That contract is eww. 1B/DH and very inconsistent to boot. I can't imagine that it is worth it even 5 years in.
OT: Pirates Talk: Lets Play Ball
- Thread starter Zirakzigil
- Start date
So deferring money is bad and unfair… but not deferring money is… also bad and unfair? I’m not trying to be snarky but is that what you are saying here or am I just totally missing the point you are trying to make?
pistolpete11
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- Apr 27, 2013
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Wait, what? Is that really true? No multi-year FA signings since 2016? They're obviously cheap and no FA wants to sign here, but that is insane if true.
MrBrightside
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BusinessGoose
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The deferring is mostly a footnote, it's pretty much the same when it all shakes out..
But, As long as teams are willing to give dudes who, let's be real, are very one dimensional $35mil a year for, essentially, life... The pirates will not compete.
That's not a fiscal position this team will even THINK of entertaining. I mean, i don't want Vlad from age 35 on, at all... But who would sign with us for less than any other city?
But they could entertain that though. If they really wanted to. They could absolutely entertain that. I’m not saying they should be paying a guy like Vlad Jr like that. But they could definitely pay a young star $35 million a year if they wanted to
BusinessGoose
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The reality is we know we need to double our salary. There's no internal or external pressure to do so... So defacto, we can not compete at these contract levels.
Then you have the issue of where we are. Vlad got PAID not he's a Torontonian through and through. They didn't pry him out of a nice LA deal.
We could have offered Soto a BILLION and he would have turned us down.
Then you have the issue of where we are. Vlad got PAID not he's a Torontonian through and through. They didn't pry him out of a nice LA deal.
We could have offered Soto a BILLION and he would have turned us down.
see quinn priester got flipped to the brewers. keith law in the trade review refers to his fastball as a bp pitch, oof
- Mar 28, 2025
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WickedWrister
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WickedWrister
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TLDR; Hullihen thinks that $2.2m loss figure reported by DK is miscalculated (using CBT payroll figures and not LRD) and they potentially turned a $19m profit
DJ Spinoza
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- Aug 7, 2003
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Pretty decent showing from Mlod tonight. 5 and dive will work ok as the turn before Skenes' day, and in general I am willing to give a little more run on the experiment to have him start given vague memories I have of being frustrated when we attempted it with Ortiz after having him go to the bullpen, and also just in general trusting Marin and the pitching coaches. I'm less enthused about Harrington coming in now as some kind of piggyback or long reliever, but it's probably good for him to try and get MLB outs somehow.
Otherwise, this game is an interesting little microcosm. So far it's gone well: how I looked at it coming into the night was that, independently from any longer-term concerns or hope etc., it was an opportunity to get a decent leg up on the Cardinals. They got thumped yesterday and their pitching staff is already pretty thin and was taxed headed into tonight. If we could get enough offense, then we could take game 1 and have Skenes tomorrow, obviously a big advantage.
The offense has hit Liberatore well, though he's still been efficient. He probably is gonna go as long as possible tonight so that they can get a reset for some of their relievers. If we take the win, that's not the worst trade in the world, since you have to just go into tomorrow and any Skenes start thinking that we should win it. The Cards have Sonny Gray going, but their pitching staff is all very hittable, including him.
Now, we'll see. 4 innings and a 3-run lead is by no means automatic for this bullpen. Harrington has gotten 2 outs while I was yammering away, and maybe he can just completely finish this one out.... and now it's 4-2. Any kind of modest lead like this still feels like it's on a knife's edge.
Otherwise, this game is an interesting little microcosm. So far it's gone well: how I looked at it coming into the night was that, independently from any longer-term concerns or hope etc., it was an opportunity to get a decent leg up on the Cardinals. They got thumped yesterday and their pitching staff is already pretty thin and was taxed headed into tonight. If we could get enough offense, then we could take game 1 and have Skenes tomorrow, obviously a big advantage.
The offense has hit Liberatore well, though he's still been efficient. He probably is gonna go as long as possible tonight so that they can get a reset for some of their relievers. If we take the win, that's not the worst trade in the world, since you have to just go into tomorrow and any Skenes start thinking that we should win it. The Cards have Sonny Gray going, but their pitching staff is all very hittable, including him.
Now, we'll see. 4 innings and a 3-run lead is by no means automatic for this bullpen. Harrington has gotten 2 outs while I was yammering away, and maybe he can just completely finish this one out.... and now it's 4-2. Any kind of modest lead like this still feels like it's on a knife's edge.
GilbertSeinfeld
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- Mar 4, 2024
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BusinessGoose
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Didn't read.... But that Sounds more accurate.
That was amazing. Great we only used two pitchers. Finally like, a professional looking game from our side lol.
If we are going to stumble into a win, best to do it against division rivals lol
Brewers paid quite a bit: mid level prospect 40FV prospect, Comp A pick which is around #33 and a PTBNL for a pitcher who was edged out with all their signings and trades.
WickedWrister
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Empoleon8771
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DK having a shit fit because someone at the PG dug into his numbers and said they didn't add up.
Reading his twitter makes me nauseous, he blocks anyone who disagrees with him so it's just a pure echo chamber. It sucks because he does have some good employees but the dude is such a bum.
he is truly the worst. can you even imagine posting some incendiary take and not expecting someone to further investigate?
WickedWrister
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DJ Spinoza
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- Aug 7, 2003
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Ethan's post is well worth reading and he doesn't even say he's certain of anything, just that there are some questions about how the math actually adds up.
I don't personally think that the Pirates are making a huge profit, but the number he proposes makes a lot more sense to me than the idea that they are losing money. I don't think any MLB teams are losing money in the current TV deal landscape, though an adjustment may be coming on that front. It seems way more likely that teams are not having operating losses but are able to do creative accounting in order to present whatever numbers they find advantageous.
More simply, if they were actually losing money operationally.... it's extremely hard to believe Keller and/or Reynolds would still be Pirates. They would have shipped one off in the winter.
I don't personally think that the Pirates are making a huge profit, but the number he proposes makes a lot more sense to me than the idea that they are losing money. I don't think any MLB teams are losing money in the current TV deal landscape, though an adjustment may be coming on that front. It seems way more likely that teams are not having operating losses but are able to do creative accounting in order to present whatever numbers they find advantageous.
More simply, if they were actually losing money operationally.... it's extremely hard to believe Keller and/or Reynolds would still be Pirates. They would have shipped one off in the winter.
Empoleon8771
Registered User
I didn't think about this at the time, but a couple of tweets made me wonder about this as well:
DK got on the pre-game show after this report dropped and the Pirates TV announcers were talking about it as well during the game. That paints a major red flag in terms of a conflict of interest with DK's reporting.
DK got on the pre-game show after this report dropped and the Pirates TV announcers were talking about it as well during the game. That paints a major red flag in terms of a conflict of interest with DK's reporting.
BusinessGoose
Registered User
And I mean, even a double digit million in profit is really not much when we're talking the value of a sports team.
I'm sure it's a small profit margin when you think about it
But I'm also emotionally attached to the idea that they sure as hell didn't lose money
I'm sure it's a small profit margin when you think about it
But I'm also emotionally attached to the idea that they sure as hell didn't lose money
It looks like a lot but there a good chance the ptbnl is cash or a nothing burger. I saw tha Law (while admittedly) the highest ive seen on Yorke think the Yorke return is better than this return. But id imagine if your not a Yorke believe the Brewers return would edge it out due to quantity of bites at the apple
Theres a difference between profit/loss and cash flow. Generally because of depreciation/amortization.
For those that dont deal with financials a dumbed down version works like this:
Year 1: negative cash flow of 100 million due to big purchases/facility improvement etc. so you depreciate for 10 years and “only lose 10 million” in the p&l.
Year 2-10: 10 million positive cash flow, but breakeven p&l because of that depreciation.
The total stays the same over the length of the depreciation (10 million loss) but smoothed over 10 years.
Essentially, the certainly could have had positive cash flows but still overall losing money. BUT iirc the 2 mill loss reported was operating only (no depreciation or taxes) and it is unclear if they were using cba amt as an expense or the actual cash number.
Even if they did and it was a paper loss and cash gain, its making up for a past or future year where their cash will be lower than their on paper number. And confirmation that they have taken on debt over the past 5 years speaks to spending more cash that they are bringing in overal
