Post-Game Talk: Rangers 6 Leafs 3

[Michael HOMERUNing]

Kerfoot is the only forward in the top 6 that I want to upgrade, but I also have a hard time slotting hin into the bottom 6 without moving Kampf down. I think Kerfoot is a player you want on your playoff roster, I just want a big, physical power forward in the top 6.

Maybe Lawson Crouse then? 6’4, 215, has 9 goals and 9 assists in 36 games in Arizona

 

[hockeyes]

The more things change, the more they stay the same.

 

[GardinerTheForward]

Oh, I understand perfectly the inaccurate point you were attempting to make.

bro he is being sarcastic. Saying what bullshit the nhl would say if called on that

 

[IrishInOntario]

That’s a good look to what the Leafs will see in the playoffs. I just don’t see this team holding up in these kind of games

I think the formula to beat them is fairly obvious. Play a tight defensive game, forecheck / obstruct the shit out of their bottom 4 and wait for them to meltdown under the pressure of their own mental fragility. They'll take a few games from you, but, eventually, you'll outlast them.

 

[Alamo Leafer]

Didn't catch any of the post game interviews.
Did anyone get "pissy"?

 

[Man Bear Pig]

Disagree that we don't need a significant upgrade for Justin Holl. In the playoffs you lean on 4 guys to play major minutes and you shelter your bottom pairing. No chance I want a Muzzin / Holl pairing on the ice for an extra 6 minutes per night than they already are.

It depends on who Holl is paired with. Why Keefe insists on pairing him Muzzin still baffles me. That pairing looks good on paper but absolutely doesn't work in reality. Would much rather see Keefe try Liljegren with Muzzin and Holl with Sandin for at least 4 or 5 games straight. We gotta see what we have. We're making the playoffs, the time to experiment is now.

 

[IrishInOntario]

Maybe Lawson Crouse then? 6’4, 215, has 9 goals and 9 assists in 36 games in Arizona

I like Crouse, but I like other guys in that role as well. The problem is you can't bring in a big contact up front because you need that deadline money to upgrade the right side of the 2nd pairing. The upgrade has to come with a small contract, or significant retention.

 

[GardinerTheForward]

Lots of hot takes in this thread, and thats coming from me, hot take master

good points from this thread in a nutshell:
1) we can’t keep blowing leads like this. This is becoming a trend. Maybe due to lack of endurance or mental fragility.

2) We need another top 4 D. We are worse without Muzzin Holl, although yes we could upgrade on them/Holl

3) Biega and clifford should get sent to the moon
4) Matthews got jobbed
5) Dermott should be trade bait. Lil Sandin not ready for top 4 minutes
6) Jt needs to get our of this funk. (IMO They’re becoming too common. IMO this is both a foreshadow and consequence if increased age.)

 

[34]

Surprise, another blown lead. Almost seems like that is the case every game.

Not trying put this on Campbell, but he has not been good the last several games. Looking a little tired. He has been the teams MVP so far, get him some rest.

 

[NinjaKick]

I'll take team defense for $1000

 

[Enga Olly]

Campbell provides goaltending like that, we will be a .500 club from here until the end of the season. Not saying he was the only thing off, but that level goaltending will get you .500 hockey

 

[Kiwi]

Yeah they need more games. Even if they looked like norris candidates tonight and we won 5-1, you still can't trust it. Gotta keep playing them and see if they can continue to get better / adapt and learn from mistakes.

I'd give them another chance after letting them think about this loss and what they could have done differently.

My initial conclusion though, which I doubt will change, is they're not ready for second pairing this year no matter how many games you give them. However, the experience will help make their bottom pairing game even better for the playoffs when they're sent back down the depth chart.

They may not be 2nd pair ready yet but if they are as good as we think they can be they will learn lessons from games like this and develop ways of being successful at this level

Unless there confidence starts to tank keep on giving them minutes and accept your going to get good and bad out of them for awhile

 

[kk87]

Astonishing how short-sighted some fans are, give the knee-jerk reactions a rest. We just went 3-2-1 on a 6 game road trip where we played 4 top-10 teams in the league (after playing hardly any hockey for a month, mind you) and people act like the sky is falling?

We're currently on pace for 113 points. We're going to string together another 4 game win streak and everything will be sunshine and rainbows again. The reality is, none of this matters until the playoffs - sure, the blown leads are suboptimal, and there've been some unfortunate defensive breakdowns, but people saying we're doomed because of the last five games are out to lunch.

 

[Dekes For Days]

bro he is being sarcastic. Saying what bullshit the nhl would say if called on that

I interpreted it differently based on previous exchanges and the fact that the NHL is more of a pretend-it-never-happened-and-everything-is-fine type than to say something like that, but my mistake if what you're saying is true.

 

[m1ker]

It's time. You guys know EXACTLY what i mean.

 

[DraftSchmaft]

JT is currently in jackets series mode: Chance after chance blown

 

[IrishInOntario]

It depends on who Holl is paired with. Why Keefe insists on pairing him Muzzin still baffles me. That pairing looks good on paper but absolutely doesn't work in reality. Would much rather see Keefe try Liljegren with Muzzin and Holl with Sandin for at least 4 or 5 games straight. We gotta see what we have. We're making the playoffs, the time to experiment is now.

I still think we need a roster upgrade in the top 6, and the only way to achieve that given the current cap situation, likely involves Holl's contract going the other way. Maybe you can get away with moving Dermott's, but I doubt it. Also, I'm a liljegren fan into the future, but at 22 and at this phase of his development I want him playing sheltered, 3rd pairing minutes in the playoffs, rather than 22 minutes per night in a physical series. 10-12 minutes I'm comfortable with at this point, but nothing beyond that.

Therefore, the only thing that makes sense in our current cap situation is either of these, IMO...

Reilly / Brodie
Muzzin / Upgrade
Sandin / Liljegren
Dermott

Holl traded.

OR

Reilly / Brodie
Muzzin / Upgrade
Sandin / Holl
Liljegren

Dermott traded.

 

[LastOne2100]

Astonishing how short-sighted some fans are, give the knee-jerk reactions a rest. We just went 3-2-1 on a 6 game road trip where we played 4 top-10 teams in the league (after playing hardly any hockey for a month, mind you) and people act like the sky is falling?

We're currently on pace for 113 points. We're going to string together another 4 game win streak and everything will be sunshine and rainbows again. The reality is, none of this matters until the playoffs - sure, the blown leads are suboptimal, and there've been some unfortunate defensive breakdowns, but people saying we're doomed because of the last five games are out to lunch.

The goal of the season is to win a Stanley Cup. To win a Stanley Cup we need to beat the best in the league. Repeatedly. In the hardest conditions you will need to win in, where we won't get the calls, and our defense will get battered.

Not really sure what you've seen lately that is showing you that we can do that. Rather, it shows that we continue to crumble under pressure, just like we have for years, in the same exact ways that have lead to repeated early exits.

If you goal is to continue to be a good regular season team, mission accomplished, I guess?

Also you do realize we'll be playing either Tampa or Florida in round 1, right? There won't be any easy rounds for us, so roadtrips like this are a good opportunity to test how we do with adversity.

 

[OVO16]

Rangers got physical and started playing the heavy forecheck game to force the leafs into turnovers? Oh jeez where have I seen this before?

Playoffs are gonna be another dud. This team cannot handle physically imposing teams at all. We cower at any sight of physical contact.

Our defense is gonna get manhandled in the playoffs again

 

[meefer]

Jan 2: Tor 6 - Ott 0
Jan 6: Tor 4 - Ed 2
Jan 9: Tor 4 - Col 5
Jan 12: Tor 4 - Vegas 3
Jan 13: Tor 1 - Ari 2 (it's still hard to believe we lost that one, yikes)
Jan 16: Tor 6 - St L 5
Jan 19: Tor 3 - NYR 6

7 Games: 4 W/3L (should be 5W/2L , but that's hockey)
GFPG: 4
GAPG: 3.29

Our 1st string goalie having a bit of a return to earth, behind a defense that is missing two regulars (who have not been as good as expected) and youngsters that have a combined 101 games in the show, while adding a vet (Biega) playing his first game of the year with Dermott (a 3rd pair Dman in his own right). And we wonder why our defensive efforts were suspect. Sigh.

The team is not playing as well as it did earlier, but it's a long season and every team goes through the ups and downs of a long season. The kids on D will improve with experience. Campbell and Mrazek are capable goalies. Our F group is pretty darned good. It's not a shit show, it's a lull. Let's try not to lose our shit at every bump in the road. And hey, Marner scored on the PP

 

[Eternal Leaf]

Tonight was a bit exaggerated.

They are obviously not going into a playoff series with Lily, Sandin, Dermott, and Biega together. There's not much to take out of this game from that perspective.

But it does show Lily and Sandin are still learning their craft and do struggle against a heavy forecheck. The team has to add a quality top 4 RHD before the deadline to allow these younger defensemen enough runway to do their job.

They can't go into a playoff series where one or more of Muzzin, Brodie, or Rielly go down and they're dead on the spot. That's exactly what will happen in their current state cause the others can't handle greater responsibility as the game gets physical.

 

[wingman75]

Lots of hot takes in this thread, and thats coming from me, hot take master

good points from this thread in a nutshell:
1) we can’t keep blowing leads like this. This is becoming a trend. Maybe due to lack of endurance or mental fragility.

2) We need another top 4 D. We are worse without Muzzin Holl, although yes we could upgrade on them/Holl

3) Biega and clifford should get sent to the moon
4) Matthews got jobbed
5) Dermott should be trade bait. Lil Sandin not ready for top 4 minutes
6) Jt needs to get our of this funk. (IMO They’re becoming too common. IMO this is both a foreshadow and consequence if increased age.)

This is a great TL;DR that should get added to the OP lol

I took issue with the lineup somewhat... which I genereally don't care about. The 4th line as it was was useless... Clifford seems to negate anything positive the other two could hope to do (is someone going to tell me his advanced stats are good?). I don't know what Keefe's plan was with the D, but if it was to send a message to the guys that their regular spot in the lineup is what it should be, then he made that point loud and clear. I would have played Rubins over Biega... that seemed unfair to him.

I mean, when they lose they generally deserve it. This was eeriely reminiscent of a playoff loss that we have watched before... I hope there are some adjustments to the roster to help get to the next level.

 

[Michael HOMERUNing]

Rangers got physical and started playing the heavy forecheck game to force the leafs into turnovers? Oh jeez where have I seen this before?

Playoffs are gonna be another dud. This team cannot handle physically imposing teams at all. We cower at any sight of physical contact.

Our defense is gonna get manhandled in the playoffs again

It’s 2 defensemen, not the whole team. They really need to get a second pairing d-man to push Holl to the third pair and Dermott out of the lineup

 

[Dragao6]

Astonishing how short-sighted some fans are, give the knee-jerk reactions a rest. We just went 3-2-1 on a 6 game road trip where we played 4 top-10 teams in the league (after playing hardly any hockey for a month, mind you) and people act like the sky is falling?

We're currently on pace for 113 points. We're going to string together another 4 game win streak and everything will be sunshine and rainbows again. The reality is, none of this matters until the playoffs - sure, the blown leads are suboptimal, and there've been some unfortunate defensive breakdowns, but people saying we're doomed because of the last five games are out to lunch.

Very evident in our play that we are still far off

I don’t care about a regular season loss but I do about another 1st round exit
This road trip very much shows that’s in the cards again

 

[wingman75]

7 Games: 4 W/3L (should be 5W/2L , but that's hockey)
GFPG: 4
GAPG: 3.29

Good post. I was thinking about this today too... the GAPG is concerning though. Just a blip? A trend? I guess we need to see the full lineup for a couple weeks before we truly know. This is also the toughtest run of games (minues ARI) that we will get all season most likley (have not looked at the rest of the schedule closely).