Line Combos: Power Play: Should Rick Nash be on it?

[Kel Varnsen]

If we have to count on Nash on the PP in the playoffs, we're going to be in trouble.

 

[aufheben]

Kreider-Stepan-MSL
Boyle-McD

...has to be the 1st unit, IMO

 

[Raspewtin]

Kreider-Stepan-MSL
Boyle-McD

...has to be the 1st unit, IMO

I like this line-up too much.

No issue with having Nash on the 2nd unit.

 

[Doctyl]

I like this line-up too much.

No issue with having Nash on the 2nd unit.

whos 2nd unit?

Nash-Brass-Zucc

MSL(?)/Girardi-Moore

double shift marty? Either way not a bad 2nd unit.

 

[McSauer]

whos 2nd unit?

Nash-Brass-Zucc

MSL(?)/Girardi-Moore

double shift marty? Either way not a bad 2nd unit.

Probably double shift Boyle for both PP units (you can always run out Staal-Klein after the PP to give keep Boyle fresh.)

Kreider-Step-MSL
McD-Boyle

Nash-Brass-Zucc
Moore-Boyle

Def. liking both of those units..

 

[Beacon]

No it isn't?

Just replace Pouliot.

The 2/3 center is the real concern.

Losing Richards hurts our center depth. Brass is a good third liner, but a below average second liner.

Losing Boyle and Pouliot hurts our wing depth. If we also lose Carcillo, it will take a further toll.

We basically have 4 fewer forwards now than last season (Out: Richards, Pouliot, Boyle, Carcillo, Dorsett. In: Glass.) We might be able to play two rookies, but two more spots will need to be filled.

At this point, Miller and Fast need to be regarded as a downgrade on Richards and Pouliot, likely a significant downgrade. Who replaces Boyle and Carcillo? Total crap players who will be a further downgrade?

Our centers are not playoff quality. You can say that there are 30 first line centers and 30 more second line centers. But only 16 teams make the playoffs. Is Step a top 16 center? Doubt it (wasn't in the top 30 in scoring per game among centers, though defense makes up for some of that). Is Brass a top 46 center? No. Will Miller be a top-76 center? Unlikely.

So with non-playoff centers and non-playoff depth on the wing, what do we have? Certainly this isn't a team that is a Pouliot away from going back to the Cup Final.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

Losing Richards hurts our center depth. Brass is a good third liner, but a below average second liner.

Maybe. Im not concerned about that. Richards' line was a non-factor most nights at even strength. They treaded water if we were lucky. I think Brassard can do the same.

 

[Beacon]

Maybe. Im not concerned about that. Richards' line was a non-factor most nights at even strength. They treaded water if we were lucky. I think Brassard can do the same.

Richards scored over 50 points. You can't not be concerned with losing that. Miller and Fast likely replace the offensive production of Boyle and Pouliot. But there's nobody to replace Richards.

 

[slipknottin]

Richards scored over 50 points. You can't not be concerned with losing that. Miller and Fast likely replace the offensive production of Boyle and Pouliot. But there's nobody to replace Richards.

Stl replaces Richards production

 

[Beacon]

Stl replaces Richards production

Ok, then who replaces Callahan?

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

Richards scored over 50 points. You can't not be concerned with losing that. Miller and Fast likely replace the offensive production of Boyle and Pouliot. But there's nobody to replace Richards.

He scored most of those points when the Rangers looked like garbage before February, so I dont see replicating his offensive production as some sort of major problem.

I think a full season of MSL and Dan Boyle should help make up the 50 points. Its all the other aspects of his game, which were largely terrible, that I wont miss at all.

 

[Infinitum Vitae*]

Ok, then who replaces Callahan?

Dan boyle? it seems it would make sense since cally didn't really rack up the points

 

[slipknottin]

Ok, then who replaces Callahan?

Kreider + Stepan + Nash should be able to manage another 25 points.

Kreider didnt play to start the year.
Stepan started very slowly
Nash missed some games and somehow only managed 13 assists all season

 

[Beacon]

I think we are being delusional if we think that this team, as presently constituted, would be anywhere near contention. It is a borderline playoff squad that has a 50-50 chance of missing the playoffs.

 

[Doctyl]

I think we are being delusional if we think that this team, as presently constituted, would be anywhere near contention. It is a borderline playoff squad that has a 50-50 chance of missing the playoffs.

Stralman Richards and BB are not the difference between eastern conference champions and missing the playoffs

 

[Beacon]

Stralman Richards and BB are not the difference between eastern conference champions and missing the playoffs

We were 7 points away from missing the playoffs. Had the Craps gone 6-3-1 while we went 4-6-0 in the last 10 games, we would have missed the playoffs. That's how close it was.

I most certainly believe that losing 5 forwards (Richards, Boyle, Pouliot, Carcillo and Dorsett) while only gaining back Glass would cost us 7 points, particularly since the Metropolitan division got significantly stronger.

This is especially true considering that the one thing we had going for us last year over all other years since 2005 is huge depth. Right now our forward depth, and centers in general, are awful. We can't even field a full team of NHL-ready players when everyone is healthy.

 

[Raspewtin]

I think we are being delusional if we think that this team, as presently constituted, would be anywhere near contention. It is a borderline playoff squad that has a 50-50 chance of missing the playoffs.

This is just, incorrect on so many levels.

We lost a center who sucked at even strength and was slower than all hell, a 3rd line winger, a 4th line winger, and Stralman. We replaced Stralman with someone MUCH better offensively (although worse defensively), replaced Boyle with Glass (ugh), and the only two holes to fill are Richards and Pouliot. And I'd even argue Pouliot would be harder to replace than Richards.

 

[TheTakedown]

He scored most of those points when the Rangers looked like garbage before February, so I dont see replicating his offensive production as some sort of major problem.

I think a full season of MSL and Dan Boyle should help make up the 50 points. Its all the other aspects of his game, which were largely terrible, that I wont miss at all.

yeah, Richards was also the worst +/- on our team of all F's if I recall correctly.. if not one of the worst...

Lets not forget half of his points were Power Play goals/assists... Boyle takes all of those, meaning you're only expecting 25-35 points from Miller... that's absolutely attainable if you put him with strong wingers

And I'd even argue Pouliot would be harder to replace than Richards.

Yes, becayse Dan Boyle will score the majority of the points that Richards was scoring, because Richards' wasn't producing at even strength

 

[Raspewtin]

We were 7 points away from missing the playoffs. Had the Craps gone 6-3-1 while we went 4-6-0 in the last 10 games, we would have missed the playoffs. That's how close it was.

I most certainly believe that losing 5 forwards (Richards, Boyle, Pouliot, Carcillo and Dorsett) while only gaining back Glass would cost us 7 points, particularly since the Metropolitan division got significantly stronger.

This is especially true considering that the one thing we had going for us last year over all other years since 2005 is huge depth. Right now our forward depth, and centers in general, are awful. We can't even field a full team of NHL-ready players when everyone is healthy.

Ifs and buts are just that. Ifs and buts.

We had a truly atrocious start that we didn't fix until midway through December. We lost a lot of points in winnable games because this team totally couldn't hockey during that stretch. That very likely doesn't happen this year.

This team is missing two roster spots. Is it risky to let Miller grow into that center role Richards left? Yes, it is. Do we have a choice barring a big trade? No. Does Miller have the potential to be a HUGE reward? Yes. The fact that he can keep up with his linemates unlike Richards is enough for me. Do you realize just how much Richards padded his stats in the beginning of the year? He had 39 of his 51 points in October through January, undeniably the worst stretch this team was playing. He went cold right in the middle of January, when the team started to really pick it up. We wont miss him as much as you think.

Your last point comes with the assumption that this team has NO fall back plan incase young players don't pan out? There's nothing wrong with being pessimistic but what makes you think an NHL team actually thinks "okay, lets throw all our prospects out there against each other and hope they plug holes". And a friendly reminder that it's the middle of July. Training camp isn't for more than two months.

The only real depth we lost was Boyle and Stralman, and Stralman got replaced.

 

[Beacon]

This is just, incorrect on so many levels.

We lost a center who sucked at even strength and was slower than all hell, a 3rd line winger, a 4th line winger, and Stralman. We replaced Stralman with someone MUCH better offensively (although worse defensively), replaced Boyle (ugh), and the only two holes to fill are Richards and Pouliot. And I'd even argue Pouliot would be harder to replace than Richards.

Wishful thinking isn't going to help us.

Miller is a downgrade on Richards. No way does he score over 50 points, plus we will have to live with his rookie mistakes.

Fast is likely a downgrade on Pouliot. He probably won't score 15 goals and again, rookie mistakes.

Glass = Dorsett

Mueller is definitely a downgrade on Boyle.

Chris Bourque or whoever is a downgrade on Carcillo.

Boyle is about even with Stralman, though once Brad was dumped, Boyle made more sense than Stralman.

You can look for the worst in Brad's play, but he still had 51 points. Regardless when they were earned, they did add a few points, as did Pouliot's 15 goals. If we didn't have these two last year, we would've missed the playoffs.

You can also claim that depth doesn't matter, but it's the only reason why we went far last Spring. Like I said, as of now, we can't even dress 12 forwards when we are healthy. Once we get a few injuries, we will be running career minor leaguers.

 

[slipknottin]

Miller is a downgrade on Richards. No way does he score over 50 points, plus we will have to live with his rookie mistakes.

Eh, we had to live with Richards veteran mistakes. I would rather live with Millers.

 

[EspenK]

As a Jacket I never remember Nash being in front of the net a la Tomas Holmstrom. He did play along the half-boards and would get close to the net a lot but I never remember him in front. I agree with those who say he isn't suited for that role but I have to believe he belongs somewhere on the Rangers pp.

He also was an extremely effective pk'er when he played under Hitch. If I had to choose one special team for him that would be my choice.

 

[Fletch]

Maybe. Im not concerned about that. Richards' line was a non-factor most nights at even strength. They treaded water if we were lucky. I think Brassard can do the same.

Richards' line did garner attention from other teams' top pairings, or second pairings, enabling Brassard to go against other third lines and third defensive pairings. Ricards' line may not have done what it needed to get done, but it took attention away from the third line. Pushing Brassard up to the second line and having him face tougher oppositions may not yield the same results, although MSL and Hagelin still not not have a centerman, so perhaps that will not end up being the case.

 

[TheTakedown]

We were 7 points away from missing the playoffs. Had the Craps gone 6-3-1 while we went 4-6-0 in the last 10 games, we would have missed the playoffs. That's how close it was.

I most certainly believe that losing 5 forwards (Richards, Boyle, Pouliot, Carcillo and Dorsett) while only gaining back Glass would cost us 7 points, particularly since the Metropolitan division got significantly stronger.

This is especially true considering that the one thing we had going for us last year over all other years since 2005 is huge depth. Right now our forward depth, and centers in general, are awful. We can't even field a full team of NHL-ready players when everyone is healthy.

If you want to look at it that way, the rest of the conference blew chunks while we did sans PIT and BOS.... PHI, WAS, TBL, etc, were all average, if not slightly above/below... It wasn't until December, when NYR started picking it up that these other teams did as well... Dont forget, PHI went through a coaching change, WAS had one of the worst campaigns in terms of defense in a long time, NJD is just old and slow...

we got better down the stretch, and that made Richards look worse than he actually was considering how well everyone else was playing around him. 5v5 Richards was hardly a factor..

However, I will say in the playoffs, he stepped up (for the most part) when he needed to... that's what we'll miss from him.

 

[Larrybiv]

Nash sucks in front of the net. That's why when he's out there he plays against the boards. He is of no use on the PP. Average shot, not a very creative distributor.

He just doesn't have a skill set that is useful out there on the PP

I voted no, but On the positive side, he needs to be there for his confidence and opportunities.

Reason(s) I voted no, has been provided by above. He's a below average passer, holds on to the puck too long (while everyone else becomes a spectator) and NEVER gets in front to create havoc.

Nash creates space but only in open ice like on a 3 on 2. Speed is not important in the offensive zone on PP, quickness IS. Again, he's a lousy passer, I question his hockey IQ, not to mention he is VERY WEAK on the boards.......loses most "battles".

A player with his reputation should be DOMINANT on the PP, regrettably he is NOT! Btw, where is all this speed he used to have? When he was with the Jackets he used to get at least a couple of breakaways every night. He's lost a step.

Let's put it this way, how can he be more dangerous on the PK than on the PP? Answer......open ice availability.