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OT: Pirates Talk: Lets Play Ball

Lol can't muster 1 run in the easiest of conditions. Doesn't even require a hit, just any ground ball or shirt fly will do. Nope. Then some dude named Canario obviously isn't getting a hit.
 
Weak single to right, Canario thrown out by 10 MILES. He might be the slowest player in HISTORY. I could have scored on that. My goodness, what a SCRUB.

I honestly think that was the single worst base running I've seen out of the Pirates in a decade. It was that bad. You could have ran backwards and scored.
 
Routine grounder to second is the game winning hit because for some reason Frazier was playing in center field. This team needs to be shut down.
 
If this team could just get out of its own way at every level, i think the could be actually good. But they spend what little money the have foolishly, they have a dolt as a manager, and the make so many unforced mental errors is mind bogglinng.
 
Empoleon8771 said:

I think the MLB has another lockout in 2026, but would absolutely love it if it meant that a salary cap is added. I think the Pirates keeping Skenes is significantly more viable with a salary cap, so hopefully it gets added.
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It needs to happen, at a minimum.

The player's union will balk, agents will balk, and I'd imagine the owners of the biggest market teams will balk. So yeah, lockout is almost a foregone conclusion if MLB puts that on the table.

But I've been saying for years, there is no point in having 30 odd teams, a 3rd of which have no real pathway to consistently competing within the confines of the current structure. It's a waste of taxpayer money (not that those in the scheme care) and overall resources to have parks and property that are often empty, teams that make no real effort to spend (because they can't).
 
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DJ Spinoza said:
Gun to my head and I'd say 2-7 here is pretty much "you can put season's over in permanent ink", though I don't see any firings happening so early. I think they will be too cheap to do it, especially since firing Shelton in the offseason would give them more cover for still not giving whoever the next manager is some better players to run out there.

Simply put, 5-4 would make the record 7-9 and thus just kinda shitty. I still don't know where to draw any hope from, but at least that would smooth out the disastrous start.
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Quoting myself here to keep track of these long posts (page 15), but we are basically on the path of mediocrity here. 3-3 to avoid total disaster as we somehow managed to scrape a win against the Yankees and also win the Cardinals series despite Skenes having an off game.

3 games vs the Reds to determine just where we are on the mediocrity/bad team scale for the time being. A series win gets us to that kind of shitty 7-9 start where at least the wheels haven't entirely come off, but flipping two winnable games vs the Marlins would make things look slightly different than they do right now.

The Reds essentially have had an identical season to us and are also coming off a series win, albeit against a better opponent than St. Louis in San Francisco (personally I think the Cardinals should be the worst team in this division, but they have the bungling franchises of Cincy and us to thank for not making it more apparent.... their pitching is absolute dog shit and their lineup is middling at best, but I'm on a tangent).

They have a clear advantage in my eyes on paper, as Singer has looked solid and they'll get Greene vs. Mlodzinski on Sunday. I still think this series is somewhat unpredictable with any outcome being in the cards, but I'd lean towards 1-2 which would make the record a slightly uglier 6-10. They are sweepable, but we are too, just as much, if not more given the pitching matchups and uncertainty about Cruz's hand. Still not sure the details matter at all, given the obvious.
 
You have to wonder if even teams like the Cardinals are coming to the party. They barely spent any money in the offseason.

In general, they need to have a united front of probably 20 owners who just make it very clear they are not going to budge. Who are willing to lose a season like the NHL did to make it happen. I do wonder how they would then have teams like the Dodgers or Mets try and meet the cap. There is no doubt they would be way over.

I'm figuring a cap would be around ~200mil with a floor in the ~150 range. 11 teams are currently above 200mil, 13 teams are below 150mil.

An interesting item with a cap is that it might make Nutting sell the team because he won't want to meet the minimum.
 
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In the NHL when they switched to the cap they let teams buyout pre-lockout contracts without a cap penalty but I don't see any way that would work in baseball as it currently exists.

Pre-lockout NHL certainly had terrible teams but in general free agents were cheap enough that small market teams had stacked rosters (see: the Penguins).

As great as it could be I question if the MLBPA's strength compared to unions in other leagues and the logistical question of how to switch the league to a hard cap system will make it impossible to sell to the players on top of asking them to take a paycut.
 
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It almost needs to fail down to the foundation and something new start.

The gaps from top to bottom in MLB are just immense, I don't see how you can meet in the middle and craft something fair to move on with.

How do you soft reset this behemoth?
 
As a Pirates fan a lockout doesn't scare me at all. We have lost seasons every year. This crappy team isn't even worth watching unless Skenes is pitching, so who gives a shit if we don't get to watch them for a year or two? I don't think it happens though. Agents and players and big market teams have too much power.
 
I would be sad about Skenes, Ohtani, Judge, Trout and Betts losing prime years on potential and 4 probable HoF careers.
 
Baseball dies without a major change. People aren't showing up to the ballparks already and it will only get worse the further the divide becomes. And there is no stopping that gap from expanding with the current scheme continuing unobstructed.

You either contract the league and run 12-16 teams (makes no sense given there would be a couple hundred players out of work who shouldn't be, just at the ML level alone) or you implement a cap that finds some sort of middle ground.

What I think will end up happening, is no cap, but teams like LA/NY will be required to pour even more money into the coffers of assholes like Nutting. He still won't spend, but instead of making 10-20 million in profits, he'll see, 40-50, maybe more. Just depends on how many cheap owners band together and demand more coin.
 
ImporterExporter said:
Baseball dies without a major change. People aren't showing up to the ballparks already and it will only get worse the further the divide becomes. And there is no stopping that gap from expanding with the current scheme continuing unobstructed.

You either contract the league and run 12-16 teams (makes no sense given there would be a couple hundred players out of work who shouldn't be, just at the ML level alone) or you implement a cap that finds some sort of middle ground.

What I think will end up happening, is no cap, but teams like LA/NY will be required to pour even more money into the coffers of assholes like Nutting. He still won't spend, but instead of making 10-20 million in profits, he'll see, 40-50, maybe more. Just depends on how many cheap owners band together and demand more coin.
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I admit I'm not in the know with baseball's revenue shares and such but would something work where teams are rewarded for winning, such as the more wins you get the more revenue share you receive?
 
Rakell67 said:
I admit I'm not in the know with baseball's revenue shares and such but would something work where teams are rewarded for winning, such as the more wins you get the more revenue share you receive?
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I don't think so.

Salary is almost linear with success in this league. The top teams will still outspend and outwin.. So it wouldn't matter.

Maybe if you put a tag that any win money is not "real" and must be applied to roster expenses....

... But i don't know if that would incentivize someone like the pirates to spend or win, because, if it can't be funneled into a pocket, what's the point?
 
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