Salary Cap: Pens Salary Cap Thread: If we score 6 we win, its science!

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Sidney the Kidney

One last time
Jun 29, 2009
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Saw this on IG.

On-ice for and against 5v5 the past 4 games.

Rakell: 1-1
Crosby:2-2
Rust:2-3
Petry: 2-4
Pettersson: 2-4
POJ: 1-2
Malkin: 1-3
Rutta:1-3
Zucker: 1-3
Heinen: 1-4
Dumoulin: 0-6
Kapanen: 0-6
Letang: 0-5
McGinn: 0-3
Carter: 0-4
The fact our top pairing is getting absolutely caved in is a massive issue.

The fact that it's actually an accurate representation of their play and not just them being "unlucky" is an even bigger issue moving forward.
 

Pens x

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Oct 8, 2016
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Saw this on IG.

On-ice for and against 5v5 the past 4 games.

Rakell: 1-1
Crosby:2-2
Rust:2-3
Petry: 2-4
Pettersson: 2-4
POJ: 1-2
Malkin: 1-3
Rutta:1-3
Zucker: 1-3
Heinen: 1-4
Dumoulin: 0-6
Kapanen: 0-6
Letang: 0-5
McGinn: 0-3
Carter: 0-4
Lol at Dumo, Kap and Letang.

Kap with a solid -6, 0 points in those 4 games.

It was a really good call to pay him $3.2 mill AAV for two years.
 
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HandshakeLine

A real jerk thing
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I get why people (including myself here) did defend the signing, although probably most of the board hoped if Kap was back, he'd be back for cheap and last year was just a one off. I just don't think you can justify having this many reclamation projects on a functioning roster and hope for any kind of success.

Secondly, I think Kap would work a lot better on the 3rd with a different 3C. I guess we'll see how that works out if Carter misses time. I don't think he'll become this top 6 guy that everyone was hoping he would be, and certainly isn't worth his 3.2 million, but at the same time, the tools are there. The play-reading and decision making isn't, but that's aggravated with the fact that the 3rd line is just dysfunctional this year.

Again, if McGinn wasn't here Spaling it up, and TB was 3C instead of Carter, Kap would be a much more reasonable gamble for a high-risk/high-reward kind of signing. Instead, we've got way too much money that's tied up in underperforming highly flawed players who we're just hoping get to turn their games around. I don't get why we overpay for all of the depth players on this team instead of just running the cheap guys and keeping the ones who don't suck.

That said, I feel like Kap is realistically the only overpaid forward in the bottom 6 who you might be able to move without getting bent over a barrel. Carter's contract is immobile, McGinn is a severely overpaid 4th liner who isn't very good at anything. Heinen and TB are steals/market value, Archibald is bad but relatively cheap and nobody wants him because he's a liability on the ice. Kap still has the potential to put it together but the team has to cut bait soon if they want to move him.
 
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Pens x

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Oct 8, 2016
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The funniest thing is going back to the threads here in July and seeing people on here defend it.
There were a ton of people who defended re-signing that idiot.

There were some wild theories throw out there to deflect blame from Hextall. My favorite was another team told the penguins to sign him to a two year deal to make him more attractive for a trade.
 

pistolpete11

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Apr 27, 2013
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I'd move Dumo now. I was hoping a healthy offseason would rejuvenate him, but he looks worse. What's he going to look like as the season starts to take its toll and he gets even more banged up? On paper, though, he's only 31, plays 20+min a night, Cup experience, has size, PK's, etc. All the stuff GM's love. So he should be relatively easy to move at only $4M and on and expiring contract, maybe even for some value. Run with:

Rutta - Letang
Petts - Petry
POJ - Ruhwedel

until you can find a Dumo replacement or if Rutta looks good there, then you only need to find a 3RD.

Up front, I don't think there is anything you can do. I'd move Kap and/or McGinn in a heartbeat, but I don't think that's quite as easy to do. You just gotta shuffle around the lines until you find something that you can live with. I'd start by splitting up Cater and Kapanen.

Heinen - Blueger/Poulin - Carter
McGinn - Poehling - Kap
 

eXile3

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Dec 12, 2020
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I have to wonder how much of this is October overreaction and how should be legitimate concern.

It’s only been a months sample size.
 
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CascadiaPenguin

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I'd move Dumo now. I was hoping a healthy offseason would rejuvenate him, but he looks worse. What's he going to look like as the season starts to take its toll and he gets even more banged up? On paper, though, he's only 31, plays 20+min a night, Cup experience, has size, PK's, etc. All the stuff GM's love. So he should be relatively easy to move at only $4M and on and expiring contract, maybe even for some value. Run with:

Rutta - Letang
Petts - Petry
POJ - Ruhwedel

until you can find a Dumo replacement or if Rutta looks good there, then you only need to find a 3RD.

Up front, I don't think there is anything you can do. I'd move Kap and/or McGinn in a heartbeat, but I don't think that's quite as easy to do. You just gotta shuffle around the lines until you find something that you can live with. I'd start by splitting up Cater and Kapanen.

Heinen - Blueger/Poulin - Carter
McGinn - Poehling - Kap
Moving Dumo now would at least create space to get Ty Smith in. Not a direct replacement, but someone who should get a shot and has a pulse, maybe? Better than watching Dumo become Scuderi bad, I guess? He's getting close already.
 
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Sideline

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I also think Dumo looks cooked out there. Hard to imagine there's a ton of demand for his services give the tight cap environment. It might make sense to hold him for now and use him to balance salary in any deadline trades when the teams on the other side have already written off their seasons.
 

pistolpete11

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Apr 27, 2013
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Moving Dumo now would at least create space to get Ty Smith in. Not a direct replacement, but someone who should get a shot and has a pulse, maybe? Better than watching Dumo become Scuderi bad, I guess? He's getting close already.
I'd like to see Smith get some games, but I think both he or POJ would get eaten alive in Dumo's role.
 
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wgknestrick

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Aug 14, 2012
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Lol at Dumo, Kap and Letang.

Kap with a solid -6, 0 points in those 4 games.

It was a really good call to pay him $3.2 mill AAV for two years.

The challenge is players being placed with regular partners for every game so far making it tough to isolate blame with so few minutes played.

I feel that Dumo and Carter are our weakest links on both D+F but have only played with Letang and Kappy so far. Most would agree (outside of Sully) from what they've seen this season. Sully thinks POJ is somehow a problem.

The good news is that WBS seems to have a true squad (and coach) somehow this year available to solve NHL problems. They are playing a good 2 way game, but I don't know if that is just against a poor QOC group of teams or if they are real.

Dumo being traded for future considerations would be a huge trade at this point. Freidman should NOT be in the AHL and Ty is interesting as well. I can't see Sully making tough decisions or properly (analytically) identifying his problems at this point. He only seems to know what solutions worked from 2016.
 
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PensandCaps

Beddy Tlueger
May 22, 2015
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DOC up, love his speed, still think there is something of a good bottom 6 guy with him. Rather play him than McGinn lol.

The challenge is players being placed with regular partners for every game so far making it tough to isolate blame with so few minutes played.

I feel that Dumo and Carter are our weakest links on both D+F but have only played with Letang and Kappy so far. Most would agree (outside of Sully) from what they've seen this season. Sully thinks POJ is somehow a problem.

The good news is that WBS seems to have a true squad (and coach) somehow this year available to solve NHL problems. They are playing a good 2 way game, but I don't know if that is just against a poor QOC group of teams or if they are real.

Dumo being traded for future considerations would be a huge trade at this point. Freidman should NOT be in the AHL and Ty is interesting as well. I can't see Sully making tough decisions or properly (analytically) identifying his problems at this point. He only seems to know what solutions worked from 2016.

Forgot about Friedman, pretty deep D depth down there. But i don't see anyone capable of replacing Dumo.
 
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Randy Butternubs

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DOC up, love his speed, still think there is something of a good bottom 6 guy with him. Rather play him than McGinn lol.



Forgot about Friedman, pretty deep D depth down there. But i don't see anyone capable of replacing Dumo.



The AHL doesn't keep official stats on faceoffs, but from what I've seen this season it seems like DOC is being destroyed in the faceoff circle.

Anyway, DOC has looked better than his stats suggest. And he's at 0.75 points per game*.

*6 points in 7.616 games.
 

PensandCaps

Beddy Tlueger
May 22, 2015
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18,283


The AHL doesn't keep official stats on faceoffs, but from what I've seen this season it seems like DOC is being destroyed in the faceoff circle.

Anyway, DOC has looked better than his stats suggest. And he's at 0.75 points per game*.

*6 points in 7.616 games.

Yah he's NHL ready, and honestly he's looked fine when in the NHL. He has a good toolbox for the making of a good player in your bottom 6, Big and skates well, just gotta use his size more when he's on the 4th line.
 

Pancakes

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It was surprising what a complete none factor Caggiula was. I didn't expect him to be good or anything but he looked solid in preseason. He was a total non entity here.
 

SEALBound

Fancy Gina Carano
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I get why people (including myself here) did defend the signing, although probably most of the board hoped if Kap was back, he'd be back for cheap and last year was just a one off. I just don't think you can justify having this many reclamation projects on a functioning roster and hope for any kind of success.

Secondly, I think Kap would work a lot better on the 3rd with a different 3C. I guess we'll see how that works out if Carter misses time. I don't think he'll become this top 6 guy that everyone was hoping he would be, and certainly isn't worth his 3.2 million, but at the same time, the tools are there. The play-reading and decision making isn't, but that's aggravated with the fact that the 3rd line is just dysfunctional this year.

Again, if McGinn wasn't here Spaling it up, and TB was 3C instead of Carter, Kap would be a much more reasonable gamble for a high-risk/high-reward kind of signing. Instead, we've got way too much money that's tied up in underperforming highly flawed players who we're just hoping get to turn their games around. I don't get why we overpay for all of the depth players on this team instead of just running the cheap guys and keeping the ones who don't suck.

That said, I feel like Kap is realistically the only overpaid forward in the bottom 6 who you might be able to move without getting bent over a barrel. Carter's contract is immobile, McGinn is a severely overpaid 4th liner who isn't very good at anything. Heinen and TB are steals/market value, Archibald is bad but relatively cheap and nobody wants him because he's a liability on the ice. Kap still has the potential to put it together but the team has to cut bait soon if they want to move him.
Pretty good post. Overall I agree. We have "bad" contracts but they are all relatively low impact ones - Kapanen, Carter, and McGinn. If those are the bad contracts a team has, we are sitting pretty good.

Our roster's lynchpin in cohesiveness and effectiveness really relies on the Carter-Kapanen duo. I think you can mix and match the top 6 well enough to make it work, which is particularly true for the original top 6 lines we've had. That top 6 will level out and perform.

4th lines will always be a crapshoot. It's the 3rd line that we can't have going cold or stagnant for long periods of time and when we are fully healthy, we have limited options really. And when I stop and think about it, it's really Carter that is the limiting factor IMHO. I don't like the Carter-Kapanen duo. It didn't work well last year and it doesn't look much better this year. Unless they can find a better LW that shifts the chemistry, I don't think long-term you can have Heinen-Carter-Kapanen as the 3rd line. I'd love to test:

Jake-Sid-Rakell
Zuck-Malkin-Rust
Heinen-Bleuger-Kapanen
Poehling-Carter-McGinn/Archi

I also wouldn't hate using a combination of Bleuger-Kapanen-McGinn-POJ to get a different bottom 6 player in hopes that we can give it a different look. Not sure who that is, though. Usually, you can watch a line underwhelm and say "oh, clearly they need a player who does X, Y, or Z". With 2 of Heinen-Carter-Kapanen, I'm just not sure what that is without saying "it's Carter..."
I have to wonder how much of this is October overreaction and how should be legitimate concern.

It’s only been a months sample size.
I'm not going to bet against Sidney Crosby.
 
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