Speculation: Raymond Seider Contract Speculation

[Shaman464]

But the doom and gloom didn't happen after those bridge deals.

The consensus seems to be how bridge deal is a total failure and you should go 8 years at any cost and it's the only reasonable way.

How the whole point for long deal is to overpay at first years and then get a steal on later years.

But why overpay on first years, when they never had to overpay? Not for those bridges and not for the 3rd deals after that. That could be Yzerman logic, outside from the consensus.

Still, Yzerman has not signed any player to 8-year deal after an ELC.

Hedman - ELC - 5-year - 8-year
Stamkos - ELC - 5-year - 8-year
Kucherov - ELC - 3-year - 8-year
Vasilevskiy - ELC - 3-year - 8-year
Killorn - ELC - 2-year - 7-year
Palat - ELC - 3-year - 5-year


Signed by Brisebois:
Point - ELC - 3-year - 8-year
Cirelli - ELC - 3-year - 8-year
Sergachev - ELC - 3-year - 8-year
Cernak - ELC - 3-year - 8-year

That's been their pattern.

What team has won Stanley Cups, going after those 8-year deals straight after ELC ?

Florida had shorter 2nd deal for Barkov, so did have Colorado for MacKinnon and Makar. Tampa goes with their different pattern.

PIT and WSH has longer than 8-year deals from the older CBA.

So far these "8-year after the ELC" -teams haven't won any Cup.

They pay for the potential, and hang on themselves on the cap, missing the depth needed.

Why overpay? Never overpay, and deal with the market.

Tampa is in cap hell because of this.

 

[The Zermanator]

Tampa is in cap hell because of this.

After being the most consistently dominant team in the league for half a decade and winning 2 Cups. I'd take that deal.

 

[Shaman464]

After being the most consistently dominant team in the league for half a decade and winning 2 Cups. I'd take that deal.

They played a lot of cap games to get there. Had Kuch not had a season long injury they’d be down to 1 cup.

 

[Ricelund]

They played a lot of cap games to get there. Had Kuch not had a season long injury they’d be down to 1 cup.

And if my aunt had balls...

 

[Shaman464]

And if my aunt had balls...

The point is that they got lucky they could put one of their highest paid players on the DL longer than he probably should have been to give them the cap relief to keep their team together. The problem is that it’s very unlikely that this will ever work again. It was the perfect situation that if it didn’t happen they would have had to part with important pieces for their second cup run. And this is all to not mention the COVID cup.

 

[lilidk]

Yzerman build this team , outside Larkin it's his team, but what will happen if Larkin misses entire season .

 

[RED WINGS STOMP]

Yzerman build this team , outside Larkin it's his team, but what will happen if Larkin misses entire season .

We draft Hagens.

 

[ColdToiletSeats]

Brock Faber signed an eight-year, $68 million contract. (8.5per)

Is this a bad contract? Dude has less than 100 games in the NHL.

 

[Axel Sandy Pelikan]

Tampa is in cap hell because of this.

And they won two consecutive Cups

Plus… they’re “in cap hell” because they had a f***in loaded team. Give me that cap hell all day every day. There is no contract finagling that would keep Tampa from being capped out.

They had, at any given time during that dominant run, two 1Cs, a couple top line Wings, a 1D, several 2Ds, and a Vezina caliber goalie.

 

[Axel Sandy Pelikan]

They played a lot of cap games to get there. Had Kuch not had a season long injury they’d be down to 1 cup.

News flash. All teams up at the top of the league play cap games. Hell, the Wings were playing cap games when they were at the bottom of the league.

How in the world is that a black mark?

Also…. If Tampa wanted to avoid cap hell and Kucherov didn’t have that perfectly timed injury to get him for the playoffs … they deal away a guy like Killorn a bit earlier than they do in real life. Or they’re forced to make a big time deal and clear Stammer or McDonagh off the books… or they bridge Brayden Ppint or Erik Cernak or Anthony Cirelli or all of them.

They had all sorts of levers to pull if they absolutely needed to dump money. But they didn’t have to

 

[odin1981]

Well first of all the guy said 9M, not 9.5M. Not a huge difference but it matters. And you're using deals signed years ago to justify the value of a deal being signed in 2024. Brock Faber just got 8.5M on an 8yr deal. Maybe you just have an outdated idea of where the market is.

To me, the 25 minute/game all-situations #1 dman carrying the rest of the D corps on his shoulders is worth 9M a year. Even today. And that deal gets better and better with each passing year too.

So much so this exactly. In 3-4 years his deal is full on highway robbery because he will be worth 11-12m.

 

[Henkka]

So much so this exactly. In 3-4 years his deal is full on highway robbery because he will be worth 11-12m.

What if you take that highway robbery instantly?

 

[odin1981]

What if you take that highway robbery instantly?

Wouldn't happen. If he had to take a cheap bridge come ufa contract he would bend them over for full worth. A 8 year deal that buys a few ufa years + gives him a good deal for RFA treats him like a priority and can get some loyalty on his ufa deal potentially.

His "low offense" is gonna be a thing of the past next year because he won't be taken off pp1 20 games into the year for contract negotiations. He won't be a Makar style d man but consistent 2 way 55-65 point production with 25ish minutes for 9-9.5 is a steal.

This ain't 2013 no more and we don't have a player of Lidstrom's ability keeping his contract in check. Whether people like it or not you won't see him under 8 million a year no way. He has 3 year's of #1 d experience and 45 ish points of production. He is not a average RFA. Most kids don't have the top pairing experience he has, and he has done it without a player of equivalent pairing level so he isn't sheltered.

 

[Oddbob]

They played a lot of cap games to get there. Had Kuch not had a season long injury they’d be down to 1 cup.

And if my grandma had wheels she's be a bicycle.

 

[dalem177]

Yzerman build this team , outside Larkin it's his team, but what will happen if Larkin misses entire season .

 

[norrisnick]

What if you take that highway robbery instantly?

Be like celebrating a pre-season win. Getting a bargain this season or next is so completely irrelevant.

 

[1878rgw]

So he is looking forward to the summer, to "interesting discussions" with Red Wings manager Steve Yzerman. "I don't think Steve will just open his wallet and issue million-dollar deals, it will be a tough fight," says Seider, who is "very confident" that "I will play for Detroit again next season." Seider wants the middle ground Ideally, not just next season. At 22, he wants to extend his contract long-term, up to eight years are possible according to the collective bargaining agreement. Of course, Seider also wants to "get the most out of it" financially. The time as an NHL professional is "very limited, everyone earns every single cent they negotiate. You should be proud of that." However, Seider also knows that it can be worthwhile to accommodate the club. If individual stars earn too much, there is too little left for the rest. So every top player in the NHL is faced with the question: do I look at myself or the bigger picture? Tim Stützle, the other young German star, also experienced this and signed with the Ottawa Senators for $8.35 million a year – although he could have earned more.

"I think if someone gets ten or eleven million, it will be difficult with the salary cap," Stützle told "The Athletic." He is concerned with the team's success. Whether he earns one or two million more is secondary, he has enough to live on.Seider also wants to "find a middle ground" in the negotiations with Detroit. You can't play the season alone, you need a good team around you. But he doesn't want to play at a discount price either. He wants to be able to say afterwards: "I earn enough, I can imagine a super relaxed life after hockey." That should work.

Moritz Seider in NHL: So blickt er auf die Verhandlungen mit den Red Wings

Der deutsche Eishockeyprofi Moritz Seider ist mit 22 Jahren der Abwehrchef der Detroit Red Wings. Sein nächster NHL-Vertrag könnte ein ganz großer werden – doch die Verhandlungen sind nicht so leicht.

www.faz.net

This interview is from January, I think Seider is going to ask for max. term and a relative team friendly salary.

 

[Axel Sandy Pelikan]

And if my grandma had wheels she's be a bicycle.

And if we’re being completely fair… weren’t they basically down a Stamkos for that playoff run? Yeah. The Covid cup, 2:47 in the whole run.

And then he was wildly limited in 2021.

So, I would say it’s pretty fair that if the Lightning absolutely HAD to trim payroll, Stammer could be excised without ruining their Cup chances. Like if the shit really hit the fan and they needed to make a hard choice… it would be bridging guys like Cernak, Cirelli, and Sergachev and making the ballsy move to deal an ailing Steven Stamkos. They didn’t have to do all of that because of Kucherov’s fortunate timing of his long term injury, but again, I’d take having to do the cap two-step Tampa has had to do if it involves me having as stacked a roster as they did

 

[Euro Twins]

And they won two consecutive Cups

Plus… they’re “in cap hell” because they had a f***in loaded team. Give me that cap hell all day every day. There is no contract finagling that would keep Tampa from being capped out.

They had, at any given time during that dominant run, two 1Cs, a couple top line Wings, a 1D, several 2Ds, and a Vezina caliber goalie.

They still have most of that. Cap hell is a bit of an overstatement.

They'll be a damn good team this year

 

[Pavels Dog]

I throw a 8 year 9-9.5 per at Seider and don't blink twice. For Raymond I think we could bridge deal. Say a 4-5 yr 7.5 per and hope he doesn't vastly exceed it say strong 2 way play ppg level so we have to pay him 10+ per on his ufa deal.

Now as to when the deals get signed, I say probably like 1-2 weeks before camp.

I think the opposite is kind of what's more logical. I have an easier time seeing Raymond hit 80, 90 points, maybe even down the line flirting with 100 points, than I have seeing Seider explode for 60+ points.

 

[RRhoads]

Today is a good day to sign Raymond to a long term deal.

 

[Indrid Cold]

Today is a good day to sign Raymond to a long term deal.

Yes. I love sports drama, just not with my teams. Get it done.

 

[Imgoingtowork]

Today is a good day to sign Raymond to a long term deal.

Raymond assists Detroit.

 

[kook10]

Brock Faber signed an eight-year, $68 million contract. (8.5per)

Is this a bad contract? Dude has less than 100 games in the NHL.

I don't think that is a bad contract. Maybe I am in the minority, but I would swap Faber for Seider straight up in a heartbeat. Very smart player and solid on both ends with no "ifs" or "buts" to explain his play.

 

[minimal]

Yeah, we'll see what the temperature is after his inevitable sophomore slump.