Post-mortem on the season

[RizzleMcRib]

And you will ignore all the experts opinions outside of Pittsburgh... Like somebody else already said in here. It's not like Crosby is going to come out and bash Letang.

Well other than the fact it was Kypreos that was taking about Malkin being traded. But I forgot... You got the inside scoop on what's going on in the locker room.

 

[wgknestrick]

Shots per game with Letang: 27.5, without: 23
Shots against per game with Letang: 28.5, without: 32.7

Clear as day.

I wonder what the important thing, (GOALS) are for players with and without him? Shots mean jack shit without an expected SH% of those shots for and against. For example, a shot from point has expected SH% of 3%. Shot from crease with player alone and Letang watching, 18%. Letang's shots FOR are very low % and shots AGAINST are very high %. If you focus on goals, all the shot quantity and quality stuff are included.

Spoiler: 5v5 GF% with and without Letang......It's not pretty for just about any major player on this team. He's basically been the worst (top6) D man on this team over the last 3-4 years. That is clear as day.

 

[Turin]

Spoiler: 5v5 GF% with and without Letang......It's not pretty for just about any major player on this team. He's basically been the worst (top6) D man on this team over the last 3-4 years. That is clear as day.

Hahahahahahahahahahaha

 

[TheGoldenJet]

Here's where I think we lost this season, kind of in order:

(Didn't feel right to put this in the Post-Game, Roster Building or Appreciation threads.)

-Scheduling. Too many B2B games, with 2nd game in different city than the 1st game, and 2nd game coming against non-B2B teams who were rested. After playing almost 3 seasons worth of hockey in 2 years, I have no idea why the NHL decided to saddle us with the categorically-worst schedule. I think it really hampered our ability to maintain championship level of play.

-We screwed up by making chemistry-altering moves at the trade deadline. We were 10-1-1 and in Stanley Cup form riding into the trade deadline. I understand GMJR was finally making the moves to fill the holes that he identified at the outset of the season, but the team had, in the meantime, learned to win WITH those holes... and by trading away working components of that success, to address an on-paper need (by that time), it messed with what had evolved into a winning formula. (It reminded me of Shero in 2012-2013 w/ Iginla trade when Pens were on a 13-0 run). I love the assets we acquired, I was just really skeptical at that time, of tinkering with something that was already working extremely well. Had those trades been made at any other time of the year, I wouldn't have been nervous about them.

-An overall inability to clear the zone. My observation was that time-after-time we weren't getting clean D-zone clears. I just felt like we'd win our share of puck battles on the boards in our end, only to fail a clearing attempt with a weak/bobbled lift. It allowed the opposition to keep us in our zone way more, and for way longer than they should have been able to.

-Giroux and Wilson damaged our roster enough that it negatively impacted our ability to maintain success derived familiarity/chemistry. Yes, I understand injuries happen, and that champions overcome those situations. The difference here is that these weren't injuries that were sustained through good hockey plays, or bad luck. They were injuries that occurred as the result of an opponent trying to inflict pain when they knew they could get away with it. I think the Hagelin loss was huge. The ZAR loss had implications throughout the line-up, even if ZAR himself wasn't a huge loss (he certainly wasn't a liability in his role, however), it forced Sully to make changes in areas I'd rather he didn't.

-Trotz gameplanned us perfectly. He identified where he wanted his guys to shoot the puck from (slot), where to shoot the puck to (glove), and how to get the puck back quickly (intercepting neutral zone). I'm not a coach, I'll readily admit that, and I'm not going to criticize Sully, and I'll gladly ****, just offering my armchair-2¢ here... but I felt we needed to get Sheary on the top line, we need to air the puck over the neutral zone, and we need to chase deep pucks with speed, because that's where our bread and butter has been the past 2 years. I wasn't sure if we weren't doing it because we were too fatigued (3 seasons of hockey in 2 years) to chase those pucks down, or because Sully didn't feel we had the roster/makeup to hunt those pucks, or that the Caps D were always in a good position to win those foot-races. Dunno. But they were ready for everything we tried to do.


In summary, I think losing Ian Cole was monumental. I'm not sure why he had to go, I'm guessing inner-circle politics... so I'm assuming there's a very very very good reason... but I just don't know what that reason is. All I know is, I started to get really really really worried mid-season when I heard they were looking at moving him (see my post history), because I felt he was a critical piece to our puzzle in terms of success, going into the playoffs. I feel a little justified with hindsight, in my concerns. I don't know how to frame it... something like:

Cole provided us with the already-lacking grit, slot presence, physicality, puck-clearing that we needed... and it was greater than the benefits we gained in center depth with Brassard on the off-chance that Sid or Geno went down long-term. (It just so happens that we did lose Geno for a couple games, and Brassard (probably?) wasn't able to compensate for that loss anyway.)

Would Reaves have detered Giroux and Wilson? I don't know, you'd have to tell me. But I do know it's the exact reason we acquired him in the first place. Not trying to turn this into a Reaves debate, I know the vast majority of you guys were happy to move on from Reaves, and you're probably right. But I did notice a change in the opponents' physicality post-Reaves, and I do know we never got to see what a Reaves-protected roster in the Playoffs looked like, and that was the whole point of acquiring Reaves in the first place, for the playoffs. I was comfortable with and looking forward to seeing him on this team in the playoffs.

FWIW, I'm a huge Brassard fan, going back to his CBJ days. I'm not ****ting on Brass. I like him, and I'm happy we've got him for another year, especially for the price-tag. I'm really looking forward to him finding his place/role/comfort on this team next year. I'm really glad we acquired him. I just wish it was a month or more before TDL, and not at the expense of Cole.

I agree with the scheduling. Was a big factor and straight up unfair of the league to do that.

Disagree with the TDL moves. Brassard was catching on here with about 6 or 7 games to go. Then he picked up a nagging injury. Which brings me to the next factor.

Injuries. Malkin playing super hurt since the 1st period of game 5 against Philly. Didn’t even go to the WC. Hagelin our injured. Brassard playing injured.

Chemistry was a factor too. I mean, why Hornqvist and Malkin again? Oil and water combo, one of several used by Sully this season.

That and the Caps playing really well did us in.

 

[The Old Master]

i

That and the Caps playing really well did us in.

all that and a coach that refused to bring up sprong and play him.

 

[Tom Hanks]

I agree with the scheduling. Was a big factor and straight up unfair of the league to do that.

Disagree with the TDL moves. Brassard was catching on here with about 6 or 7 games to go. Then he picked up a nagging injury. Which brings me to the next factor.

Injuries. Malkin playing super hurt since the 1st period of game 5 against Philly. Didn’t even go to the WC. Hagelin our injured. Brassard playing injured.

Chemistry was a factor too. I mean, why Hornqvist and Malkin again? Oil and water combo, one of several used by Sully this season.

That and the Caps playing really well did us in.

Well they with Hagelin were our best line combo of the season. It was a great line. No idea why you would complain about that.

 

[TheGoldenJet]

Well they with Hagelin were our best line combo of the season. It was a great line. No idea why you would complain about that.

It was a good line, for about a month or so. Then it stopped working, long, long before the playoffs. Not sure why Sully kept going back to it when it was obviously no longer effective.

 

[Gurglesons]

It was a good line, for about a month or so. Then it stopped working, long, long before the playoffs. Not sure why Sully kept going back to it when it was obviously no longer effective.

It was still a strong possession line.

I think the issue is despite his chemistry with Malkin putting Hagelin on the 2nd line. Much like Rust having them in our bottom six is more effective.

 

[Ogrezilla]

It was a good line, for about a month or so. Then it stopped working, long, long before the playoffs. Not sure why Sully kept going back to it when it was obviously no longer effective.

It was still a strong possession line.

I think the issue is despite his chemistry with Malkin putting Hagelin on the 2nd line. Much like Rust having them in our bottom six is more effective.

Yeah that line is great when Malkin is at his absolute best because they were so good at maintaining possession and he could do the scoring. But when he is even a bit off and needs help with the scoring part, that line struggles to convert.

 

[dig1]

I agree with the scheduling. Was a big factor and straight up unfair of the league to do that.

Disagree with the TDL moves. Brassard was catching on here with about 6 or 7 games to go. Then he picked up a nagging injury. Which brings me to the next factor.

Injuries. Malkin playing super hurt since the 1st period of game 5 against Philly. Didn’t even go to the WC. Hagelin our injured. Brassard playing injured.

Chemistry was a factor too. I mean, why Hornqvist and Malkin again? Oil and water combo, one of several used by Sully this season.

That and the Caps playing really well did us in.

it's an interesting observation for anyone that watched the games that costly turnovers did us in, rather than all the injured party. The implication is that the D was injured when in reality it was the secondary scoring that dried up. So, what. There were still enough goals beign scored. On a given night, Pens were slotted to put in 3. So, i don't buy the whole injured shtik. Letang was not injured. Simon was not injured. Phil too.

You can't blame Jaime coughing up the puck trying to be cute on him being injured. Same goes for 58.
I just don't get why people don't see that this team was undisciplined and at some point that reared its ugly head in the washington series. I feel as if the locker room lost something and that careless play was never checked by the coach. It's as if ( and this is pure conjencutre) there were players content with the two cups and that they were not doing things that were necessary to win. The only exceptions i saw to this were 87, Hagelin, 72, 71, Dumo, Ruh and Jake and Jaime(i'll let that goofing slide). The rest, they were at one point or another careless with the puck because they thought they would rather make cute plays or someone else plays for them. Still livid as I am watching the Tampa series because both teams are not that impressive. Pens would still have lost to the West I believe but it's so maddening for me to see an opportunity get squandered because of complacency.

 

[Gurglesons]

it's an interesting observation for anyone that watched the games that costly turnovers did us in, rather than all the injured party. The implication is that the D was injured when in reality it was the secondary scoring that dried up. So, what. There were still enough goals beign scored. On a given night, Pens were slotted to put in 3. So, i don't buy the whole injured shtik. Letang was not injured. Simon was not injured. Phil too.

You can't blame Jaime coughing up the puck trying to be cute on him being injured. Same goes for 58.
I just don't get why people don't see that this team was undisciplined and at some point that reared its ugly head in the washington series. I feel as if the locker room lost something and that careless play was never checked by the coach. It's as if ( and this is pure conjencutre) there were players content with the two cups and that they were not doing things that were necessary to win. The only exceptions i saw to this were 87, Hagelin, 72, 71, Dumo, Ruh and Jake and Jaime(i'll let that goofing slide). The rest, they were at one point or another careless with the puck because they thought they would rather make cute plays or someone else plays for them. Still livid as I am watching the Tampa series because both teams are not that impressive. Pens would still have lost to the West I believe but it's so maddening for me to see an opportunity get squandered because of complacency.

Malkin, Ruh and Oleksiak were all on the ice for more goals against than for in the Caps series at evens. Also Malkin was fed a ridiculous amount of offensive zone starts.

So interesting thoughts on that.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Malkin, Ruh and Oleksiak were all on the ice for more goals against than for in the Caps series at evens. Also Malkin was fed a ridiculous amount of offensive zone starts.

So interesting thoughts on that.

Malkin didn't produce at 5 on 5 the entire series. I know he had a significant injury, but I think him being a non-factor at 5 on 5 is overlooked a bit.

It's kind of funny, too, because when he missed the first two games everyone was ecstatic over going 1-1 with Malkin out, and he was going to be the savior when he returned. Instead (not pinning it all on him, obviously) the team went 1-3 when he returned.

 

[Gurglesons]

Malkin didn't produce at 5 on 5 the entire series. I know he had a significant injury, but I think him being a non-factor at 5 on 5 is overlooked a bit.

It's kind of funny, too, because when he missed the first two games everyone was ecstatic over going 1-1 with Malkin out, and he was going to be the savior when he returned. Instead (not pinning it all on him, obviously) the team went 1-3 when he returned.

I mean, it’s hard to blame Malkin for anything.

But, I think the short list of players that showed up this playoffs is basically Jake, Crosby and Dumoulin.

Murray, Malkin, Schultz, Letang, and Kessel all took off stretches that led to us folding against the Caps. Then you factor in our support like Brassard, Sheahan, Maatta, Rust and Sheary not doing anything besides setting up nice looking chances once or twice a game and it’s pretty easy to see why the Capitals rolled us.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

I mean, it’s hard to blame Malkin for anything.

But, I think the short list of players that showed up this playoffs is basically Jake, Crosby and Dumoulin.

Murray, Malkin, Schultz, Letang, and Kessel all took off stretches that led to us folding against the Caps. Then you factor in our support like Brassard, Sheahan, Maatta, Rust and Sheary not doing anything besides setting up nice looking chances once or twice a game and it’s pretty easy to see why the Capitals rolled us.

I don't "blame" Malkin, but I do think there's a bit of a double standard on here in that Kessel was hurt, but there were a lot of "f*** off, Kessel" comments and ripping on him. Meanwhile, Malkin also didn't produce except on the PP, but everyone's willing to overlook that because he was hurt.

 

[Tom Hanks]

Malkin didn't produce at 5 on 5 the entire series. I know he had a significant injury, but I think him being a non-factor at 5 on 5 is overlooked a bit.

It's kind of funny, too, because when he missed the first two games everyone was ecstatic over going 1-1 with Malkin out, and he was going to be the savior when he returned. Instead (not pinning it all on him, obviously) the team went 1-3 when he returned.

Malkin got caught out of position a bit because he was limited in his skating. When he went forward he couldn't really get by a defender one on one either. Caps used it to their advantage. Sucked because we didnt really have a choice. Brassard's minutes went to true 4th line minutes and injured Malkin is still better than anyone they could have brought up. Maybe more of a share in minutes with Sheahan might have been better at least from a defensive standpoint.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

The team just didn't want it as badly as we did.

And a lot of people here were resigned to the "house money" thought process. To me, if you aren't pissed you didn't win, you shouldn't be playing the game.

 

[Ogrezilla]

The team just didn't want it as badly as we did.

And a lot of people here were resigned to the "house money" thought process. To me, if you aren't pissed you didn't win, you shouldn't be playing the game.

Or they did want it, but so did the caps. The other team plays the games too. The Cup doesn't go to the team who wants it the most, it goes to the team that wins the most hockey games.

 

[BigEezyE22]

The team just didn't want it as badly as we did.

And a lot of people here were resigned to the "house money" thought process. To me, if you aren't pissed you didn't win, you shouldn't be playing the game.

It's a little odd to suggest people watching on tv "wanted it" more than the guys playing through injuries.

Well not odd, more stupid.

 

[EightyOne]

Were they playing through injuries in October? How about November? Dec, Jan, Feb, Mar??? Or did they only get hurt in April?

Cause they were lackadaisical most of the year.

Injuries didn't help in the playoffs. But they didn't really look worse in the playoffs than a lot of the other 82 games. Was just more of the same old. Except there were real consequences.

 

[BigEezyE22]

Were they playing through injuries in October? How about November? Dec, Jan, Feb, Mar??? Or did they only get hurt in April?

Cause they were lackadaisical most of the year.

Injuries didn't help in the playoffs. But they didn't really look worse in the playoffs than a lot of the other 82 games. Was just more of the same old. Except there were real consequences.

I guess they didn't want it t as bad as you did.

 

[Tom Hanks]

Were they playing through injuries in October? How about November? Dec, Jan, Feb, Mar??? Or did they only get hurt in April?

Cause they were lackadaisical most of the year.

Injuries didn't help in the playoffs. But they didn't really look worse in the playoffs than a lot of the other 82 games. Was just more of the same old. Except there were real consequences.

Malkin was injured and that is a huge factor. At even strength in the end he turned out to be more of a liability.

The guy who could really replace his minutes (Brassard) was injured and couldn’t perform as he normally would over his career.

Our most productive winger had his shooting percentage drop by half due to an injury and looked like a different player.

Per 82 games these guys were on track for 103, 52 and 92 points for the season. All their production dropped significantly due to injuries in the playoffs. We also had Hagelin injured and while he’s not a huge producer he did not score a point after he came back.

Those are some pretty big factors for any team let alone for an offensive built team.

 

[SouthGeorge]

The team just didn't want it as badly as we did.

And a lot of people here were resigned to the "house money" thought process. To me, if you aren't pissed you didn't win, you shouldn't be playing the game.

That's BS. They fought hard to get it 2-2 and were up a goal in the 3rd in Game 5. Then their "best d-man" skates out the way and hands the Caps the game and series. It was demoralizing like I said after Game 5 to work that hard and lose it because of a Timbit mistake. Then you add in 300+ games in 3 years, having to win two in a row in Round 2 just to get to Round 3, while the other team waits for you, etc. They never gave up but look demoralized and had no faith in Game 6 and I get it. But to say they didn't want it, tired, or gave up is BS.

 

[Ogrezilla]

Injuries didn't help in the playoffs. But they didn't really look worse in the playoffs than a lot of the other 82 games. Was just more of the same old. Except there were real consequences.

well that's just plain not true. Our entire bottom 9 stopped producing in the playoffs. Hell, Kessel had the best year of his career prior to the playoffs. Also, Rowney and McKegg were our bottom 6 centers in the beginning of the year.

 

[vodeni]

Malkin was injured and that is a huge factor. At even strength in the end he turned out to be more of a liability.

The guy who could really replace his minutes (Brassard) was injured and couldn’t perform as he normally would over his career.

Our most productive winger had his shooting percentage drop by half due to an injury and looked like a different player.

Per 82 games these guys were on track for 103, 52 and 92 points for the season. All their production dropped significantly due to injuries in the playoffs. We also had Hagelin injured and while he’s not a huge producer he did not score a point after he came back.

Those are some pretty big factors for any team let alone for an offensive built team.

hold on now! Malkin was liability, did we watch the same stuff, he still carried 5 on 5 play, he set up a dozen of glorious chances to a bunch of guys, hagelin Guentzel, maatta, he did some heroics to score some goals on PP, he himself had some good shots but no luck....he was liability, he actually play at the same if not higher level than during 2016 run...but of course he was liability...unf......believable!

 

[Tom Hanks]

hold on now! Malkin was liability, did we watch the same stuff, he still carried 5 on 5 play, he set up a dozen of glorious chances to a bunch of guys, hagelin Guentzel, maatta, he did some heroics to score some goals on PP, he himself had some good shots but no luck....he was liability, he actually play at the same if not higher level than during 2016 run...but of course he was liability...unf......believable!

I’m talking about after him coming back from injury, not before.

He was out of position a lot coming back because he had trouble skating. He was on the ice for a lot of goals against.

No even strength points and he didn’t “score some goals on PP” since he had one.

He was trying his hardest but the injury was too much for him to really be effective at even strength. If you can’t skate in this league it’s going to be really difficult