TSN: Phaneuf asked to waive No-Move clause | Update: He said no.

[danielpalfredsson]

Garrioch says it's only 50/50 whether Phaneuf waives.

If he says no they'll try to move Methot or Ceci.

Oh my god Phaneuf might be the hero that half this board needs.

 

[Canadian Time]

Every year I pray that we don't make a big splash with a signing on July 1.
Those ones basically never work out in the long run

Bingo, me too. The big splash UFAs almost never work and are a hindrance later on. Stick with the next level or two, those are the guys you can get on reasonable bargains and are helpful.

Folks ***** and moan about how UFAs won't sign here, I think it's more because they aren't asked to sign here. Let the HF sycophants say what they want.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

I dunno why everyone wants to give up massive deals for a top-line forward when we can instead offersheet Leon Draisaitl, which would give up around the same amount of assets (in terms of value), but instead get a much younger 1st line center that we can keep for the next 10 years.

If only it was that easy. Maybe we could just trade for that Sidney Crosby guy, he looked pretty good last night against the Predators.

Come on, you honestly think the Oilers wouldn't just match?

 

[Canadian Time]

Seriously, some folks are suggesting giving a first for Vegas to take Ryan, I can't believe that's being suggested.

Ryan will be protected, of course he will.

 

[Super Cake]

You know, every year I have a glimpse of hope that we do something big on Free Agency day in terms of a big signing... and every year I let myself down .

Free agency is not the way to go to build a cup winner these days.

Drafting well and good trades are the way to go.

Just look at the Pens.

All their important players were traded for or drafted.

 

[WadeRedden]

Seriously, some folks are suggesting giving a first for Vegas to take Ryan, I can't believe that's being suggested.

Ryan will be protected, of course he will.

It would be a late first in an underwhelming draft year, so it's not that crazy.

And no, he won't be protected. The guy can't receive a pass without breaking a finer and he's owed another $35+ million over the next five years.

I think it'd be kind of genius is Vegas agreed to take him on in exchange for Ottawa's 1st this year and say, a 4th in 2018 then turn around and trade him to another team for picks while agreeing to eat half his salary for the next five years.* Bobby at 3.75 would be a great acquisition for almost any team in the league.

*This seems unlikely but if Bill Foley's pockets are deep enough maybe it happens. 5 years and 17+ mill is a lot of cake though.

 

[Canadian Time]

It would be a late first in an underwhelming draft year, so it's not that crazy.

And no, he won't be protected. The guy can't receive a pass without breaking a finer and he's owed another $35+ million over the next five years.

I think it'd be kind of genius is Vegas agreed to take him on in exchange for Ottawa's 1st this year and say, a 4th in 2018 then turn around and trade him to another team for picks while agreeing to eat half his salary for the next five years.* Bobby at 3.75 would be a great acquisition for almost any team in the league.

*This seems unlikely but if Bill Foley's pockets are deep enough maybe it happens. 5 years and 17+ mill is a lot of cake though.

We'll know shortly I guess. GMs don't gamble with assets like this while hoping to spend money on some unicorn UFA. All that nonsense to protect Dzingel?

 

[Viletho]

If only it was that easy. Maybe we could just trade for that Sidney Crosby guy, he looked pretty good last night against the Predators.

Come on, you honestly think the Oilers wouldn't just match?

Anyway, if we send an offer sheet to Draisaitl, doesn't he need to accept the offer?

Why would he accept?

It's not like, as far as we know, their is problem in the contract talk right now.

 

[Stylizer1]

If Ryan is reinventing himself as a player it might be dumb to dump him for nothing. He will still be overpaid, but without him we don't make the final 4 this season. Also, if we dump him and he isn't replaced with a somewhat good player, we just take a step backwards is all.

Why would we want a reinvented Ryan? We want the one who was invented to score 30 goals not 30 points.

 

[Real Smart Sens Fan]

Zero chance Murray even entertains that. Dzingel may get a 2nd/3rd pick, if that.

Eh, I think Dzingel would pretty easily get a 3rd round pick and possibly a late 2nd. By the 4th round, I suspect 75% of teams would happily trade their pick for him.

Vatanen obviously is not an option. I'd look at trading Dzingel for one of CGY's 2013 first rounders (Poirier/Shinkaruk/Klimchuk) or a similarly "in flux" prospect from the past 3-4 drafts.

 

[Real Smart Sens Fan]

Why would we want a reinvented Ryan? We want the one who was invented to score 30 goals not 30 points.

Man, you're gonna be absolutely shocked when I tell you... but after the season, they have MORE games called "the playoffs".

You should really watch next year. Pretty exciting tourny.

 

[SpezDispenser]

Claesson >>>> Dzingel

Hell yeah.

 

[PeterSidorkiewicz]

Why would we want a reinvented Ryan? We want the one who was invented to score 30 goals not 30 points.

Because he has to change his game and Boucher helped him do that. There's a whole interview with Bobby who says how he needs to be a net front presence player now.

I thought he had a great playoffs and I'm hoping he brings that same performance for next season.

 

[starling]

Lol at people suggesting Dorion would waste 1st rounder to get rid of Ryan.
That would be a giant **** You to BM, and however deserved this trade and extension might be, we all know it aint happening while he's around.

 

[Stylizer1]

Because he has to change his game and Boucher helped him do that. There's a whole interview with Bobby who says how he needs to be a net front presence player now.

I thought he had a great playoffs and I'm hoping he brings that same performance for next season.

I heard that too. Just 7 mill to do that?

 

[PeterSidorkiewicz]

I heard that too. Just 7 mill to do that?

I feel like you really didn't read my original post.

 

[source]

Good chance Vegas takes Ryan if he's unprotected.

Will there be any unprotected forwards that are better than Ryan?

 

[WadeRedden]

We'll know shortly I guess. GMs don't gamble with assets like this while hoping to spend money on some unicorn UFA. All that nonsense to protect Dzingel?

I think on his most optimistic day Dorion would still view Ryan as a rapidly depreciating asset that has the potential to seriously **** up the Sens budget in a few years when Karlsson, Stone and Turris are all on new deals. They simply cannot afford to pay $7.5 million (in real dollars) to a guy who gets you 50ish points and misses 10 games every year with a finger injury.

If he does get taken I'm not expecting Ottawa to replace him with some magical UFA option but the cap relief could be what saves this team from falling off a cliff a few years from now.

Anyway, if we send an offer sheet to Draisaitl, doesn't he need to accept the offer?

Why would he accept?

It's not like, as far as we know, their is problem in the contract talk right now.

He'd accept because we could offer more money. I mean, if we can guarantee him an extra $12 million over 7 years, is that really something he says no to? Don't forget, Edmonton still has to re-sign Connor McDavid (probably somewhere in the range of $9.7 and that's being generous) plus they still have some players on bad contracts like Pouliot, Nuge etc.) I'm sure they'll have no problem trading guys like Eberle and the Nuge for cap relief but ya never know. Also, I doubt Draisaitl would want to leave given that they play in a brand new arena and are poised to make a bunch of cup runs over the next tens years.

 

[derriko]

I think on his most optimistic day Dorion would still view Ryan as a rapidly depreciating asset that has the potential to seriously **** up the Sens budget in a few years when Karlsson, Stone and Turris are all on new deals. They simply cannot afford to pay $7.5 million (in real dollars) to a guy who gets you 50ish points and misses 10 games every year with a finger injury.

If he does get taken I'm not expecting Ottawa to replace him with some magical UFA option but the cap relief could be what saves this team from falling off a cliff a few years from now.

You get it. 2 years ago the Sens had no bad contracts. Now they have two albatross contracts that are up there for the worst in the league.

And I agree, signing a top UFA is probably a pipe dream, but I would give Oshie Ryan's contract (minus a year or two) and see if he bites.

Oshie is a physical monster, and provides more consistent offense like Ryan DID for Anaheim.

Even if that doesn't work, the cap space you save would open up more options in the trade market too.

Ceci + Brown + pick could net you a very solid player to either fill Ryan's slot, or fill Ceci's.

 

[Hins77]

I hope for you guys. Thats vegas will take him. Very bad contract for a player like him

 

[Flamingo]

Why would Phaneuf agree to waive? I could only imagine the Sens saying that they know Vegas won't pick him, and it would help keep Methot on board to keep the defensive corps intact. It would be a gesture of trust by Phaneuf with the only advantage for him being to keep the the team competitive next season. How does that conversation go?

 

[Micklebot]

You get it. 2 years ago the Sens had no bad contracts. Now they have two albatross contracts that are up there for the worst in the league.

And I agree, signing a top UFA is probably a pipe dream, but I would give Oshie Ryan's contract (minus a year or two) and see if he bites.

Oshie is a physical monster, and provides more consistent offense like Ryan DID for Anaheim.

Even if that doesn't work, the cap space you save would open up more options in the trade market too.

Ceci + Brown + pick could net you a very solid player to either fill Ryan's slot, or fill Ceci's.

Two years ago we had Greening, Michalek, and Cowen who were all overpaid and not really contributing. Heck, you could probably add Wiercioch in that group.

Now, we have guys who are contributing, but are overpaid. The real issue with Ryan and Phaneuf though isn`t how much they are overpaid, it`s the length of the contracts. Things could go sideways fast if their play drops off. If, however, their play doesn`t fall off a cliff, it`s really not so bad (certainly not ideal mind you).

To me though, I`d take the risk of holding on to Ryan and Phaneuf. In 2 or 3 years, if their play doesn`t drop off, their contracts could become more tradeable, as it`s the length that causes the problems. Then, instead of paying teams to take them, we might actually be able to net a modest asset or two, and if we`re real luck, have a prospect ready to step in the hole left by trading them.

Either way we take some risk, and I`d be ok with exposing both in the Expansion draft, I just don`t see it as wise to throw in high picks to have them taken. I think Ryan will rebound next season (hopefully no finger injuries with new gloves and having found his role in Boucher`s system) and Phaneuf could really benefit from Chabot coming into the lineup.

Expanding on Chabot helping out Phaneuf, no I don`t expect them to play together, but I feel as though Chabot allows us to form 3 D pairs the coach will fully trust. What this means is we can blend the deployment the Phaneuf-Ceci pair got with the deployment the Boro-Wideman pair, and split it more evenly across Chabot-Ceci, and Claesson-Phaneuf. This could result in both Ceci and Phaneuf seeing their underlying metrics looking far better than last year when they were buried deployment wise.

 

[Micklebot]

Why would Phaneuf agree to waive? I could only imagine the Sens saying that they know Vegas won't pick him, and it would help keep Methot on board to keep the defensive corps intact. It would be a gesture of trust by Phaneuf with the only advantage for him being to keep the the team competitive next season. How does that conversation go?

Phaneuf, like Ryan, is well aware his contract is undesirable, he in fact has proof of just how undesirable it is in the trade we made to get him in the first place.

His ego won`t be hurt by Dorion saying we'd like him to give us the opportunity to protect 2 Dmen that will surely be snatched up so that we can increase our odds of recreating this years playoff success.

I get why Phaneuf might opt not to waive, but to act as though there really is no incentive to waive is imo naïve. This year was the first time he`s had a real taste of playoff success, and he knows waiving or not waiving affects the teams ability to carry that success forward.

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

Good chance Vegas takes Ryan if he's unprotected.

Will there be any unprotected forwards that are better than Ryan?

projected Vegas Golden Knights roster
http://www.espn.com/nhl/story/_/id/...ft-based-players-left-unprotected-their-teams

 

[Tuna99]

Phaneuf, like Ryan, is well aware his contract is undesirable, he in fact has proof of just how undesirable it is in the trade we made to get him in the first place.

His ego won`t be hurt by Dorion saying we'd like him to give us the opportunity to protect 2 Dmen that will surely be snatched up so that we can increase our odds of recreating this years playoff success.

I get why Phaneuf might opt not to waive, but to act as though there really is no incentive to waive is imo naïve. This year was the first time he`s had a real taste of playoff success, and he knows waiving or not waiving affects the teams ability to carry that success forward.

Also, he wouldn't do this without 100% guarantee from his Agent and Dorion that Vegas would not take him - and let's not forget Vegas owes us some compensation - they took our chief scout, Columbus gave up a 2nd to get their coach, I don;t know what the compensation is for hiring a director of scouting from another team - but I guarantee when Mcphee made the call to Dorion - Dorion let him know that for it to work and Loewes to be released Ottawa needed a favour down the line - and I'm sure this is all part of it.