Blue Jays Discussion: Post Non-Waiver Trade Deadline Edition

[The Nemesis]

My only concern about keeping him is that his high-intensity style is going to make his decline phase be incredibly sharp. He's not likely to age gracefully. By the time the team recognizes that he's not worth having around anymore, it'll probably be too late to get anything out of him.

 

[Discoverer]

Unless the deal is an overpayment I would keep Pillar. As it stands now the Jays likely need to fill two outfielder spots. Trading Pillar would make it three.

There's a pretty good chance those spots are filled internally, so it's not like they're looking at 2+ free agents.

 

[Discoverer]

but has longenhagen ever even published anything about jansen anywhere? i've never read his take. is this just behind the scenes fangraphs writers talk?

The Fringe Five link includes a link to a podcast where he talks about it.

 

[zeke]

The Fringe Five link includes a link to a podcast where he talks about it.

coles notes?

 

[Owen Wilson]

Does anyone have any ideas on what JD will be looking for for the next contract? what he could realistically get on the FA market? how long and how much this FO is willing to go?

 

[Discoverer]

coles notes?

I would need someone else to fill me in. I've only heard about it, and I don't know the specifics. And the link takes you to a series of podcasts, and I'm not really interested in listening to all of them to find out which talks about Jansen. Plus plus, I don't know that Longenhagen himself is on the podcast... it seems more like it's probably Dave Cameron relaying information from Longenhagen.

So without knowing specifics, we have the BP catching metrics hating him (though I think any attempt at quantifying minor league catching stats needs a serious grain of salt), and Longenhagen calling his defense questionable. And then we have everyone else saying it's fine but not great. It's weird how aggressively some people have been leaning on the former.

 

[phillipmike]

Does anyone have any ideas on what JD will be looking for for the next contract? what he could realistically get on the FA market? how long and how much this FO is willing to go?

Early indications are that he could get 150M over 5 years if he gives you another 6-7 WAR in 2018. However, i think a lot will be held against him due to his age - will be 33.5 on opening day in 2019. I have a hard time seeing any team giving him 5 years and 30M... it had to be one or the other... Maybe 5 years at 100-110M or 3 years at 90M.

Anything over 3 years i am likely not interested for Donaldson as a 33/34 year old player and he probably gets more.

 

[Pangu]

Time to fire Shapiro/Atkins. Replacing AA with them was a disaster that this team needs to walk away from.

 

[Woodman19]

Time to fire Shapiro/Atkins. Replacing AA with them was a disaster that this team needs to walk away from.

Care to elaborate?

 

[TF97]

Care to elaborate?

Something something, didn't sign Edwin or Price.

 

[Pangu]

Care to elaborate?

Not particularly. I just think its a fact that Jays fans need to repeat every one in a while until these guys are fired.

Even if Shapiro/Atkins would have been fine managers in the right situation, putting them in after AA brought the team to the playoffs meant they were in a tough position. AA succeeded in forming a team that could win the World Series - hard to follow that up in Toronto (and these two haven't).

 

[Discoverer]

Not particularly. I just think its a fact that Jays fans need to repeat every one in a while until these guys are fired.

Even if Shapiro/Atkins would have been fine managers in the right situation, putting them in after AA brought the team to the playoffs meant they were in a tough position. AA succeeded in forming a team that could win the World Series - hard to follow that up in Toronto (and these two haven't).

So... they should be fired because they're not AA?

 

[canucksfan]

There's a pretty good chance those spots are filled internally, so it's not like they're looking at 2+ free agents.

For sure. It would be a gamble though.

 

[Morgs]

Meh, these guys could've got us to the playoffs with bad contracts & trading away top-prospects. Instead they decided to build for the next 10 years, and have an impressive young core to work with:

Stro, Sanchez, Osuna, Travis, VGJ, Bo.

Also, if JD/Dirty/Russ/Devo were healthy all year together, this is a playoff team.

 

[Eyedea]

Not particularly. I just think its a fact that Jays fans need to repeat every one in a while until these guys are fired.

Even if Shapiro/Atkins would have been fine managers in the right situation, putting them in after AA brought the team to the playoffs meant they were in a tough position. AA succeeded in forming a team that could win the World Series - hard to follow that up in Toronto (and these two haven't).

AA was continuously lambasted for having the worst depth imaginable. If he was the GM of this team do you really think they magically form into a championship contender?

 

[canucksfan]

Article on Jansen. I am surprised it look him so long to get glasses.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/ml...en-keeps-hitting-every-stop-whirlwind-season/

 

[Starry Knight]

Not particularly. I just think its a fact that Jays fans need to repeat every one in a while until these guys are fired.

Even if Shapiro/Atkins would have been fine managers in the right situation, putting them in after AA brought the team to the playoffs meant they were in a tough position. AA succeeded in forming a team that could win the World Series - hard to follow that up in Toronto (and these two haven't).

What a flawless argument.

 

[canucksfan]

I really hope he gets called up in September

 

[hockeywiz542]

 

[zeke]

Meh, these guys could've got us to the playoffs with bad contracts & trading away top-prospects.

because it's always worth it to pass on bolstering a team good enough to win right now in the hope that they might be good enough to win in 10yrs.

 

[habamillions]

Time to fire Shapiro/Atkins. Replacing AA with them was a disaster that this team needs to walk away from.

Why dont we wait and see after 5 years. It takes time to replace a depleted minor league system.

 

[canucksfan]

because it's always worth it to pass on bolstering a team good enough to win right now in the hope that they might be good enough to win in 10yrs.

It's a little more complex than that. Can the Jays take on more salary? Injuries have hurt this team quite a bit. SS and 2B are a clear weakness. Do you trade prospects for those positions with Tulo and Travis ready to take over when healthy. Does the team want to take on another aging player?

Why dont we wait and see after 5 years. It takes time to replace a depleted minor league system.

AA did leave some nice pieces for the current organization. Vlad, Alford, Jansen etc.

 

[zeke]

AA was continuously lambasted for having the worst depth imaginable.

only by dummies.

2015 Bottom of the Order:

2B Travis 135wrc+, 2.3war
1B Smoak 108wrc+, 0.6war
LF Revere 102wrc+, 0.3war
CF Pillar 93wrc+, 4.3war

Bench

UT Colabello 142wrc+, 0.8war
OF Carrera 90wrc+, 0.2war
IF Goins 84wrc+, 1.5war
C Navarro 84wrc+, 0.5war

Extra Bench

UT Valencia 127wrc+, 0.7war
OF Pompey 81wrc+, 0.2war
IF Barney 155wrc+, 0.2war
C Thole 34wrc+, -0.3war


#5+ SP

Sanchez 11gs, 0.7awar
Hutchison 28gs, 0.5awar
Norris 5gs, 0.2awar
Doubront 4gs, 0.2awar
Copeland 3gs, 0.0awar
Redmond 1gs, 0.0awar
Boyd 2gs, -0.4awar

 

[zeke]

Why dont we wait and see after 5 years. It takes time to replace a depleted minor league system.

you mean that depleted system that already ranks at least top-10 and maybe top-5?

 

[zeke]

And I see Hoffman was demoted to AAA.

Maybe he'll be that rare "elite" 25yr old prospect next eyar.