Roster Building/Team Building/Future Trade/Drafting thread.

[Torontonian]

I get that this is just for fun and a lot of uncertainty doesn't help but there's just no way Nylander or Matthews are traded, we know this right?

There's probably a better chance the Leafs re-sign Marner than trade any of those 2 players.

Wouldn't say it's off the table, but highly unlikely. I'd imagine Treliving and Pelley meeting a lot (probably about handing out a potential 100m contract & Berube comments about wanting Marner + JT back, I could see them running it back.

People talk about big changes, moving on from your longest tenure Leaf in Morgan Reilly would be a pretty big change, and probably the best thing to do, plus gives you an extra 7.5m to get proper middle six forwards. It leaves a hole in your d-core, but 44 mediocre defense and offence can be replaced by OEL.

Something like this makes the team a whole lot deeper.. Obviously the players salary below could be different, but if you allocate that type of money to whatever player, it would make em deeper with Rielly + Jarnkork + Reaves + Kampf out.

Knies (7.5m) - Matthews - Nylander
Smith/Kane/Marchand (4m) - Donato/Suter/Granlund (5.25m) - Marner (12.75m)
Mantha (3.5m) - Tavares (4.75m) - Domi
McMann - Laughton - Lortentz (900k)

McCabe - Tanev
OEL - Carlo
Beniot - Myers.

 

[namttebih]

your building around the core player who's the biggest problem come playoff time, I don't see how that's a good idea..........

Nope, not what I said AT ALL. 1 year deal. Traded at the deadline.

 

[SprDaVE]

Wouldn't say it's off the table, but highly unlikely. I'd imagine Treliving and Pelley meeting a lot (probably about handing out a potential 100m contract & Berube comments about wanting Marner + JT back, I could see them running it back.

People talk about big changes, moving on from your longest tenure Leaf in Morgan Reilly would be a pretty big change, and probably the best thing to do, plus gives you an extra 7.5m to get proper middle six forwards. It leaves a hole in your d-core, but 44 mediocre defense and offence can be replaced by OEL.

Something like this makes the team a whole lot deeper.. Obviously the players salary below could be different, but if you allocate that type of money to whatever player, it would make em deeper with Rielly + Jarnkork + Reaves + Kampf out.

Knies (7.5m) - Matthews - Nylander
Smith/Kane/Marchand (4m) - Donato/Suter/Granlund (5.25m) - Marner (12.75m)
Mantha (3.5m) - Tavares (4.75m) - Domi
McMann - Laughton - Lortentz (900k)

McCabe - Tanev
OEL - Carlo
Beniot - Myers.

Shedding Marner is a pretty big change. It's probably the only big core change they will get to, mostly because he wants to leave. Rielly is a little more plausible based on his performance in the past season and his diminishing role. Nylander and Matthews will be the 2 guys to lead the charge into next season, with JT likely back in a smaller/cheaper role. Only way Marner stays is if his family desperately want him to stay and he takes a deal a lot smaller than he's expected to get.

Seeing a bunch of Matthews and Nylander trade ideas/proposals mounting seems completely out of the realm of what they will be doing. They want to stay at the top as much as possible, not rebuilding or completely nuke the team. But anything is possible and it's early.

 

[mydnyte]

Wouldn't say it's off the table, but highly unlikely. I'd imagine Treliving and Pelley meeting a lot (probably about handing out a potential 100m contract & Berube comments about wanting Marner + JT back, I could see them running it back.

People talk about big changes, moving on from your longest tenure Leaf in Morgan Reilly would be a pretty big change, and probably the best thing to do, plus gives you an extra 7.5m to get proper middle six forwards. It leaves a hole in your d-core, but 44 mediocre defense and offence can be replaced by OEL.

Something like this makes the team a whole lot deeper.. Obviously the players salary below could be different, but if you allocate that type of money to whatever player, it would make em deeper with Rielly + Jarnkork + Reaves + Kampf out.

Knies (7.5m) - Matthews - Nylander
Smith/Kane/Marchand (4m) - Donato/Suter/Granlund (5.25m) - Marner (12.75m)
Mantha (3.5m) - Tavares (4.75m) - Domi
McMann - Laughton - Lortentz (900k)

McCabe - Tanev
OEL - Carlo
Beniot - Myers.

Mantha is done as an NHLer and was never actually good, i wouldnt take a risk on him at league min. spend that 3.5 on someone else (other salaries are a bit lower than expected also)

 

[Fogelhund]

He’s a great player but to suggest he doesn’t EVER succumb to pressure is crazy. He was outscored 4-1 at 5v5 in the last 4 games of the Florida series. He was the 5th highest paid forward in the NHL this season and he was on the ice for 1 5v5 goal and had 0 points in the last 4 games of the season.

Playing mostly with Holmberg and Playoff Tavares.... I expect more out of Nylander as well...but he can't do it all on his own, all the time. You see him going for one of his patented skate, where he has great puck possession, and could do six laps of the offensive zone, and still not find someone in a good spot to pass it to. Passes to Holmberg, who then gives up the puck after doing nothing.... To me, Nylander looked a bit like a guy who had given up a little near the end... no matter what he tried, nobody else was on the same page as him, and his efforts were mostly wasted. Holmberg looked like he had some room to grow his game, man... did that ever not happen. I thought this guy could be a mid 30 point guy.... NOPE.

Yes, we should expect more from Nylander, but we've also got to put him in a better situation to succeed as well. He needs more appropriate linemates going forward. I liked him with McMann in the regular season, but McMann also had a rough playoffs, and you never really saw that patented rush speed. McMann isn't young, but this was his first NHL playoffs, so I'm not going to judge him too harshly.

 

[WTFMAN99]

Shedding Marner is a pretty big change. It's probably the only big core change they will get to, mostly because he wants to leave. Rielly is a little more plausible based on his performance in the past season and his diminishing role. Nylander and Matthews will be the 2 guys to lead the charge into next season, with JT likely back in a smaller/cheaper role. Only way Marner stays is if his family desperately want him to stay and he takes a deal a lot smaller than he's expected to get.

Seeing a bunch of Matthews and Nylander trade ideas/proposals mounting seems completely out of the realm of what they will be doing. They want to stay at the top as much as possible, not rebuilding or completely nuke the team. But anything is possible and it's early.

The other thing that people forget with Rielly is that Tree never extended him, that was Dubas. Obviously there is a NMC to contend with but at some point you need to get your hands dirty as an organization.

"We're not having success, better keep the guys around that have been here through all our failure" said no one but the Leafs ever apparently. If Shanny is considered a big move (he shouldn't be, he doesn't play) and Marner...it's not enough turn over at the core of this roster.

JT due to our flexibility with his contract right now and lack of quality centres makes sense to bring back to some degree.

Morgan Rielly? Let's go, he's tried to replace his offense to some degree the last 2 years in Klingberg and OEL.

Mantha is done as an NHLer and was never actually good, i wouldnt take a risk on him at league min. spend that 3.5 on someone else (other salaries are a bit lower than expected also)

Mantha was fine/good on Calgary before his injury last year.

 

[Fogelhund]

send them Kampf in return, your shit for our shit...........

I'd agree we need to free up Kampf's cap space, to better allocate it to players who provide value for their cap hit. Turning around and allocating that to Anderson doesn't achieve that. I'd rather dump Kampf off on someone for a draft pick, or middling prospect. Now..if we can swap Kampf for 50% retained Anderson, and then send of Jarnkrok to a third party, for another 50% retention, now we are talking... But, ya... that isn't going to happen.

 

[ULF_55]

Obviously the players salary below could be different, ...

Knies (7.5m) - Matthews - Nylander
Smith/Kane/Marchand (4m) - Donato/Suter/Granlund (5.25m) - Marner (12.75m)
Mantha (3.5m) - Tavares (4.75m) - Domi
McMann - Laughton - Lortentz (900k)

McCabe - Tanev
OEL - Carlo
Beniot - Myers.

My guess is you are about 10-20% low on the contracts.
If true rumour is marner already turned to $13.5.

Would make for a more interesting off-season.

I support your efforts.

 

[weems]

Watching these games and the speed down the middle really stands out and here are the speed bursts over 20 MPH for the top two centers on each remaining team and the Leafs.

Toronto

Matthews
78 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5
Tavares
97 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5

Dallas

Hintz
363 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5
Duchene
159 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5

Edmonton

McDavid
442 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5
Drasaitl
202 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5

Florida

Barkov
136 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5
Bennett
118 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5

Carolina

Aho
115 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5
Roslovic
144 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5
Kotkaniemi
99 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5

 

[mydnyte]

Mantha was fine/good on Calgary before his injury last year.

I'm just going off of hockeydb
23-24 18 games
24-25 13 games
since 2020 (games played)
43
42
14
37
67
56
18
13

like i said, i'm not sure i'd waste the roster spot at league min on him if only for the injury history.

 

[Torontonian]

Mantha is done as an NHLer and was never actually good, i wouldnt take a risk on him at league min. spend that 3.5 on someone else (other salaries are a bit lower than expected also)

Bold claim to say that -- He's had good seasons, he's had bad seasons.. He was paid like a top 6 player on Washington, but was producing like a 3rd liner. Staying healthy is his biggest problem, but he played in more or less 65+ games a season since being traded to Washington.

2023-2024 he put up 44 points in 74 games with the Capitals & Vegas
2024-2025 he put up 7 points in 13 games with Calgary before getting injuried.

Its tough to say on salaries, I think this off season for contracts are gonna surprise some people both good & bad... Is someone going to pay long term for Donato at age 29 after his first solid season? Same with Suter..

Shedding Marner is a pretty big change. It's probably the only big core change they will get to, mostly because he wants to leave. Rielly is a little more plausible based on his performance in the past season and his diminishing role. Nylander and Matthews will be the 2 guys to lead the charge into next season, with JT likely back in a smaller/cheaper role. Only way Marner stays is if his family desperately want him to stay and he takes a deal a lot smaller than he's expected to get.

Seeing a bunch of Matthews and Nylander trade ideas/proposals mounting seems completely out of the realm of what they will be doing. They want to stay at the top as much as possible, not rebuilding or completely nuke the team. But anything is possible and it's early.

Shredding Marner is more of a massive change, it's also a very risky and franchise altering one.. Especially when you're not getting anything in return for him, I think Toronto wants to retain him, but also think Marner is checked out of Toronto, but again there's so much at play for him personally etc... I think if he stays, he's not going to be paid more then Matthews, but not less then Nylander. That's how I came up with the 12.75 (2m raise essentially).

People don't listen when others speak... Pelley want's to deliver a championship to the fans, I don't think he's talking about 6-7 years from now ... He might not even be here then... Nuking the team does that to them, so no I don't think Matthews and Nylander will be traded, they made a lot of extra revenue for MLSE making the playoffs for 9 straight years, I don't think MLSE want's that to change, which is why I can see them trying to resign Marner.

 

[mydnyte]

Watching these games and the speed down the middle really stands out and here are the speed bursts over 20 MPH for the top two centers on each remaining team and the Leafs.

Toronto

Matthews
78 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5
Tavares
97 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5

Dallas

Hintz
363 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5
Duchene
159 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5

Edmonton

McDavid
442 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5
Drasaitl
202 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5

Florida

Barkov
136 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5
Bennett
118 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5

Carolina

Aho
115 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5
Roslovic
144 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5
Kotkaniemi
99 speed bursts over 20mph vs League average of 76.5

different style of play, Now, we pass at the blueline or dump, they are more rush offenses

 

[WTFMAN99]

I'm just going off of hockeydb
23-24 18 games
24-25 13 games
since 2020 (games played)
43
42
14
37
67
56
18
13

like i said, i'm not sure i'd waste the roster spot at league min on him if only for the injury history.

14+37 = 51
51
67
56+18 = 74
74
13

So 51, 67, 74 and 13 in the last 4 years

Not that great but I guess if we were worried about injury concern we wouldn't have signed Patches or Tanev.

 

[weems]

different style of play, Now, we pass at the blueline or dump, they are more rush offenses

This is a good potential reason but I wouldn't call either Matthews or Tavares fast.

I would personally be looking to find a different center to play with Nylander, someone that can do a better job of keeping with his pace.

 

[Americanadian]

Playing mostly with Holmberg and Playoff Tavares.... I expect more out of Nylander as well...but he can't do it all on his own, all the time. You see him going for one of his patented skate, where he has great puck possession, and could do six laps of the offensive zone, and still not find someone in a good spot to pass it to. Passes to Holmberg, who then gives up the puck after doing nothing.... To me, Nylander looked a bit like a guy who had given up a little near the end... no matter what he tried, nobody else was on the same page as him, and his efforts were mostly wasted. Holmberg looked like he had some room to grow his game, man... did that ever not happen. I thought this guy could be a mid 30 point guy.... NOPE.

Yes, we should expect more from Nylander, but we've also got to put him in a better situation to succeed as well. He needs more appropriate linemates going forward. I liked him with McMann in the regular season, but McMann also had a rough playoffs, and you never really saw that patented rush speed. McMann isn't young, but this was his first NHL playoffs, so I'm not going to judge him too harshly.

We both acknowledge that he can be better. I was responding to the claim that he doesn’t EVER succumb to pressure which either: is true and he’s just not good enough or, pressure does get to him too.

 

[Torontonian]

I'm just going off of hockeydb
23-24 18 games
24-25 13 games
since 2020 (games played)
43
42
14
37
67
56
18
13

like i said, i'm not sure i'd waste the roster spot at league min on him if only for the injury history.

Some of those seasons, were split between two teams..

2021/2022 = 42 games with Detriot, 14 with the Capitals.
2023/2024 = 56 games with Capitals, 18 with Vegas.

 

[Soundgarden]

I'll start by saying that I realize that it's probably (almost assuredly) not going to happen. But I'm bored and have been trying different ways of retooling. Nothing I do makes the team a contender for either next season or in the long term. I think that we're all in need of a little levity, so let's see your NHL 2025 ideas for an excellerated rebuild.

Matthews 50% retained
To Utah for
Cooley
Guenther
4OA

Nylander
Rielly
To Nashville for
5OA
23OA
26OA


Sign Marner 1 x $19
Promise to trade him to a contender at the TDL. Tell him that his legacy will be fixed. Basically the opposite of Sundin at the end of his career.
FOR
2 1STs

Jake McCabe
To Buf for
Byram

So....Nashville isn't trading three 1sts for two 30 year olds, neither of whom are centers. We're tanking for McKenna this torpedos that.

 

[mydnyte]

This is a good potential reason but I wouldn't call either Matthews or Tavares fast.

I would personally be looking to find a different center to play with Nylander, someone that can do a better job of keeping with his pace.

neither would I, but, oddly, JT is always up there on the team for speed bursts, and everyone calls him slow.

 

[WTFMAN99]

neither would I, but, oddly, JT is always up there on the team for speed bursts, and everyone calls him slow.

Chart vs eye test

 

[rumman]

I'd agree we need to free up Kampf's cap space, to better allocate it to players who provide value for their cap hit. Turning around and allocating that to Anderson doesn't achieve that. I'd rather dump Kampf off on someone for a draft pick, or middling prospect. Now..if we can swap Kampf for 50% retained Anderson, and then send of Jarnkrok to a third party, for another 50% retention, now we are talking... But, ya... that isn't going to happen.

I know Anderson is loathed here mostly because he’s a Hab snd overpaid, but I think obtaining him and Crouse would go a long way to fixing the lack of compete, even moreso if they could also get McBain…….

 

[Fogelhund]

I know Snderson id liathed here mostly because he’s a Hab snd overpaid, but I think obtaining him and Crouse would go a long way to fixing the lack of compete, even moreso if they could also get McBain…….

I like these type of players. I think we need these type of players.

40 point Crouse, on a $4.3 mil contract is good value. 18 point Crouse, on a $4.3 mil contract isn't.

With second line time, and second line type linemates, you got reasonable production out of him... now, 40 points isn't usually good second line production though, but it is ok... if you are bringing the other intangibles. But, Utahs young talent pushed him down to third line teammates, and third line minutes... and his production cratered.

McBain had the same time on ice... but he excelled in it... That's a kid I'd love to have, and his contract is good for his production.

I like Anderson, it's just the contract isn't any good. I'd take both Anderson, and Crouse.. if Anderson were at $1.5, and Crouse was 50% retained... But at full pop... that's $9.8 mil... for something like 37 points combined... oof.

 

[Dreakmur]

Karlsson is not a camp dump. Go on the main trade boards, there would be lots of teams willing to trade for Karlsson using a 1st round pick as a basis. The Leafs don’t have any 1st round picks, Karlsson is a pipe dream.

If teams are willing to give up a lot for him, that’s great for Vegas. He’s their most expendable large contract.

Pietrangelo is not shocking, he is 35 on a $8.8 million contract for 2 years and wasn’t as effective last year. Vegas has defence that can slot into his spot. They need a winger that is $4 million or less. Go look on the Vegas boards to see what the team is looking to do this off season.

Pietrangelo was Vegas’ #1 defenseman last season. He takes all the toughest matchups, and they have nobody to take on that role. Tampa bay made this mistake when they thought Ryan McDonagh was expendable.

Eichel is the main target for extension and Vegas doesn’t have the cap room to pay $14+ million for Marner when they have $9.615 million in cap space to sign 5 players + extension for Eichel next year. Just don’t see Vegas going for Marner when they are forced to look for cheaper options elsewhere.

They don’t have to sign Eichel under this year’s 95 million dollar cap. His next contract won’t kick in until the cap is 104 million. His entire raise will be covered by that cap jump, so that can confidently spend with to 95 this year.

 

[rumman]

I like these type of players. I think we need these type of players.

40 point Crouse, on a $4.3 mil contract is good value. 18 point Crouse, on a $4.3 mil contract isn't.

With second line time, and second line type linemates, you got reasonable production out of him... now, 40 points isn't usually good second line production though, but it is ok... if you are bringing the other intangibles. But, Utahs young talent pushed him down to third line teammates, and third line minutes... and his production cratered.

McBain had the same time on ice... but he excelled in it... That's a kid I'd love to have, and his contract is good for his production.

I like Anderson, it's just the contract isn't any good. I'd take both Anderson, and Crouse.. if Anderson were at $1.5, and Crouse was 50% retained... But at full pop... that's $9.8 mil... for something like 37 points combined... oof.

Easily doable if you move bad contracts and underperformers out…….

 

[Fogelhund]

Easily doable if you move bad contracts and underperformers out…….

Easily doable at full pop?

 

[weems]

Crouse's shooting % this season was 9.5%

The previous three seasons.....15.3, 15.9, 13.5

Good time to buy low?