Well i agree Stepan was pretty bad in the last round BUT Kreider has bene great since he has been back. I actually like nash and agree he is doing other things defensively BUT his offensive issues fall on him. he has had a lot of shots and he hasnt been able to score. Also he needs to play hard every shift which is an issue for him"Manifesto"? I am kind of proud to have been an author to one of those.
But a couple of things.
No, I was not putting the -- "BLAME" -- on Nash's teammates. I am meerly stating the obvious, the line he is on (and part of) is not getting it done in the sense of creating a high scoring environment and no RWer (with maybe 2-4 exceptions) in this league would score a lot if put in Nash skates.
By blaming everyone around a player, you can "explain" most. But I would never have writte what I wrote about say a Redden or a Gomez. But I definitely think its warranted to point those things out as regards to Nash. I mean seriously, there are people talking about buying him our or if he should be scratched. That is as lol-worthy as the "who is better, Hank or X ECHL goalie?"-threads.
Our highest scoring player has 8 pts in 14 games, Nash has 5 pts. He has the most shots of all players in the POs. Nash is a plus player despite playing the toughest match-ups in two really close series. Both teams we have faced have matched their D pairings against Nash on both home and away ice.
You automatically assume its about "blame", and in this case I just don't think its accurate. I am sorry, I don't think Nash play has warrented him being scratched after being a -- major factor -- in this team making the Eastern Conference Finals and no I don't think his play has warrented us buying him out. So shoot me.
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SKjEi o2
Registered User
- Nov 13, 2013
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He has had a lot of shots but not a lot of chances. Mostly perimeter shots from the boards.
TheTakedown
Puck is Life
- Jul 11, 2012
- 13,694
- 1,493
Nash's Ice time went down by another 1.5 mins last game:
I'm Glad AV is not giving him the coddle treatment.
I'm Glad AV is not giving him the coddle treatment.
slipknottin
Registered User
Stepan has no trouble setting up Kreider.
Nobody sets Nash up because Nash is the guy with the puck turning it over or slowing down the break in.
Nobody sets Nash up because Nash is the guy with the puck turning it over or slowing down the break in.
Nash's Ice time went down by another 1.5 mins last game:
I'm Glad AV is not giving him the coddle treatment.
AV took him and his soft indifferent perimeter presence off of the power play once Kreider got back. 3 games, 3 PP goals, 3 Wins.
Is there a correlation? Maybe. Maybe not.
Yeah, but the thing is that what you write can either be the least controversial post ever or something I definitely don't agree with -- depending on what conclusions you draw from it.
I mean, there is a ton of people in this thread comparing him to a 4th lineer, calling for him to be scratched or bought out.
I mean, Nash has 52 shots, 3 posts, and has played a lot of hockey the last 14 games. Nobody can argue that he shouldn't have put a couple of pucks in the back of the net (which would have put him at the top of our scoring race). I mean he is in the midst of a classic slump and of course he is responsible for that. -- But there is a helluva diffrence between facing a slump and being dumped. --
And like, Hank was in a slump earlier this season too and half the boards wanted him gone too. So its no unusual at this place. But I just don't always think that you have to stay with the flow and agree with this stuff. I called Hank out too for playing bad, but I always accompined it with a reassurance that he was -- still -- a good goalie that would come back. And exactly like with Nash, and like I pointed out at the time, there were several aspects that could be pointed at with Hank too.
I just think we should be patient with Nash. From my point of view, we make our own bed with him. As it is now, the team is playing well and other lines are playing well, but in this equation we ice a 1st line that isn't able to score a lot of goal. We could try Nash with Zucc or Brass or shift lines or build a PP around him to try to get him going, like many teams often do, but would it make us better as a team if we got him in a scoring position again while tearing apart other functioning units? I don't believe so and I don't think AV is making that call either. And when you don't give a star special threatment, you risk getting what we are getting right now.
Rangers ftw
Registered User
- May 8, 2007
- 2,389
- 460
Weird. I think Richards has been one of the better players during this playoff. Nash on the other hand look as lost as ever.
Stepan set-up Kreider for a goal 6 times during the regular season. They played together what 60+ games. Its not like "wow" numbers.
I think Kreider had like 11 or 12 goals playing with Stepan and Nash.
And every other post above is like "but Kreider can score pts on that line", what am I missing? Kreider has been on the scoreboard in 1 of 4 PO games.
The thing is, I am not even blaming Stepan. Not even remotely. Nor Kreider. But these 3 has played together all season almost, does anyone think they are showing good chemistry out there in terms of that last 5% that get pucks into the back of the net??? Seriously, its among the worst lines I've ever seen in that regard in relation to how much ice time they get and what they accomplish in general. Almost never is Stepan able to set up Kreider or Nash. Almost never is Kreider able to set up Stepan or Nash. Almost never is Nash able to set up Kreider or Stepan. Is Nash part of the problem here too? Of course, but believe me, what you get from him here is something you get with a ton of other players in his mold too. Undoubtedly, in a not so positive fashion, he is a player his linemates has to adjust to and not the other way around. But its also possible for his linemates to take advantage of what he brings, but Kreider-Stepan (while getting a bit better during the course of the season), has not been able to do that.
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The thing is, Richards was able to set up Nash a lot more than Stepan has been able to do.
But, if you play Richards with Nash, the team we play against will target that line. And Richards is not as good 2-ways as Stepan is. There is a destinct risk that a Hags/Kreider-BR-Nash line would not have been able to stand up against Giroux or Crosby/Malkin the way Kreider-Step-Nash line stood up against them.
The game nowadays is about momentum. We -- loose -- momentum if we break-up our lines.
But, if you play Richards with Nash, the team we play against will target that line. And Richards is not as good 2-ways as Stepan is. There is a destinct risk that a Hags/Kreider-BR-Nash line would not have been able to stand up against Giroux or Crosby/Malkin the way Kreider-Step-Nash line stood up against them.
The game nowadays is about momentum. We -- loose -- momentum if we break-up our lines.
Bottom line is taht both Stepan and nash are important and they need to play better. thankfully Hank is in beast mode, the pou-brass-zucc line has been our best line, and richards kreider and msl have really stepped up on the offense. Also Boyle deserves a ton of credit. I dont think anybody si being unfair to Rick Nash. With his ability he should be playing etter and im not just talking about goals he needs to elevate hsi whole game. i give him credit for FINALLY uses hsi big body and checks but he ahs another level. Hopefully he plays betetr in round 3 because if he does we are in great shape
Kel Varnsen
Below: Nash's Heart
- Sep 27, 2009
- 3,554
- 0
I'm sorry, but you're living in an alternate universe.
In the real universe, Nash has been offensively poor on his own merits and it has nothing to do with his linemates. He's been a total passenger on that line, with Kreider doing a great job dictating the pace and Step doing an adequate to solid job setting him up.
"Manifesto"? I am kind of proud to have been an author to one of those.
But a couple of things.
No, I was not putting the -- "BLAME" -- on Nash's teammates. I am meerly stating the obvious, the line he is on (and part of) is not getting it done in the sense of creating a high scoring environment and no RWer (with maybe 2-4 exceptions) in this league would score a lot if put in Nash skates.
By blaming everyone around a player, you can "explain" most. But I would never have writte what I wrote about say a Redden or a Gomez. But I definitely think its warranted to point those things out as regards to Nash. I mean seriously, there are people talking about buying him our or if he should be scratched. That is as lol-worthy as the "who is better, Hank or X ECHL goalie?"-threads.
Our highest scoring player has 8 pts in 14 games, Nash has 5 pts. He has the most shots of all players in the POs. Nash is a plus player despite playing the toughest match-ups in two really close series. Both teams we have faced have matched their D pairings against Nash on both home and away ice.
You automatically assume its about "blame", and in this case I just don't think its accurate. I am sorry, I don't think Nash play has warrented him being scratched after being a -- major factor -- in this team making the Eastern Conference Finals and no I don't think his play has warrented us buying him out. So shoot me.
Youre not talking to a loony who wants Nash scratched, so give it a rest with that stuff.
Fact of the matter is, ever since game 3 of the Flyers series, Nash has been an absolute abortion in every type of offensive situation. On the rush, along the boards, in front of the net (if he ever uses his map to find that spot), you name it and Nash has fumbled and bumbled his way to a poor play.
Instead of shifting blame to his teammates, a much more lucid argument would be that Nash is actually bringing his linemates down.
"Manifesto"? I am kind of proud to have been an author to one of those.
But a couple of things.
No, I was not putting the -- "BLAME" -- on Nash's teammates. I am meerly stating the obvious, the line he is on (and part of) is not getting it done in the sense of creating a high scoring environment and no RWer (with maybe 2-4 exceptions) in this league would score a lot if put in Nash skates.
By blaming everyone around a player, you can "explain" most. But I would never have writte what I wrote about say a Redden or a Gomez. But I definitely think its warranted to point those things out as regards to Nash. I mean seriously, there are people talking about buying him our or if he should be scratched. That is as lol-worthy as the "who is better, Hank or X ECHL goalie?"-threads.
Our highest scoring player has 8 pts in 14 games, Nash has 5 pts. He has the most shots of all players in the POs. Nash is a plus player despite playing the toughest match-ups in two really close series. Both teams we have faced have matched their D pairings against Nash on both home and away ice.
You automatically assume its about "blame", and in this case I just don't think its accurate. I am sorry, I don't think Nash play has warrented him being scratched after being a -- major factor -- in this team making the Eastern Conference Finals and no I don't think his play has warrented us buying him out. So shoot me.
Major factor? Holy exaggeration Batman. He has given me less than Moore and Boyle. That's ridiculous, you can blame everything around him, it's his job to create. What a joke the excuses are at this point.
HockeyBasedNYC
Feeling it
Yeah if he gets hot, who knows. Theyll need guys like Nash, Kreider and Boyle to throw it around in this series. I would put Nash on the 4th line and let Dom Moore straighten him out. He plays a simple, smart playoff game. Maybe itll rub off. Not seeing Nash getting to any prime scoring areas. He needs to do more without the puck in the offensive zone ,though hes been very good defensively imo. Too cautious though.
Nash is one of the worst players I've ever seen when it comes to protecting the puck in tight spaces. Hes so big and long that is always seems like the puck is 6 feet away from him.
OverTheCap
Registered User
- Jan 3, 2009
- 10,454
- 184
He has no clue how to use his size to protect the puck, he generally tries to stickhandle instead or doesn't engage at all and turns it over. Most players who excel at protecting the puck use their frame and leg strength, a la Jagr, but Nash doesn't have this ability.
Unlike guys like Jagr and even Boyle, who use their size and length to their advantage in tight spaces.
Jagr sticks that big butt into you and all of sudden you're like a half a rink away from the puck!
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Yeah yeah yeah, and Hank was done any ECHL goalie was better and what not lol.
Kel Varnsen
Below: Nash's Heart
- Sep 27, 2009
- 3,554
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Kel its always the same thing with you, its like you live to trash 1 or 2 players on this team more than you follow the team. I've seen your post for like the 5 years, every other post you make you are puking on someone.
Is that fun or what?
JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK
Twenty f*ckin years
- Oct 8, 2010
- 80,070
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Kel Varnsen
Below: Nash's Heart
- Sep 27, 2009
- 3,554
- 0
I only post about things I find interesting. I don't find love-fests interesting. I do find people supporting things that are unsupportable interesting. I find debate interesting, I do not find mutual masturbation interesting. So that's why I generally only post if I disagree with something. I don't post in most threads, it's not like I'm being contradictory everywhere. And as for Nash, I've actually went from being in the minority position to being in the majority position, through other people's movement.
I live for a lot more than what I post on these boards.
Where are you now on your 'Sather has been great since the lockout' concept from two years ago? Seems like you've been anti-Sather between then and now. Which side of the fence are you falling on now?
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