Speculation: Roster Building Thread II (2022-23): The Puck is Prepared to be Mounted

[Boris Zubov]

It isn't the be-all-end-all of being a good passer, but after a few years, your team should score a few goals with you on the ice if you're a good passer.

Agreed, there's been a giant disconnect from his play & the results. It's maddening at this point.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Zibanejad leads the Rangers in SOG and shot attempts in an absolute walk.

You’re the head Zibanejad apologist

 

[DanielBrassard]

You brought assists into this, but I don't think stats necessarily determine if a player is a good passer. You don't have to agree with me, but these charts shouldn't be the thing that sways you one way or the other.


If for the hot takes alone.

They should claim Stralman regardless.

I don't think he's a good passer and that's just going by watching the games, the stats just reinforce his lack of playmaking ability.

 

[Machinehead]

You’re the head Zibanejad apologist

Incorrect.

I'm the head Kreider apologist, a role that shouldn't even exist but it does.

That's what it says on my business card.

 

[Boris Zubov]

I don't think he's a good passer and that's just going by watching the games, the stats just reinforce his lack of playmaking ability.

Fair enough. Hard to argue with the lack of production, but I've seen things (nothing particular that stands out at the moment) that impressed me with his passing ability. Lord knows I've been wrong before, so now I'll try to watch closer.

 

[haohmaru]

Maybe if you use re-draft incorporated into your comparison. It's clear that Buchnevich turned out into not-your-typical 3rd rounder.

Meh. You can't redraft and you can't draft in hindsight. I compare the two because I think a lot of people thought there was more to Buchnevich than what we were seeing and rightly so. I think Chytil is largely the same - we think he should be ____ but so far he's been ____. The comparison was deliberate because this is the team that I watch. Like I said, I hope he figures it out.

 

[Machinehead]

I don't look at Kakko and go "boy howdy, this schmuck can't string two passes together!" That's Lafreniere.

I just think he's pretty much the base level for how an NHL player should be able to pass. Nothing good, nothing egregious.

 

[haohmaru]

I don't look at Kakko and go "boy howdy, this schmuck can't string two passes together!" That's Lafreniere.

I just think he's pretty much the base level for how an NHL player should be able to pass. Nothing good, nothing egregious.

The team is really good at passing. To the other team.

 

[Machinehead]

The team is really good at passing. To the other team.

Yes!

 

[DanielBrassard]

Fair enough. Hard to argue with the lack of production, but I've seen things (nothing particular that stands out at the moment) that impressed me with his passing ability. Lord knows I've been wrong before, so now I'll try to watch closer.

The biggest problems I've noticed are a lack of touch, it always seems like he struggles to read how much velocity he needs, he doesn't seem to be able to make plays on his backhand which is a problem if you are playing on your off wing, and he struggles to either see open lanes or he holds onto the puck far too long which might look nice but isn't conducive to generating shots and chances.

 

[Machinehead]

The biggest problems I've noticed are a lack of touch, it always seems like he struggles to read how much velocity he needs, he doesn't seem to be able to make plays on his backhand which is a problem if you are playing on your off wing, and he struggles to either see open lanes or he holds onto the puck far too long which might look nice but isn't conducive to generating shots and chances.

None of this sounds like a death sentence.

Then again, there's very little evidence that Rangers forwards improve raw skills.

 

[TheDirtyH]

Fair enough. Hard to argue with the lack of production, but I've seen things (nothing particular that stands out at the moment) that impressed me with his passing ability. Lord knows I've been wrong before, so now I'll try to watch closer.

The first few weeks of the season threads were riddled with complaints about Kakko's linemates not finishing his passes to them. He's a good passer. He's not Fox/Panarin good, not really even close, but he's a good passer.

IDK I had to read like five posts saying Zibanejad isn't a good passer just now, so I'd trust your eyes.

 

[bleedblue94]

very reasonable and also establishes a meritocracy moving forward. Kreider and Trocheck to PP2......best results play

I move panarin to pp2 until he shows a willingness to pay attention to his 5v5 play and listen to some level of instruction. He gets a LOT of slack bc of his incredible skill, but saying you "forgot" which side of the ice was your responsibility at 5v5 is unacceptable. Once he starts showing some team game in his own game he goes back to pp1 bc he is a pp1 player. Trocheck always belonged on pp2, ALWAYS

 

[duhmetreE]

Zibanejad leads the Rangers in SOG and shot attempts in an absolute walk.

The issue with Zibs is at even strength.

At 5v5 he only has 39 SOG. Sadly, Trouba leads the team in SOG at 5v5. He also only has 2 goals at 5v5, from the same game. That's the issue.

 

[kovazub94]

It isn't the be-all-end-all of being a good passer, but after a few years, your team should score a few goals with you on the ice if you're a good passer.

You might need to establish some a base line or a framework - e.g. 40 points or more is "good baseline player". Then you look at the points composition ratio - if it's 1g/1.5a or higher assists - it's a good passer, and at some higher threshold like over 60 points - 1g/1a also becomes a good passer.

I just think your standards are too high if you think that only Panarin (and Fox if we're talking all skaters) are good passers.

P.S. As I'm writing this post I'm convincing myself that a skater with 25+ assists per season is a good passer.

 

[CLW]

I said the expectations were/should be higher because he was a higher draft pick and made the argument that Buchnevich found his game in year 5 & 6 and Chytil, in year 6, hasn't to the same degree. Do you expect a 3rd round pick to develop faster than a 1st - especially at the forward position? Do you NOT have higher expectations from the 1st round pick? You should.

And, given all of those around here yapping about 1st PP minutes etc... for Kakko and LaF, they should be really excelling on the 3rd line given their expectations and matchups. If they really are capable of being dominant (and that includes scoring) forwards then it seems like that should be happening there. Chytil has one shot in the last three games with pretty generous amounts of ice time against three teams that are really bad defensively. The kid line matching up with the opposition's 3rd line should be eating them for lunch given their pedigree and talent. I really hope all three of them figure it out and the Rangers aren't premature in giving up on them, but I think there's a legitimate cause for concern.

I don't think Chytil is 100%. One of many Rangers currently playing when he probably shouldn't.

 

[Ben Grimm]

Fischler Report: Debating the Rangers and Oilers’ Rocky Play

Stan Fischler's report covers differing opinions on the Edmonton Oilers and New York Rangers, why the American Thanksgiving NHL rule is phony and more.

thehockeynews.com

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

There have been lots of good powerplays over the years where you know exactly what's coming and you just can't stop it. I don't think they're far off from being elite again.

A legitimate bumper would help. Trocheck has good powerplay numbers in his career but he put them up playing the Kreider role on his previous teams. He feels a little miscast here. They don't have an actual shooting target other than Zibanejad.

On the Caps PP, you know it's going to Ovechkin, but Semin and then Oshie did just enough to keep you from shadowing Ovechkin. I don't think anybody's PK cares about Trocheck in the slot.

Yeah, it's tricky with Trocheck not really fitting in at the bumper slot yet - there's not anyone else to really swap into that slot IF the first PP unit is going to keep running their current set up and attack plan.

What I don't understand is why PP2 also tries to run everything from the far side half wall despite that player and the bumper both being left handed. They're constantly settling for dogshit Trouba shots from up high because he's the only time option available.

They should be running their set up from the near side so you're basically reversing what PP1 does because of the inverse handness on PP2.

Instead we get Kakko stickhandling on the far wall and either getting a pass through to another LH shot who has to turn to shoot because of where the pass is coming from and their handness OR force feeding Trouba bc he's the only right handed option. It should be running through Lafreniere on his strong hand so he's a threat to shoot, pass to the bumper or far wall for one timers or in front with deflections - which is what PP1 does from the other side.

I know they don't get much time, but it doesn't help that they're doing absolutely nothing to help themselves do anything constructive in the set time they do get.

 

[JohnC]

I don’t know how fair it is to compare Chytil to Buch. Buch was a better prospect and had/has the better tools/IQ.

 

[gravey9]

I haven't watched him play much this season, but Stralman is on waivers.

 

[IDvsEGO]

I haven't watched him play much this season, but Stralman is on waivers.

Because he’s ass now

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

The issue with Zibs is at even strength.

At 5v5 he only has 39 SOG. Sadly, Trouba leads the team in SOG at 5v5. He also only has 2 goals at 5v5, from the same game. That's the issue.

He never shoots 5 v 5. Actually he hardly ever is in a position to shoot 5v5 . On the PP he just launches from anywhere which must be juicing up those numbers. At least when Kakko was on that line he could set Zibs up in dangerous areas, he just couldn't buy a goal. Now that he's with Kreider and Vesey 2 of the worst passers ever he's not even getting looks.

I don’t know how fair it is to compare Chytil to Buch. Buch was a better prospect and had/has the better tools/IQ.

Why can’t we ever draft players like Buch smh

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Who are all these passers we have?

We're constantly passing around avoiding shots, if there's a certain issue with this team its that we don't put enough pucks on net. I'm not exactly sure why you think our forwards can't pass, our pp is basically a tutorial on passing. Kreider, Zib, Laf , Panarin, Trochek are all good passers, not sure where you got the idea they weren't.

 

[Clark Kellogg]

Rangers should claim Stralman ASAP and put Trouba on IR so he can get healthy and think about his failures as a Captain so far

I agree that Trouba should be on IR but would rather they just call up Welinski. Stralman is cooked.

 

[McRanger92]

I agree that Trouba should be on IR but would rather they just call up Welinski. Stralman is cooked.

Might as well see what Mike Kosta is up to if we’re resorting to Andy Welinski