GDT: Preseason game 1: Sharks vs. Golden Knights 5pm Streamed on sharks.nhl.com

[STL Shark]

SJeasy was specifically talking about contending teams; turnover and low expectations are a given for rebuilding teams.

Kostin might have a case that he's the 6th-best forward on the team...and the fourth-best winger if Granlund, Celebrini, and Smith are at center.

Overall, I think you could get away putting Kostin/Grundstrom/Gushchin/Bordeleau with Celebrini and Toffoli. But with Smith, it might be tough to deploy him ideally. He shouldn't be saddled with poor talents or low experience. Maybe Wennberg and Zetterlund would work, but then who is going to play with Eklund and Granlund?

I don't think it's that Kostin is the 6th best forward as much as it is that we need a player in his archetype to be an F1 on that line. It's trying to find the Killorn/Palat that isn't the best on their own, but can compliment and do the dirty work needed while keeping up with 2 top end players on a line.

Kostin has the profile of a guy that might be able to do that, so I get the experiment in trying him there right now. He's big, skates pretty well, and has some solid finishing ability when he actually shoots the puck. There are other issues in his game (like not being in position to shoot the puck enough), but I get why he's a candidate to play with Celebrini/Toffoli on the LW with where the roster is at right now and that lines need of an F1.

Kostin very well might not be the guy (in fact would say he's most likely not the guy), but I get why he's there right now as we look at the roster. I'd love to see Trent Frederic in that spot if he hits UFA this year.

 

[Alaskanice]

What is this Celebrini "protection" business? Hes not a fine china vase. No opponent is gunna think "hmmm, should I hit celebrini? I am afriad of Giovani smith or kostin or whoever...." They will hit him just fine just as they did. Thats what NHL life is like for a good player.

They need to pair him with skill. Just skill. Nothing to do with protection or any of that. Gushkin is the most skilled of the possible rookies.

I like keeping the Lund line together, and looking for a skilled rookie to take the celebrini wing with smith as the 3rd line C. I was hoping Dyllandrea might slot alongside celebrini but he didnt exactly impress last night... Cardwell perhaps? He definitely has a motor, looked good last night, and has proven he can score at the pro level. Grundlund? Goodrow?

Truth is, the sharks are one good winger short. Woulda been nice to deploy a bit of that 10M in cap space on a solid vet winger, but oh well...

Celly is too good to have just toffoli, but the Lund line works. Makes little sense to get rid of one problem only to create another. They just have to find the right fit on that wing.

Celly-Toffoli-Gushkin?
Lund line
Smith-wennberg-???
Dyllandrea/goodrow/kunin/grundstrom/etc.

It's a shame that dick and musty had such weak games.

After last night, I am a bit less confident in my bets . Love what warsofsky brings though...

The “protection” is for when players on other teams take cheap shots at our star kids.
It’s a part of the game.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

I wouldn't be surprised if guys like Kunin and Dellandrea get opportunities in that spot next to Celebrini and Toffoli. They need a forechecker to do that sort of dirty work to compliment that duo. I still think the season will start with Celebrini and Smith centering the 2nd and 3rd lines to insulate them so that pretty much necessitates the Lund line sticking together unless someone forces their hand as it is the only line capable of eating top line minutes without Celebrini and if you take any of them off that line, you've basically made the Celebrini line the top line which needs to be avoided until at least Thanksgiving/Christmas.

 

[JoeThorntonsRooster]

I wouldn't be surprised if guys like Kunin and Dellandrea get opportunities in that spot next to Celebrini and Toffoli. They need a forechecker to do that sort of dirty work to compliment that duo. I still think the season will start with Celebrini and Smith centering the 2nd and 3rd lines to insulate them so that pretty much necessitates the Lund line sticking together unless someone forces their hand as it is the only line capable of eating top line minutes without Celebrini and if you take any of them off that line, you've basically made the Celebrini line the top line which needs to be avoided until at least Thanksgiving/Christmas.

Why do we need to avoid making a line with our best player the top line?

 

[one2gamble]

Why do we need to avoid making a line with our best player the top line?

You want the new players to find some success before throwing them to the wolves but I'm not sure it matters anymore

 

[zombie kopitar]

Celly is too good to have just toffoli, but the Lund line works. Makes little sense to get rid of one problem only to create another. They just have to find the right fit on that wing.

Celly-Toffoli-Gushkin?
Lund line
Smith-wennberg-???
Dyllandrea/goodrow/kunin/grundstrom/etc.

Put Gushkin on the third line, I can play on the first line and protect Celly, I'll bring nunchucks

 

[sampler]

The “protection” is for when players on other teams take cheap shots at our star kids.
It’s a part of the game.

nah.... not any more really. And it doesnt stop cheap shots at all. You think Korcaz wouldnt make the hit again? Of course he would. Its the NHL of 2024, not 1990 when bob probert or jeff odgers might come along and end you.

Dont get me wrong, if someone hits any top player, they need to be hit back, but that's not how you design a line. You take a number, and exact revenge later with the proper type personnel. You dont sink a line by trying to "protect" your star.

Celly needs talent on his line not protection. Thats why cardwell or Gushkin might be interesting options there. Both have shown they score at the pro level. Both are quick and can get in there on the forecheck. It's just that both are undersized. Not sure yet what the solution is or ought to be. I dunno if the "right" person is in the locker room at all. Maybe bordeleau if he can player well enough defensively.

 

[LadyStanley]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1838237968886276363

https://x.com/i/web/status/1838044625979760802

 

[I Loveallsports]

How has Musty looked so far.

 

[sampler]

How has Musty looked so far.

he struggled last night. Improved some in the third, but was largely invisible and not particularly effective.

I expect hell get another look, but hes gunna have to do way better to have a chance at his true 9 game tryout.

 

[gaucholoco3]

Celebrini’s line will be the top line even if the Lund line stays together especially on the road when the Sharks don’t have last change. I just don’t see the reason to keep the Lund line together at the detriment of Celebrini and Smith. They both need skill players to play with more than needing to not play against top competition. Also at home the 3rd line can hard match the opposing teams top line.

 

[Alaskanice]

nah.... not any more really. And it doesnt stop cheap shots at all. You think Korcaz wouldnt make the hit again? Of course he would. Its the NHL of 2024, not 1990 when bob probert or jeff odgers might come along and end you.

Dont get me wrong, if someone hits any top player, they need to be hit back, but that's not how you design a line. You take a number, and exact revenge later with the proper type personnel. You dont sink a line by trying to "protect" your star.

Celly needs talent on his line not protection. Thats why cardwell or Gushkin might be interesting options there. Both have shown they score at the pro level. Both are quick and can get in there on the forecheck. It's just that both are undersized. Not sure yet what the solution is or ought to be. I dunno if the "right" person is in the locker room at all. Maybe bordeleau if he can player well enough defensively.

Yes, really. That’s part of the game. If Korczak does it again, he’ll pay the price. Smith isn’t even on Macklins line. He did what he needed to do. Will it stop players? Maybe. No real answer.
Now for Kostin, he’s not just a plug. He’s a big body who skates well and can score. If Celebrini can tap into that, try it out in preseason.

 

[Saskatoon]

The Musty hype train get going a little too much - he likely will be going back to OHL and that is not the end of the world.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Why do we need to avoid making a line with our best player the top line?

Because it's quite possible that what is best for Celebrini's development is to not start with the most set of responsibilities a rookie that hasn't debuted in the NHL can have. The team still needs to exercise patience with him even if he is their best player and becomes a dependable 1C by the end of this season. We're not likely a playoff team so there's no need to rush him. They can afford to gradually increase his responsibilities as the season wears on.

 

[I Loveallsports]

he struggled last night. Improved some in the third, but was largely invisible and not particularly effective.

I expect hell get another look, but hes gunna have to do way better to have a chance at his true 9 game tryout.

Appreciate it. Not a huge fan of his game in junior. Bad lines changes and he wouldn't leave the ice when it's time. Selfish player Ive noticed. Bad penalties, and has never laid a hit to save his life. Goes in a scrum backing in. Not face up towards a player . Offensive decent but honestly, I'm not sure what SH was thinking there. Hope he proves me wrong. They really need to get in his head because I'm not sure what's going on up there.

 

[OrrNumber4]

We have Toffoli, Smith, Celebrini, and the Lunds. Which of those players does Kostin have a case to be better than?

Smith

 

[sampler]

Appreciate it. Not a huge fan of his game in junior. Bad lines changes and he wouldn't leave the ice when it's time. Selfish player Ive noticed. Bad penalties, and has never laid a hit to save his life. Goes in a scrum backing in. Not face up towards a player . Offensive decent but honestly, I'm not sure what SH was thinking there. Hope he proves me wrong. They really need to get in his head because I'm not sure what's going on up there.

You are very right about the lack of hitting. That part actually stood out to me. He had many chances to finish a check and didnt. Hes a good size body but he plays much softer, particularly on the forecheck.

Thats a coaching thing and warsofsky is gunna get it into him eventually, this year or next. Coach repeatedly mentions his poor play away from the puck, which I take to mean mainly defensively, but could also refer to lack of physicality, going hard on the forecheck, skating hard on the back check, moving feet on the breakout, etc.

I have been very much on the musty train, but I am less confident to ride it this year as I was two days ago. He didnt look ready. Just like Dick didn't either. Not a huge surprise thats true, but still, its a disappointment to me.

 

[I Loveallsports]

You are very right about the lack of hitting. That part actually stood out to me. He had many chances to finish a check and didnt. Hes a good size body but he plays much softer, particularly on the forecheck.

Thats a coaching thing and warsofsky is gunna get it into him eventually, this year or next. Coach repeatedly mentions his poor play away from the puck, which I take to mean mainly defensively, but could also refer to lack of physicality, going hard on the forecheck, skating hard on the back check, moving feet on the breakout, etc.

I have been very much on the musty train, but I am less confident to ride it this year as I was two days ago. He didnt look ready. Just like Dick didn't either. Not a huge surprise thats true, but still, its a disappointment to me.

Good stuff.

I mean he's going to be a power forward so he better start playing like it.

 

[sampler]

Because it's quite possible that what is best for Celebrini's development is to not start with the most set of responsibilities a rookie that hasn't debuted in the NHL can have. The team still needs to exercise patience with him even if he is their best player and becomes a dependable 1C by the end of this season. We're not likely a playoff team so there's no need to rush him. They can afford to gradually increase his responsibilities as the season wears on.

yeah, after last night (which is decidedly one game, and not worthy of grand conclusions), I think I tempered my expectations a lot. I'm guilty of confusing a great future with a promising present. Cherny, musty, dick, Smith, celly, LSW, Pohlcamp, etc are all exciting prospects. Many will make the NHL, but they are also all pretty much teenagers. its just too early, particularly for those coming from the CHL. Its just such a massive leap. Coming from college is an easier adjustment, as the NCAA is mostly 20+ year olds, and of ourse coming from top european leagues (SHL, KHL, etc) is the easiest transition as you are used to playing against men at high speed.

Dick and musty especially did not show well, which aligns with the completely different game in the CHL as NHL. I was very much hoping musty would take the scene by storm and force the sharks to keep him and that he could be that top 6/9 winger the sharks are lacking. I was also sorely disappointing with dick, not just from his poor play, but he also looked less engaged and battle hearty. Way too early, again, but Buium with his experience anchoring a national champion and playing against 18-24 year olds instead of 16-20 year olds might have been the better pick?

I thought cardwell played pretty well. I will be interested to watch Gush and Bordy get their shots. Someone needs to step up and fill Celly's wing.

 

[sampler]

yeah, after last night (which is decidedly one game, and not worthy of grand conclusions), I think I tempered my expectations a lot. I'm guilty of confusing a great future with a promising present. Cherny, musty, dick, Smith, celly, LSW, Pohlcamp, etc are all exciting prospects. Many will make the NHL, but they are also all pretty much teenagers. its just too early, particularly for those coming from the CHL. Its just such a massive leap. Coming from college is an easier adjustment, as the NCAA is mostly 20+ year olds, and of ourse coming from top european leagues (SHL, KHL, etc) is the easiest transition as you are used to playing against men at high speed.

Dick and musty especially did not show well, which aligns with the completely different game in the CHL as NHL. I was very much hoping musty would take the scene by storm and force the sharks to keep him and that he could be that top 6/9 winger the sharks are lacking. I was also sorely disappointing with dick, not just from his poor play, but he also looked less engaged and battle hearty. Way too early, again, but Buium with his experience anchoring a national champion and playing against 18-24 year olds instead of 16-20 year olds might have been the better pick?

I thought cardwell played pretty well. I will be interested to watch Gush and Bordy get their shots. Someone needs to step up and fill Celly's wing.

I would add that over the past 20 years, nearly all prospects coming up (from pavs to cooch to meier, to cheech...) played at least a solid stint in the AHL to prove their ability to adjust to the pro game. Skipping that developmental step is a unique thing and the vast majority of guys just cannot or should not do it. Thats why it might be Bordy, Gush, and cardwell that actually have a better shot of making the team nd playing a top 9 role than Musty. They are used to the faster pace and playing against men.

 

[TheBeard]

The Musty hype train get going a little too much - he likely will be going back to OHL and that is not the end of the world.

I'm not sold on him at all. He seems like a streaky player that will either dominate or disappear. Without knowing him personally, he seems like someone who will end up with lazy tendencies when he gets frustrated.

Like me when I'm bowling.

 

[LadyStanley]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1838268493793223104

Cassidy has some nice things to say about Mack (3min in).

 

[fasterthanlight]

Kostin, Graf and Musty all failed their auditions.

It's sacrilegious to say, I'm sure, but... might we consider trading musty for an equivalently valued D prospect? He has gamebreaking talent, clearly, but, is also inconsistent and far from a lock to be an NHLer. I think our prospect pool would look better if we had another musty-level prospect at D instead.

 

[Juxtaposer]

Boy, I sure hope people aren't overreacting to one game!

 

[Saskatoon]

Boy, I sure hope people aren't overreacting to one game!

Totally - Musty has gone from a lock to make the team to trade bait