Rebuild Status - # 1 Dman
- Thread starter OrlandK
- Start date
Good Intentions
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- Mar 30, 2018
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Lazy work by the 'writer' - and it's a (useless) list, not an article.
As for having a legitimate #1, I think Karlsson finds his way to us. Somehow, some way in February.
As for having a legitimate #1, I think Karlsson finds his way to us. Somehow, some way in February.
- Sep 17, 2007
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Yeah, that isn't going to happen. Zero chance that we trade for him.
eco's bones
Registered User
I don't see Karlsson coming here at all. Ottawa's going to want two out of 3 of Chytil, Andersson, Kravtsov and probably some other add-ins. Additionally both the Senators and Rangers are very long shots to make the playoffs--teams like that tend to sell and not to buy at the deadline which is when most players do move.
As for the Rangers and the No. 1 d-man issue---they don't have a legit #1D and IMO they don't have one coming at the moment. That isn't to say the Rangers are bereft of coming talent on the blueline. Skjei, Hajek, Lindgren, Rykov, Miller, Lundkvist, Pionk, DeAngelo etc.--that's a lot of talent and the Rangers should in a few years have a pretty good D but I don't see any one of these guys getting even to Ryan McDonagh status and he was kind of a middling No. 1 D. Looking through the Hockey News list though--there are a number of teams who don't have a great top defenseman either.
As for the Rangers and the No. 1 d-man issue---they don't have a legit #1D and IMO they don't have one coming at the moment. That isn't to say the Rangers are bereft of coming talent on the blueline. Skjei, Hajek, Lindgren, Rykov, Miller, Lundkvist, Pionk, DeAngelo etc.--that's a lot of talent and the Rangers should in a few years have a pretty good D but I don't see any one of these guys getting even to Ryan McDonagh status and he was kind of a middling No. 1 D. Looking through the Hockey News list though--there are a number of teams who don't have a great top defenseman either.
It would be ridiculous to trade for Karlsson. He's almost a sure thing to hit the market where he'll get a huge deal. If you're dead-set on picking him up, you wait until free agency rather than surrender a lot of assets in a trade.
- Jul 20, 2005
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aufheben
#Norris4Fox
You don't actually think Shatty is better right?
- Jul 20, 2005
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That depends. Is it still 2018? Or have I time shifted to an earlier date when people still think Weber is great?
OrlandK
Registered User
These lists are always subjective. Is Shea Weber still a number 1 - nobody really knows. Have to see his play when he returns. Who cares anyway - Montreal stinks and he won't be a number 1 if and when they become good, he'll just be a bad contract at that point or retired.
The real take away and problem is we don't have a 1st pair dman. I like Shatty a lot but he is not that, and we have no real #1 prospects. So most likely we need another year of finishing in the bottom 10 and trading off assets for picks at the trade deadline.
The real take away and problem is we don't have a 1st pair dman. I like Shatty a lot but he is not that, and we have no real #1 prospects. So most likely we need another year of finishing in the bottom 10 and trading off assets for picks at the trade deadline.
mrmovies779
The Greatest Teacher,Failure is.
- Feb 5, 2013
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For all his warts,i still take Weber over Shattenkirk 10 times out of 10.
Rongomania
I use my Kakko jersey as pajamas now.
Rongomania
I use my Kakko jersey as pajamas now.
- Jul 20, 2005
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If this list is for 2018-2019 (which I am assuming it is, given the title) he's going to miss half the season with knee surgery. So unless he returns from knee surgery at age 33 so significantly better than he even was when he got hurt that he is able to compensate for all the lost time then that's probably a bad choice.
If this list is "going forward" its still extremely questionable. And that's with pretending that he is actually a great defenseman at even strength, which he isn't.
Thirty One
Safe is safe.
- Dec 28, 2003
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I would take Shattenkirk over Weber 7 times out of 10. The first 3 times, I would take Shattenkirk. Then back-to-back Webers. Then Shattenkirk-Shattenkirk-Shattenkirk-Weber-Shattenkirk.
mrmovies779
The Greatest Teacher,Failure is.
- Feb 5, 2013
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9/10 for me.
I'd go Shattenkirk-Shattenkirk-Weber-Shattenkirk- Shattenkirk-Shattenkirk-Shattenkirk-Shattenkirk-Shattenkirk-Shattenkirk. Shattenkirk almost every day of the week and twice on Sunday but Weber on Mondays because Monday is an IDGAF kind of day, you know?
NYRFANMANI
Department of Rempe Safety Management
When Lidstrom was drafted 53 OA did anybody immediately know that he would turn into the best defenseman of his time? I'm certain nobody did.
What I'm saying is that we neither. We might have that legit #1 in the system, we might draft a kid in the top 5 that doesn't turn into a legit #1 D.
If we had drafted Wilde in the 2nd round I'd say enough D, do not need more. In our case we might need another RHD prospect and then it's set. Need to let the kids develope and see what we actually have here.
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OrlandK
Registered User
Agree that it can happen; there are always outlier examples. That said - the highest probability to have a successful rebuild is to have prospects that project to be excellent. If you look at where the great players in the league have been drafted only top goaltenders typically come from lower round draft picks and/or weren't that highly touted.
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doomscroll
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- Jan 15, 2018
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I think the notion that the Rangers don't have a potential #1 D-man and that they need to make some substantial move to acquire one is putting the cart before the horse. Having Karlsson sign next summer would be all well and good, but he's basically a decade older than the crop of forward prospects that the team is hinging their future on (Chytil, Andersson, Kravtsov, etc.), and he would take up roughly 15% of the cap in UFA. It is going to take roughly half-a-decade for the aforementioned forward group to reach their full potential, and in that time I think there is a good chance that at least one among the current pipeline can develop/project to be a top-pairing defenseman by that point.
We all want the rebuild to be expedited by nature of instant gratification, but staying the course of some extended timeline gives the team a good chance of finding the defenseman every team wants, so long as the list of potential options remains lengthy. There are ten young defensemen in the system, IMO, who have varying potential to become top-four defensemen (Skjei, Rykov, Lundkvist, Pionk, DeAngelo, Hajek, Miller, Lundkvist, Keane, and Ragnarsson) and only one or two of them need to maintain an upward trajectory into the illusive top-pairing position. I think that there is a very good chance that this coming season will shift the narrative of the Rangers' defensive woes as certain prospects rise above their preconceived trajectory and project to be top-pairing players. If I had to guess, those players will be Rykov and Lundkvist, though the other eight have as good of a chance to project as top-four staples as the season wears on.
Aside from the future on defense - what if the Rangers sign Karlsson and then none of Chytil, Andersson, or Kravtsov become top-line impact players? The team will be married to Karlsson's contract as he ages while the team frantically tries to supplement the remainder of his prime with further efforts to sign big-name UFAs, and we'll find ourselves in a rebuild amidst mediocrity all-over again.
Expediting the rebuild only makes sense if we otherwise know what we have on our hands in terms of the team's composition. We don't, though, so it doesn't make sense.
We all want the rebuild to be expedited by nature of instant gratification, but staying the course of some extended timeline gives the team a good chance of finding the defenseman every team wants, so long as the list of potential options remains lengthy. There are ten young defensemen in the system, IMO, who have varying potential to become top-four defensemen (Skjei, Rykov, Lundkvist, Pionk, DeAngelo, Hajek, Miller, Lundkvist, Keane, and Ragnarsson) and only one or two of them need to maintain an upward trajectory into the illusive top-pairing position. I think that there is a very good chance that this coming season will shift the narrative of the Rangers' defensive woes as certain prospects rise above their preconceived trajectory and project to be top-pairing players. If I had to guess, those players will be Rykov and Lundkvist, though the other eight have as good of a chance to project as top-four staples as the season wears on.
Aside from the future on defense - what if the Rangers sign Karlsson and then none of Chytil, Andersson, or Kravtsov become top-line impact players? The team will be married to Karlsson's contract as he ages while the team frantically tries to supplement the remainder of his prime with further efforts to sign big-name UFAs, and we'll find ourselves in a rebuild amidst mediocrity all-over again.
Expediting the rebuild only makes sense if we otherwise know what we have on our hands in terms of the team's composition. We don't, though, so it doesn't make sense.
OrlandK
Registered User
I don't think signing Karlsson would expedite the rebuild - it would ruin it. At best, even with him, we are 3 seasons away from contending for the Cup. At that point he probably will be a past his prime on a bad contract. In the next two years our prospects will not be ready to compete for the Cup - we need to sift thru them to see what we have, as well as acquire some more. This season will be about player development.
As far as hoping that our d prospects have 1st pair potential that is based on the law of averages/ blind squirrel theory. Skjei has a chance. Hajek perhaps a long shot but most of the prospect evaluators think the Rangers are too high on him. Most of the rest are long shots to make it to the top 6. The best shot is Miller as far as high end talent and he has only been a d man for 2 seasons - he is as likely to be a total bust as a 1st pair dman.
As far as hoping that our d prospects have 1st pair potential that is based on the law of averages/ blind squirrel theory. Skjei has a chance. Hajek perhaps a long shot but most of the prospect evaluators think the Rangers are too high on him. Most of the rest are long shots to make it to the top 6. The best shot is Miller as far as high end talent and he has only been a d man for 2 seasons - he is as likely to be a total bust as a 1st pair dman.
The Crypto Guy
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- Jun 26, 2017
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The Rangers have arguably one of the worst D units in the NHL. The Islanders are right there with them. Jeff Gorton has his work cut out for him. He knows that. Gorton acquired so many D in the deadline trades. Hajek. Lindgren. Rykov. They used two first round picks on Miller and Lundkvist. This an organization which used #1 picks on Staal,Sanguinetti and Del Zotto. They traded for another #1 pick in McDonagh. They used a 2nd on Sauer. The Rangers need to rebuild their D.
The Vegas sports book should put out an over/under on how many times Lundqvist loses his mind playing behind the Rangers current group this season.
The Vegas sports book should put out an over/under on how many times Lundqvist loses his mind playing behind the Rangers current group this season.
