counting minors*. The numbers look a lot different. I am not excusing stupid penalties, but when they all happen in one game WTF are you bitching about then? How is that an indictment of a player if he has ONE bad game. What a leap you are taking with that argument. Its silly. AND he scored in that game.

Gauthier does play physical though. He goes into the corners, battles along the boards, drives the net, and he generates “hits”. I’d like you to go calculate his hits vs minutes played average and then compare it to the rest of the team. I implore you to do so. I am sure the garbage reply will be ‘well not all hits really should count’ because I have already heard that nonsense from another poster.

Blackwell has PK’ed this year due to injuries or a regular PKer being in the penalty box and he has done just fine. So I lied (knowing he has PK’ed). We do know he is capable. Wrong again.

Howden isn’t even playing center at this point. Great Howden has the best faceoff %. Wonderful. Thats the only thing he has improved on and yet Rooney is the center on that line. Oh and both he and Rooney are under 40% on faceoffs when on the PK. There are plenty of teams that dont have anxiety and need an extra center playing win on the 4th line and are successful. How about putting the best 12 forwards on the ice?

I love when fans dismiss who is playing on the 4th line as unimportant. You’re right, we dont know what we really have in Gauthier because he has only played in 27 games. We do know what Howden pretty much is at this point even in his limited 4th line role because, well, we have gotten to see him play. Maybe we can play Gauthier now so we can see what we have?

7-2-1 record in the last 10.... who did those wins come against?

 

[NYRFANMANI]

In our last window and Cup run, didn't we ice three balanced lines and a great grinding 4th line?

We almost have everything in place here to do it again. No big trades, no big names needed, we have it all here.

Afaic we should look to exchange Zibs with a draft pick in the next couple of years, so there is a seamless transition in like 6-8 years.

Ps: Did the emergence of Cuylle facilitate the Lemieux trade?

 

[Kocur Dill]

Howden had a prime opportunity to lay a huge hit on someone last night on the forecheck. He declined to do so. If he doesn’t add that dimension to his game I don’t see how he stays in the league. He is bad to mediocre at everything else. Not a single plus quality.

Wasn't he captain of his WJC team? There has to be more to his game he just hasn't figured out how to incorporate at this level of play. He could just need time and adult muscle? Most boys don't mentally mature till 24yo or later.

Or, he could just be barely better than Lias Anderson was who also had a great Jr career.

 

[Synergy27]

Captain

Wasn't he captain of his WJC team? There has to be more to his game he just hasn't figured out how to incorporate at this level of play. He could just need time and adult muscle? Most boys don't mentally mature till 24yo or later.

Or, he could just be barely better than Lias Anderson was who also had a great Jr career.

Captain != best player. He might eventually round out into something serviceable but it shouldn’t be on this team.

 

[duhmetreE]

Seriously, how much would Jonathan Toews cost? It can't be much considering his cap hit. Would he not be the perfect center for us? Albeit a temporary solution

He'd be the perfect center ( stylistically) for Panarin IMO. Strome and Panarin have chemistry but they become too finesse. Toews is an obvious upgrade in '2way' and plays a simpler 'north-south'.. Fills a MASSIVE need of veteran leadership

A line of Panarin Toews Kravtsov would be beautiful

 

[smoneil]

Seriously, how much would Jonathan Toews cost? It can't be much considering his cap hit. Would he not be the perfect center for us? Albeit a temporary solution

He'd be the perfect center ( stylistically) for Panarin IMO. Strome and Panarin have chemistry but they become too finesse. Toews is an obvious upgrade in '2way' and plays a simpler 'north-south'.. Fills a MASSIVE need of veteran leadership

A line of Panarin Toews Kravtsov would be beautiful

It's not even a sure thing that Toews will play hockey again. That whole situation is a bit odd, but I hope the best for whatever it is that's keeping him off the ice.

And if he were healthy, that would be a beautiful line, but I still don't think we can afford multiple high-cap centers after our wings and D start to make real money. I'd try to re-up Zibanejad, move Chytil to the second line, and then look to sign or acquire a stop-gap for a couple of seasons until we know what we have in Barron, Vierling, and Berard.

 

[SML2]

Should we not overtake Boston or win the lottery and wind up in the #16 spot, I am in total trade down mode. Get as many picks as we can to draft Euros and College players where you can stagger their contracts and entry into the league. We have the core skill guys. We need to have a steady stream of complementary players on cheap ELC deals to keep the cost down and keep flipping them for future assets when the next man up is ready.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Smith at like 1.075M is fine. Even if it's 2 years. If he can get more and wants to go, okay.

I hope they bring him back. Can also be an extra forward. By all accounts he's been tremendous with the younger players, great in the locker room, he sticks up for his teammates, and he's been pretty good on the ice too. You needs guys like this on a team with Cup aspirations.

 

[Daves a mess]

Should we not overtake Boston or win the lottery and wind up in the #16 spot, I am in total trade down mode. Get as many picks as we can to draft Euros and College players where you can stagger their contracts and entry into the league. We have the core skill guys. We need to have a steady stream of complementary players on cheap ELC deals to keep the cost down and keep flipping them for future assets when the next man up is ready.

Good plan. Or. Take the best Center available with that pick.
Assuming Super Swede goalie is gone.