Confirmed Signing with Link: [PIT] F Brayden Yager signs ELC with the Penguins (3 years, $950k AAV)

[Sidney the Kidney]

Does he make the Pens this year?

Mike Sullivan is the coach. He'll likely be utilized completely wrong, getting 7 minutes per night as a 4th line checker, then when he struggles to "score more", he'll be healthy scratched and eventually sent down.

 

[DesertPenguin]

I could see on my radar a Rutger Mcgroaty for Brayden Yager deal happening

We like McGroarty but not enough to give up our top prospect. There's a deal here but it's picks or players further from being ready.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

I could see on my radar a Rutger Mcgroaty for Brayden Yager deal happening

Yeah I don't see that happening at all. Just reading about what Rutger has issues with the Jets, there's no way he and his agent would look at the Penguins as a good option and the Jets could trade him to the Penguins but the Penguins will want to talk to him first and after that conversation, the Penguins will quickly realize that he won't sign there because the plan Sullivan would have for him will require examples and those examples exploit how idiotic Mike Sullivan truly is.

 

[MichaelFarrell]

Yeah he needs to learn how to play with more juice and sticktoitiveness, like a strong professional game like Acciari. Until he learns that he will get 3-5 mins a game on the 4th line with occasional healthy scratches for weeks at a time.

It's a method Mike Sullivan has had success with. What success you ask? Destroying the will of young prospects.

He did a fine job developing young players. He helped develop Jake Guentzel, Brian Rust, Brian Dumoulin, Connor Sheary, and Teddy Blugers. So I’m not sure who you are referring to.

He’a never coached a high pick except Derrick Pouliot and it wasn’t poor development in Pouliot’s case.

 

[Grip it N RYP it]

Most of us also had a pit stop here

Jägerbombs from the point

 

[Honour Over Glory]

He did a fine job developing young players. He helped develop Jake Guentzel, Brian Rust, Brian Dumoulin, Connor Sheary, and Teddy Blugers. So I’m not sure who you are referring to.

He’a never coached a high pick except Derrick Pouliot and it wasn’t poor development in Pouliot’s case.

He didn't develop Blueger, he destroyed Blueger. Blue was showing promise as a 3C and instead of grooming him more to take that role, Sullivan wanted more veterans and essentially gave anyone else a shot over Blueger and then started to give Blueger some of the harshest defensive assignments known to man.

Conor Sheary had moments of being good with Crosby but was mostly inconsistent and has bounced around since, not a good example there. Brian Dumoulin being developed by Mike Sullivan? LMAO

Some of these insane claims or credit you want to give Sullivan are comical. Jake Guentzel was on the 4th line at one point and Jake was so damn good that Sullivan had no choice but to promote him back up to the top line after first being sent down and then recalled. Bryan Rust these days went from a solid beast of a 2-way winger that can produce to being just an offense first winger that is a joke defensively and I say that as a big Rust fan.

Also, all of your examples are from 2015-16 or 2016-17 really. Since then, what? Blueger was basically destroyed to the point the Pens finally traded him and he bounced back with the Canucks but the damage was already done. It's a shame because Blueger really showed a ton of potential, but development, very poor development, can also severely stunt a player's growth and Sullivan has done that more often than your list of players he supposedly "Developed."

High pick prospect as a bar is pathetic. Just go with prospects alone, he's misused far more than he's "developed" into serviceable NHL'ers. In the last 7 seasons alone, his list is barely anything to sniff at - O'Connor finally had a breakthrough and then he shit all over Puustinen. Hallander literally said f*** this and left. He's barely wanted to use Sam Poulin and when he has, it's been strictly only for 3rd or 4th line usage at best. He did such a number on Kapanen, he's barely a recognizable player anymore.

Since 2017, the only player that has been drafted by the Penguins to even play for the team in any regular capacity is Valtteri Puustinen. Have the Pens drafted poorly? Maybe not the best, but the players that deserved a better shot in different roles were only ever used on the 4th line or the 3rd line at best - Poulin, Hallander, etc. Sullivan was more inclined to give a longer look to hacks, absolute hacks, like Harkins and White.

 

[TooManyHumans]

He didn't develop Blueger, he destroyed Blueger. Blue was showing promise as a 3C and instead of grooming him more to take that role, Sullivan wanted more veterans and essentially gave anyone else a shot over Blueger and then started to give Blueger some of the harshest defensive assignments known to man.

Conor Sheary had moments of being good with Crosby but was mostly inconsistent and has bounced around since, not a good example there. Brian Dumoulin being developed by Mike Sullivan? LMAO

Some of these insane claims or credit you want to give Sullivan are comical. Jake Guentzel was on the 4th line at one point and Jake was so damn good that Sullivan had no choice but to promote him back up to the top line after first being sent down and then recalled. Bryan Rust these days went from a solid beast of a 2-way winger that can produce to being just an offense first winger that is a joke defensively and I say that as a big Rust fan.

Also, all of your examples are from 2015-16 or 2016-17 really. Since then, what? Blueger was basically destroyed to the point the Pens finally traded him and he bounced back with the Canucks but the damage was already done. It's a shame because Blueger really showed a ton of potential, but development, very poor development, can also severely stunt a player's growth and Sullivan has done that more often than your list of players he supposedly "Developed."

High pick prospect as a bar is pathetic. Just go with prospects alone, he's misused far more than he's "developed" into serviceable NHL'ers. In the last 7 seasons alone, his list is barely anything to sniff at - O'Connor finally had a breakthrough and then he shit all over Puustinen. Hallander literally said f*** this and left. He's barely wanted to use Sam Poulin and when he has, it's been strictly only for 3rd or 4th line usage at best. He did such a number on Kapanen, he's barely a recognizable player anymore.

Since 2017, the only player that has been drafted by the Penguins to even play for the team in any regular capacity is Valtteri Puustinen. Have the Pens drafted poorly? Maybe not the best, but the players that deserved a better shot in different roles were only ever used on the 4th line or the 3rd line at best - Poulin, Hallander, etc. Sullivan was more inclined to give a longer look to hacks, absolute hacks, like Harkins and White.

He developed the hell out of Jeff Carter though. Played that guy every damn day no matter what.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Oktoberfest in 2017 they were selling shots of it for 1 Euro. I will never touch the stuff again.

It sounds like a great deal until you factor in the amount of money you’ll need to post bail.

 

[chethejet]

He is a RH center with a really good shot and release. He is smart, and what he lacks is NHL strength that can be addressed with a year in WHL and a year in the AHL. He will be ready for prime time by then. Pens have enough LW's and need RW's with RH shots. Pens addressed the RH D shortage in the draft probably taking to many but the system was barren after St Ivany.

 

[MichaelFarrell]

He didn't develop Blueger, he destroyed Blueger. Blue was showing promise as a 3C and instead of grooming him more to take that role, Sullivan wanted more veterans and essentially gave anyone else a shot over Blueger and then started to give Blueger some of the harshest defensive assignments known to man.

Conor Sheary had moments of being good with Crosby but was mostly inconsistent and has bounced around since, not a good example there. Brian Dumoulin being developed by Mike Sullivan? LMAO

Some of these insane claims or credit you want to give Sullivan are comical. Jake Guentzel was on the 4th line at one point and Jake was so damn good that Sullivan had no choice but to promote him back up to the top line after first being sent down and then recalled. Bryan Rust these days went from a solid beast of a 2-way winger that can produce to being just an offense first winger that is a joke defensively and I say that as a big Rust fan.

Also, all of your examples are from 2015-16 or 2016-17 really. Since then, what? Blueger was basically destroyed to the point the Pens finally traded him and he bounced back with the Canucks but the damage was already done. It's a shame because Blueger really showed a ton of potential, but development, very poor development, can also severely stunt a player's growth and Sullivan has done that more often than your list of players he supposedly "Developed."

High pick prospect as a bar is pathetic. Just go with prospects alone, he's misused far more than he's "developed" into serviceable NHL'ers. In the last 7 seasons alone, his list is barely anything to sniff at - O'Connor finally had a breakthrough and then he shit all over Puustinen. Hallander literally said f*** this and left. He's barely wanted to use Sam Poulin and when he has, it's been strictly only for 3rd or 4th line usage at best. He did such a number on Kapanen, he's barely a recognizable player anymore.

Since 2017, the only player that has been drafted by the Penguins to even play for the team in any regular capacity is Valtteri Puustinen. Have the Pens drafted poorly? Maybe not the best, but the players that deserved a better shot in different roles were only ever used on the 4th line or the 3rd line at best - Poulin, Hallander, etc. Sullivan was more inclined to give a longer look to hacks, absolute hacks, like Harkins and White.

You are missing the point. None of these players were top picks. Every prospect that didn’t make it, was just not a good enough player. It wasn’t development. What great prospects were poorly developed? The Penguins are a good development team. We’ve shown that in the later rounds. We just are definitely not the best drafting team in the early rounds.

1. Teddy was always a 4th line C in my opinion. He was given opportunities and did not have the offensive tools to become the 3C. You, along with several others, think too highly of Blueger. He was never going to be a 40 point player.

2. Brian Dumoulin developed under Mike Sullivan and John Hynes. Dumo made big improvements ever year when he became an NHLer under Sullivan.

3. Jake Guentzel had nothing but success with the Penguins. He for sure had a sophomore slump, but immediately became our best winger after that. How can you question his development whenever it’s clearly worked for him.

4. Bryan Rust’s game changed because his role changed. We rely on him for offense due to the lack of depth on the team.

5. Drew O’Connor is a valid point. He has misused that player.

6. Sam Poulin was never a player, Kasper Kappanen is an alcoholic and has never played with any consistency, Puustinen has without a doubt surpassed expectations, and Hallander was never a player.

Harkins is a good role player. I liked seeing him in the lineup.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Harkins is a good role player. I liked seeing him in the lineup.

That's all I needed to see to know to ignore anything you say.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

That's all I needed to see to know to ignore anything you say.

I also like the "and the players he didn't develop, it's because they sucked anyways and it's not his fault" brush off.

So essentially the handful of players who did pan out were all due to Sullivan's brilliance, but the dozens of players who busted/disappointed sucked anyways and would have busted/disappointed with any coach.

Easy to defend Sullivan if THAT'S the argument.

 

[Bowski]

I also like the "and the players he didn't develop, it's because they sucked anyways and it's not his fault" brush off.

So essentially the handful of players who did pan out were all due to Sullivan's brilliance, but the dozens of players who busted/disappointed sucked anyways and would have busted/disappointed with any coach.

Easy to defend Sullivan if THAT'S the argument.

Could you guys open a "Mike Sullivan Is The Reason For All Bad" support group thread and post your nonsense there?

When a prospect, or signing, or vet plays like garbage, it's easy and boring to pull the old Sullivan flag every time.
But it's also pointless (not going anywhere soon) and extremely repetitive.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Could you guys open a "Mike Sullivan Is The Reason For All Bad" support group thread and post your nonsense there?

When a prospect, or signing, or vet plays like garbage, it's easy and boring to pull the old Sullivan flag every time.
But it's also pointless (not going anywhere soon) and extremely repetitive.

Maybe it's easier to make a Thread in support of Sullivan actually, would definitely help just finding out who those blokes are so I can clean up my ignore list. Help mate out will ya?

Also when it comes to Penguins and issues, it starts with Mike Sullivan so there's that, we all like Brayden Yager and wish for him to succeed, but given how this coach sees development and how he follows through with his idea of usage and easing them in, you can't ignore the simple facts that Sullivan is an ignorant tit and Yager is almost 100% better off going back to the WHL this next season albeit for the 9 game stint we hope he gets and hopefully FSG can stop getting hot and bothered just enough for their fellow Masshole that when he fails to make the playoffs yet again, he's fired and Yager being a solid future player for the Penguins has a more positive outlook.

 

[MichaelFarrell]

I also like the "and the players he didn't develop, it's because they sucked anyways and it's not his fault" brush off.

So essentially the handful of players who did pan out were all due to Sullivan's brilliance, but the dozens of players who busted/disappointed sucked anyways and would have busted/disappointed with any coach.

Easy to defend Sullivan if THAT'S the argument.

I think there is more evidence of the Penguins organization under Sullivan turning mid-late round prospects into players than a lot of organizations. I stand by that. I don’t feel like I’ve been given any evidence disputing that. @Honour Over Glory

Brayden Yager will be given the opportunity he earns. I don’t think the coaching staff will hinder him in anyway. Mike Sullivan has given plenty of opportunity to plenty of young players that have earned it.

 

[eXile3]

He did a fine job developing young players. He helped develop Jake Guentzel, Brian Rust, Brian Dumoulin, Connor Sheary, and Teddy Blugers. So I’m not sure who you are referring to.

He’a never coached a high pick except Derrick Pouliot and it wasn’t poor development in Pouliot’s case.

That was a previous iteration of Sullivan. He’s so risk adverse at this point a lot of those guys would have never seen time under him now.

 

[DEANYOUNGBLOOD17]

Jansen Harkens was a highly rated prospect that fell to the 2 nd round. He was a point per game player ….inThe AHL….

Was under utilized with the Penguins …. We store going to miss him this year…

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

I could see on my radar a Rutger Mcgroaty for Brayden Yager deal happening

Actually would make sense. Couple of 14th picks, yager is from the prairies so unlikely to force himself out of winnipeg.

Down- lets call it in.

Harkins is a good role player. I liked seeing him in the lineup.

Dawg this is crazy

 

[TGWL]

Oktoberfest in 2017 they were selling shots of it for 1 Euro. I will never touch the stuff again.

That's what they all say after a bad experience with the Jager meister.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

I also like the "and the players he didn't develop, it's because they sucked anyways and it's not his fault" brush off.

So essentially the handful of players who did pan out were all due to Sullivan's brilliance, but the dozens of players who busted/disappointed sucked anyways and would have busted/disappointed with any coach.

Easy to defend Sullivan if THAT'S the argument.

Sprong is really the only one it seemed like he had a hard on for and it’s fair to say that he was poorly handled given the Pens needs at the time. Ended up working out but I don’t think Sprong got a fair shake.

Other than that I can’t think of any prospect of the top of my head that went and had success elsewhere after not getting sufficient opportunity in Pittsburgh. I maybe would’ve liked to see more of Hallander? But that is also on GM, maybe even more than the coach.

The reality is the prospects just haven’t been very good. The few with any shred of talent have gotten rope, like Puus, JSI last year and OC the last 2 years.

Would I like to see less reliance on the Carters of the world and would I have liked to see Harkins nuked? Yes. I have a ton of issues with Sullivan, and think he is too stale and it’s time to move on… but him killing prospects is not one of them. Yet at least. I’ll change my tune if it happens.

 

[Hockeyville USA]

Jansen Harkens was a highly rated prospect that fell to the 2 nd round. He was a point per game player ….inThe AHL….

Was under utilized with the Penguins …. We store going to miss him this year…

Harkins was a top prospect until he wasn't. He had two horrific post draft production seasons in the Dub relative to expectations, and then wasn't anything special in the A until his 22 year old season, which is pretty late for someone who was a potential 1st round pick in his DY.

 

[FunkySeeFunkyDo]

…

Harkins is a good role player. I liked seeing him in the lineup.

45 GP, 0g, 4a, 8min/gp with 5 total minutes on PK — unless he was Jordan Staal in the defensive end those are not the stats of a good role player.

 

[SEALBound]

He didn't develop Blueger, he destroyed Blueger. Blue was showing promise as a 3C and instead of grooming him more to take that role, Sullivan wanted more veterans and essentially gave anyone else a shot over Blueger and then started to give Blueger some of the harshest defensive assignments known to man.

Conor Sheary had moments of being good with Crosby but was mostly inconsistent and has bounced around since, not a good example there. Brian Dumoulin being developed by Mike Sullivan? LMAO

Some of these insane claims or credit you want to give Sullivan are comical. Jake Guentzel was on the 4th line at one point and Jake was so damn good that Sullivan had no choice but to promote him back up to the top line after first being sent down and then recalled. Bryan Rust these days went from a solid beast of a 2-way winger that can produce to being just an offense first winger that is a joke defensively and I say that as a big Rust fan.

Also, all of your examples are from 2015-16 or 2016-17 really. Since then, what? Blueger was basically destroyed to the point the Pens finally traded him and he bounced back with the Canucks but the damage was already done. It's a shame because Blueger really showed a ton of potential, but development, very poor development, can also severely stunt a player's growth and Sullivan has done that more often than your list of players he supposedly "Developed."

High pick prospect as a bar is pathetic. Just go with prospects alone, he's misused far more than he's "developed" into serviceable NHL'ers. In the last 7 seasons alone, his list is barely anything to sniff at - O'Connor finally had a breakthrough and then he shit all over Puustinen. Hallander literally said f*** this and left. He's barely wanted to use Sam Poulin and when he has, it's been strictly only for 3rd or 4th line usage at best. He did such a number on Kapanen, he's barely a recognizable player anymore.

Since 2017, the only player that has been drafted by the Penguins to even play for the team in any regular capacity is Valtteri Puustinen. Have the Pens drafted poorly? Maybe not the best, but the players that deserved a better shot in different roles were only ever used on the 4th line or the 3rd line at best - Poulin, Hallander, etc. Sullivan was more inclined to give a longer look to hacks, absolute hacks, like Harkins and White.

I will agree with most of what you said but to be fair, I don't think claiming that guys like Jake, Dumo, Sheary, Bleugsy, etc were successful DESPITE Sullivan. Those were all kids that came up and had to learn the game with Sullivan as HC.

What would be much more fair to suggest is that the 2024 Sullivan is a lot different than the 2016/2017 Sullivan that won B2B Cups. That alone does not lend itself well to the development of young guys like we saw with Kuhnhackl, Sheary, Rust, Wilson, Jake, etc. I believe the road to develop a guy like Yager or Bleuger or Poulin now, is much more difficult due to how Sullivan has changed throughout the years.

The perils of winning B2B though. After that, you think you'll win forever and that your shit don't stink. After 2017, Sullivan began to get a little full of himself and morphed from "We will adjust our game as needed" to "Lol, the other team can adjust around us". And that's the core of the issues with Sullivan for the last 6 years.

 

[MichaelFarrell]

45 GP, 0g, 4a, 8min/gp with 5 total minutes on PK — unless he was Jordan Staal in the defensive end those are not the stats of a good role player.

He’s not out there to get points. He’s there to give a strong shift here and there in the defensive end. The vast majority of his starts were in the defensive zone. Like over 80% and he’s also getting like 8 minutes a night. I’m not here saying he’s a superstar. I’m saying, for what it’s worth, he’s a player who doesn’t make a whole lot of mistakes, has good foot-speed, and can be a decent grinder on the forth line. He’s had solid production in the minors and I just feel like he has more to give than people give him credit for.

To bring it back to the initial conversation: The bottom line is that there weren’t any prospects on the Penguins that were good enough to take the role of anybody. It wasn’t a matter of Sullivan not playing them. Guys that work hard, have the talent and earn a spot get time.

Brayden Yager, who I’m a huge fan of, has serious holes in his game. For him to play under any coach in the league, he’s going to need to play smarter and be more consistent. If he fails, it will likely because he simply couldn’t do those things not necessarily because of his development.

 

[PensandCaps]

He did a fine job developing young players. He helped develop Jake Guentzel, Brian Rust, Brian Dumoulin, Connor Sheary, and Teddy Blugers. So I’m not sure who you are referring to.

He’a never coached a high pick except Derrick Pouliot and it wasn’t poor development in Pouliot’s case.

Because they all played with him in WBS. And that was forever ago.