Speculation: Prospal's play and the gentleman's agreement

[Jackets16]

@Aportzline "Asked last week. Davidson and Kekalainen were unclear about #CBJ gentlemen's agreement with Prospal, but something they planned to discuss."

I hope something is worked out. Prospal would be a good guy to have around.

I agree after he retires. IMO, we need to trade him this year as we could get something really good back for him.

 

[Jackets16]

I will bet that a lot of play-off teams will come calling for Vinny at the trade deadline.

Proven play-off producer, and a guy who's skill set would be coveted. Can't see JK turning down an offer they can't refuse.

Can't remember if Vinny has a NTC in his contract.

That is why we need to trade him, IMO. There is a good chance that teams offer us a lot for him.

 

[Jackets16]

If I were The Finn, I'd do the following-
"Vinny I understand you had an agreement with the previous GM to play here until your career is over and then join the organization in some fashion. Even though I am under no obligation to do so, I am willing to honor that agreement. Because I think you are such a valuable member of this organization.

Your first job with this organization is to go play for a playoff team from April 3 to the end of the season. Not only will you get your competitive juices flowing again, but I'll get a valuable draft pick in return. When the season is over there will be a contract waiting for you to rejoin our squad if you want. If not, we'd be happy to send you back to Europe to help us with scouting and player development."

That is fine.

 

[EspenK]

If we get an offer for Vinnie at the deadline it will probably be a 2nd from a contending team. I would probably check with him well before the deadline and if he agrees to go to one or more of the contenders fine;trade him and then Tkachuk him to bring him back for next year. if he fits; otherwise try to find a spot in the organization for him.

 

[SuperGenius]

If I were The Finn, I'd do the following-
"Vinny I understand you had an agreement with the previous GM to play here until your career is over and then join the organization in some fashion. Even though I am under no obligation to do so, I am willing to honor that agreement. Because I think you are such a valuable member of this organization.

Your first job with this organization is to go play for a playoff team from April 3 to the end of the season. Not only will you get your competitive juices flowing again, but I'll get a valuable draft pick in return. When the season is over there will be a contract waiting for you to rejoin our squad if you want. If not, we'd be happy to send you back to Europe to help us with scouting and player development."

I would have no problem with this so long as everyone is on the same page. I do think the return needs to be large, though, else it's not worth it to me. I suppose if any deal goes down, the return will be some sort of clue as to whether it's part of a plan or one side or the other changing their mind.

 

[arudick]

I've ripped on Prospal from day 1 and boy has he proved me wrong. A professional who, although not the most fast and skillful player, gives it his all night in and night out. Happy he is making me eat my own words. There a number of players that can learn from a guy like him.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

I hope he becomes an adviser to the players.

 

[KeithBWhittington]

I would be extremely bummed if Prospal was moved. Guy has been a shot in the arm for the organization. I know its a business, but right now, he seems like one of the few guys thats worth more to the organization itself, than just his role on the team. And I'm not sure I could say that if he moves on, because of what he essentially agreed to when he came aboard with this. He wants to be here, he wants to work for the organization (after this year or next, likely). I'll be bummed out if he's moved.

 

[Roadman]

I would be extremely bummed if Prospal was moved. Guy has been a shot in the arm for the organization. I know its a business, but right now, he seems like one of the few guys thats worth more to the organization itself, than just his role on the team. And I'm not sure I could say that if he moves on, because of what he essentially agreed to when he came aboard with this. He wants to be here, he wants to work for the organization (after this year or next, likely). I'll be bummed out if he's moved.

Yep

The only exception to this is if he goes to mgmt and says "I'd like one more bite at the apple trade me to a contender and I'll be back next year". Not even if it's mgmt idea, gotta be his. If it happens though we'll probably never know the how it happened.

I know it's a business and all, but there are still right ways to go about doing business. And then there are the asshat ways.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

the asshat ways.

Great band name.

 

[Jackets16]

I have a question. Why do some of you have a problem with trading Prospal who only has an agreement to be on the Jackets next year, but you have no problem trading players who actually have contracts for next year?

Also, if Prospal cares about the team like he seems to, he should want to do what is best for them.

 

[Skraut]

I have a question. Why do some of you have a problem with trading Prospal who only has an agreement to be on the Jackets next year, but you have no problem trading players who actually have contracts for next year?

Because we need someone like Vinny in the locker room, this year, next year, and as long as he can continue to play at the current level. He would also be fantastic in the front office. There are others under contract who don't fall under the same category.

Also, if Prospal cares about the team like he seems to, he should want to do what is best for them.

He's also stated that he is happy with the current situation, his family likes Columbus, and he wants to be a part of this team long term. Why should he have to go somewhere else at the trade deadline, even if it is for the best for the team?

If he's fine leaving his family, and wants to go on another cup run, that is one thing, but it is another if the team decides that is what they want to do with him, just because they want some sort of return at the trade deadline.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

Also, if Prospal cares about the team like he seems to, he should want to do what is best for them.

Just like Rick Nash.

 

[pete goegan]

Just like Rick Nash.

Just thinking the same thing. Nash offered to waive his NMC if it would make the team better and some vilify him as quitting on the team. Now, we're going to piss and moan if VP doesn't want to leave "for the good of the team"?

 

[Jackets16]

Because we need someone like Vinny in the locker room, this year, next year, and as long as he can continue to play at the current level. He would also be fantastic in the front office. There are others under contract who don't fall under the same category.



He's also stated that he is happy with the current situation, his family likes Columbus, and he wants to be a part of this team long term. Why should he have to go somewhere else at the trade deadline, even if it is for the best for the team?

If he's fine leaving his family, and wants to go on another cup run, that is one thing, but it is another if the team decides that is what they want to do with him, just because they want some sort of return at the trade deadline.

You missed my point. People are saying it would send a bad message throughout the NHL. And who would come play for us if we did that to Prospal? My point is this. How is it viewed as so bad to other players if we trade a player who doesn't have a contract next year, but it isn't if we trade someone who does. I am not talking about what Prospal brings to this team. I am talking about how some view the way we are treating him Also, why can't he work for us when he retires if we trade him? Oh, you traded me. I am never working for you. I just find all this to be really funny.

 

[Roadman]

You missed my point. People are saying it would send a bad message throughout the NHL. And who would come play for us if we did that to Prospal? My point is this. How is it viewed as so bad to other players if we trade a player who doesn't have a contract next year, but it isn't if we trade someone who does. I am not talking about what Prospal brings to this team. I am talking about how some view the way we are treating him Also, why can't he work for us when he retires if we trade him? Oh, you traded me. I am never working for you. I just find all this to be really funny.

Because he was promised 1yr contracts WITH THE JACKETS, for as long as he wished to play.

Then the a position with the team.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

You missed my point. People are saying it would send a bad message throughout the NHL. And who would come play for us if we did that to Prospal? My point is this. How is it viewed as so bad to other players if we trade a player who doesn't have a contract next year, but it isn't if we trade someone who does. I am not talking about what Prospal brings to this team. I am talking about how some view the way we are treating him Also, why can't he work for us when he retires if we trade him? Oh, you traded me. I am never working for you. I just find all this to be really funny.

If you're willing to take opinions from someone who hasn't suggested what you're asking about...

I'd say it is because some posters want to see certain players traded and not others. And therefore are defending said position either by projecting their opinions onto management or finding other logical workarounds like "sends a bad message."

 

[Jackets16]

Okay. Another question for you guys/gals. If you had an agreement with your boss to work for him as long as you wanted, then he was fired, and a new boss came in. Would you expect him to honor that agreement? I know I wouldn't. I would hope he would if I wanted to still work at that company and for him, but I wouldn't expect it. We have a new front office. It is their job to make this team a winner. It isn't their job to keep players around just because the previous GM had an agreement with them or signed them to long term contracts.

 

[Jackets16]

Because he was promised 1yr contracts WITH THE JACKETS, for as long as he wished to play.

Then the a position with the team.

Yes, by someone else. Tyutin (for example) was actually given more years WITH THE JACKETS. IN AN ACTUAL CONTRACT. So, why is it okay to trade him?

 

[Roadman]

Okay. Another question for you guys/gals. If you had an agreement with your boss to work for him as long as you wanted, then he was fired, and a new boss came in. Would you expect him to honor that agreement? I know I wouldn't. I would hope he would if I wanted to still work at that company and for him, but I wouldn't expect it. We have a new front office. It is their job to make this team a winner. It isn't their job to keep players around just because the previous GM had an agreement with them or signed them to long term contracts.

Because this is the sports world, not the real world.

While still a business the are a lot of other factors that work in this environment that don't come into play as much in the outside workplace.

 

[Roadman]

Yes, by someone else. Tyutin (for example) was actually given more years WITH THE JACKETS. IN AN ACTUAL CONTRACT. So, why is it okay to trade him?

Because contract unless otherwise specified can be traded.

A promise by an organization, and whether we like it or not Howson represented the organization, is like a man's word. if you don't keep your word your reputation ain't worth ****.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

Okay. Another question for you guys/gals. If you had an agreement with your boss to work for him as long as you wanted, then he was fired, and a new boss came in. Would you expect him to honor that agreement? I know I wouldn't. I would hope he would if I wanted to still work at that company and for him, but I wouldn't expect it. We have a new front office. It is their job to make this team a winner. It isn't their job to keep players around just because the previous GM had an agreement with them or signed them to long term contracts.

I wouldn't, but I would certainly bring it up.

But the bolded doesn't preclude new management keeping players around because they've chosen to do so, for whatever reason, including some of those given in here for retaining Prospal.

I like that someone is more than comfortable with the idea of Prospal being traded, as it is a possibility. It's just weird the level of commitment to the idea.

 

[Skraut]

You missed my point. People are saying it would send a bad message throughout the NHL. And who would come play for us if we did that to Prospal? My point is this. How is it viewed as so bad to other players if we trade a player who doesn't have a contract next year, but it isn't if we trade someone who does. I am not talking about what Prospal brings to this team. I am talking about how some view the way we are treating him Also, why can't he work for us when he retires if we trade him? Oh, you traded me. I am never working for you. I just find all this to be really funny.

That's why I wrote it out the way I did.

There's a difference between "Hey Vinny, do you have any interest in going on a cup run with a specific team? If so, we'll do what we can to get you there."

and

"Um, yeah, Vinny, about that No Movement Clause you have, yeah. We're just going to need you to go ahead and wave that, yeah, so we can send you to some random place for a 2nd round pick."

One shows respect for the player, and wouldn't be looked at negatively by other players, especially if Vinny chose to come back.

The other one would be looked at negatively because it would discourage other veterans from coming, and signing a contract with the team.

 

[Jackets16]

Because contract unless otherwise specified can be traded.

A promise by an organization, and whether we like it or not Howson represented the organization, is like a man's word. if you don't keep your word your reputation ain't worth ****.

Yeah, and the man is no longer in charge. I think giving someone a contract is a bigger promise, but whatever. They should have signed Prospal to a longer contract if they wanted to keep him for more than this year. Also, you say a contract can be traded. Is Prospal not on a contract? I am pretty sure he is. Why can we not trade his contract? Why couldn't we sign him for next year if we did trade him?

We are just going to have to agree to disagree on this.

 

[Jackets16]

That's why I wrote it out the way I did.

There's a difference between "Hey Vinny, do you have any interest in going on a cup run with a specific team? If so, we'll do what we can to get you there."

and

"Um, yeah, Vinny, about that No Movement Clause you have, yeah. We're just going to need you to go ahead and wave that, yeah, so we can send you to some random place for a 2nd round pick."

One shows respect for the player, and wouldn't be looked at negatively by other players, especially if Vinny chose to come back.

The other one would be looked at negatively because it would discourage other veterans from coming, and signing a contract with the team.

And, by having the NMC, he can just say no. Also, I never said trade him to some random team for a 2nd round pick. I am not arguing that we have to trade him (though I think we should). I am arguing that we don't HAVE to keep him because of some agreement. I just think we should look to trade him and Prospal should be willing to be traded. You act like we are trading him to some bad place he will have to play at for 4 years. It will be a few months and most likely on a really good team. Man, that must really be tough to do .