Salary Cap: Pens '24-'25 Salary Thread: The Crosbicles Volume XIX

[Ryder71]

Yeah it has to be something like that. Like I edited in that post, I think it's dumb but I at least understand the logic Sullivan is working with for his "4th line PKers" idea. I understand that Acciari and Nieto are filling a role in Sullivan's eyes that is keeping their roster spot a lot safer, even if their 5v5 play sucks. I get that. But why is O'Connor locked into a top-9 role, and spending a ton of time in their top-6, with how he has produced this year? He has 10 points in 38 games.

If he's a lineup lock because of his PKing like Nieto and Acciari, whatever but play him on L4. Playing him with Crosby and Malkin regularly is completely stupid though, and he shouldn't be on their 3rd line either with how he has played.

And for the record, the PK of late has decidedly taken a step forward.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

To be fair, I think the "we'll rebuild their value and then flip them for more picks!!1" is HFBPens hivemind. Certainly with Hayes they had to realize there was a real chance they'd be stuck with him. Guys like Glass, I think they'd be looking to resign if he built up his value.

True.

That still makes it funny to me.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

If Puljujarvi had trade value, he wouldn't be on waivers.

You do see why this is a complete ATTEMPT at a misdirect, yes?

How does one build trade value?

Quick hint: it's the opposite of sitting on the bench for weeks at a time while guys like Nieto glom around for the coach to live vicariously through.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Yeah, I dunno when the "acquire->build value->flip later" thing caught on but that's a meme. This team targets dogshit acquisitions, plays them in dogshit roles, they play in a dogshit system, and that all adds up to a situation where even if they wanted to do that flip stuff, they're f***ed.

Besides, this org's way too full of themselves for that kinda thing. They're gonna keep trying this half-in, half-out bullshit as a masquerade for being relevant until Sid retires, then the endless rebuild begins cuz they don't know how to draft or develop well either.

 

[Pancakes]

Pulju hasn't played since the 7th and has as many points as Glass and Acciari... and is only off the pace of DOC and Beau by a few. This despite top six time for much of that group.

Puju isn't exactly a devastating loss but no matter how you spin it this was a waste and yet another in a long line of botched player assessments by this team.

He'd be playing if he could pk but he doesn't so Sullivan has no use for him.

Honestly I think dedicated pkers is f-ing overrated as hell. PKing is the easiest skill in the NHL as evidenced by the fact that even completely unskilled plugs like Nieto and Acciari can do it. The Pens probably could have taught Pulju how to effectively kill penalties and then kept him in the lineup and utilized the offense he brings. It's not hard. At all.

 

[DesertedPenguin]

You do see why this is a complete ATTEMPT at a misdirect, yes?

How does one build trade value?

Players can have value regardless of whether they are actively in the lineup. Change of scenery deals happen all the time. A team desperately in need of forward help could have come calling at any point in the last six weeks.

Toronto was practically picking guys off the street and playing them because of injuries. Colorado has been decimated. They didn't even bother with a low round pick.

If Puljujarvi is claimed, I'm positive it'll be by San Jose or Chicago, a team at the bottom of the league deciding at the last minute that it's worth a shot, just like you or I might grab a drink or snack while waiting with our carts in the checkout line at the grocery store. It'll be an impulse afterthought.

 

[Ryder71]

Players can have value regardless of whether they are actively in the lineup. Change of scenery deals happen all the time. A team desperately in need of forward help could have come calling at any point in the last six weeks.

Toronto was practically picking guys off the street and playing them because of injuries. Colorado has been decimated. They didn't even bother with a low round pick.

If Puljujarvi is claimed, I'm positive it'll be by San Jose or Chicago, a team at the bottom of the league deciding at the last minute that it's worth a shot, just like you or I might grab a drink or snack while waiting with our carts in the checkout line at the grocery store. It'll be an impulse afterthought.

And if he is picked up we add a little cap space. We got him for nothing so there's no net negative here.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

He'd be playing if he could pk but he doesn't so Sullivan has no use for him.

Honestly I think dedicated pkers is f-ing overrated as hell. PKing is the easiest skill in the NHL as evidenced by the fact that even completely unskilled plugs like Nieto and Acciari can do it. The Pens probably could have taught Pulju how to effectively kill penalties and then kept him in the lineup and utilized the offense he brings. It's not hard. At all.

Would like this post twice if I could.

"Specialized PKers" is just coach speak for "pet favorites that remind me of me but largely suck ass and I have to justify their roster spot."

If you can communicate, follow a very basic scheme and most importantly be willing to step in front of point shots you're qualified. Ya think the top 1% of the top 1% of the individuals that play this sport can handle that? Because I do.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

He'd be playing if he could pk but he doesn't so Sullivan has no use for him.

Honestly I think dedicated pkers is f-ing overrated as hell. PKing is the easiest skill in the NHL as evidenced by the fact that even completely unskilled plugs like Nieto and Acciari can do it. The Pens probably could have taught Pulju how to effectively kill penalties and then kept him in the lineup and utilized the offense he brings. It's not hard. At all.

Which is funny because Puljujarvi is a guy tailormade to PK. Smart, defensively sound, big body, long reach. Just didn't have that Sullivan "It" factor baybeeeeeee.

 

[Ryder71]

He'd be playing if he could pk but he doesn't so Sullivan has no use for him.

Honestly I think dedicated pkers is f-ing overrated as hell. PKing is the easiest skill in the NHL as evidenced by the fact that even completely unskilled plugs like Nieto and Acciari can do it. The Pens probably could have taught Pulju how to effectively kill penalties and then kept him in the lineup and utilized the offense he brings. It's not hard. At all.

Here's the problem. At the time the PK started to turn we just came off a bad streak. Sullivan wanted to go with tried and true PKers because he didn't have time to full around with breaking someone else in. Sullivan still believes in this team. It's futile, it's misguided, it's counter productive for the long term viability. But the method to his madness is not all that hard to figure out. Again to worry so much about 4th liners on a team like this just seems kinda silly.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

disappointing. Pulu is better than acciari and nieto by far. but the pk has been 'hot' and we've been winning so gotta stay status quo. even though nieto isn't gonna score a goal the entire season.

Just because you said that, Nieto will now score in game 82 on a double-deflection, off his jockstrap.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I think one way or the other it speaks to where we largely are that any of us are upset they waived Pulju.

But I mean then again this team has needed players with his exact profile in the bottom six every year for years so IDK.

 

[Darren McCord]

Players can have value regardless of whether they are actively in the lineup. Change of scenery deals happen all the time. A team desperately in need of forward help could have come calling at any point in the last six weeks.

Toronto was practically picking guys off the street and playing them because of injuries. Colorado has been decimated. They didn't even bother with a low round pick.

If Puljujarvi is claimed, I'm positive it'll be by San Jose or Chicago, a team at the bottom of the league deciding at the last minute that it's worth a shot, just like you or I might grab a drink or snack while waiting with our carts in the checkout line at the grocery store. It'll be an impulse afterthought.

You really are missing the point here. His value was tanked because the team won't play him.

He is like 180th in the league in points per 60 and is a solid bottom 6 player. if the team had been playing him he probably has value. But when you bench a guy for over a month you tank his value.

it was bad management not to give him any games. Especially on a back to back after losing. You yourself said Neito and Accari have no value. Why not rotate guys and see if you can get one to have value.

Why not bench DOC for a game instead of letting him tank his own value.

 

[Ragamuffin Gunner]

It'll be cool to see Puul claimed, played like an every-day NHLer and flipped for a pick at the TDL.

Eat all the shit Sully.

 

[Pancakes]

Here's the problem. At the time the PK started to turn we just came off a bad streak. Sullivan wanted to go with tried and true PKers because he didn't have time to full around with breaking someone else in. Sullivan still believes in this team. It's futile, it's misguided, it's counter productive for the long term viability. But the method to his madness is not all that hard to figure out. Again to worry so much about 4th liners on a team like this just seems kinda silly.

I don't think that's necessarily it.

I think the answer is simple: Sullivan chose to go with a roster of guys who already do the thing he wants (play boring/pk) rather than someone with upside but who he might have to work with to get to play the way he wants.

Stuff like this scares me for the future where the Pens actually have talented prospects vying for spots. Dubas will have to be smart about not giving Sullivan too many Nietos to play because Sullivan will choose the Nietos over those players 10/10 times.

 

[Darren McCord]

Would like this post twice if I could.

"Specialized PKers" is just coach speak for "pet favorites that remind me of me but largely suck ass and I have to justify their roster spot."

If you can communicate, follow a very basic scheme and most importantly be willing to step in front of point shots you're qualified. Ya think the top 1% of the top 1% of the individuals that play this sport can handle that? Because I do.

Boston had the 7th best PK last year.

Danton freaking Heinen played 91 minutes on the PK.

But when he was here he was not allowed to touch the PK because we needed to protect spots for other scrubs.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

You guys wanna hear something funny?
Nieto is getting more ice time on average than Lizotte, one of our very best players this year.
Lizotte's even better at the PK, which is supposed to be Nieto's calling card.

 

[Ryder71]

I think we're getting to the point where Kyle forces the Penguins into a more obvious fall down the standings. This week hopefully results in some bad losses and helps illuminate to the core that their rag tag merry band of losers simply isn't good enough. And then Kyle can sell some guys off at completely dissuade this team for trying .

 

[IcedCapp]

I think one way or the other it speaks to where we largely are that any of us are upset they waived Pulju.

But I mean then again this team has needed players with his exact profile in the bottom six every year for years so IDK.

Nah. We’ve gotten upset over way less before. We’re a fickle bunch

 

[Darren McCord]

You guys wanna hear something funny?
Nieto is getting more ice time on average than Lizotte, one of our very best players this year.
Lizotte's even better at the PK, which is supposed to be Nieto's calling card.

Lizotte went to school in the Midwest and not Boston. I mean you need to teach the guy a lesson if he is going to be that selfish.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I don't think that's necessarily it.

I think the answer is simple: Sullivan chose to go with a roster of guys who already do the thing he wants (play boring/pk) rather than someone with upside but who he might have to work with to get to play the way he wants.

Stuff like this scares me for the future where the Pens actually have talented prospects vying for spots. Dubas will have to be smart about not giving Sullivan too many Nietos to play because Sullivan will choose the Nietos over those players 10/10 times.

Exactly. People clamoring to get that rebuild on RIGHT NOW are extremely misguided or at least haven't considered this, somehow.

Any rebuild with this entrenched, spoiled, lazy coaching staff is a farce from the word go. I have no idea why we are still giving any of these guys the benefit of the doubt. Sullivan isn't even working terribly hard to hide his biases, anymore. Why would he? Consequences? lol

You guys wanna hear something funny?
Nieto is getting more ice time on average than Lizotte, one of our very best players this year.
Lizotte's even better at the PK, which is supposed to be Nieto's calling card.

This is a good point and something that has stuck in my craw, lately.

Lizard was playing some terrific hockey for weeks and in general all year. His reward? Skate between Acciari and Nieto on L4.

*fart noises*

 

[Ryder71]

I don't think that's necessarily it.

I think the answer is simple: Sullivan chose to go with a roster of guys who already do the thing he wants (play boring/pk) rather than someone with upside but who he might have to work with to get to play the way he wants.

Stuff like this scares me for the future where the Pens actually have talented prospects vying for spots. Dubas will have to be smart about not giving Sullivan too many Nietos to play because Sullivan will choose the Nietos over those players 10/10 times.

By the time we're good again Sullivan won't be here. We have years before this is an issue.

And of course Sully going with players he likes, that's not surprising. But on a team like this it's p[probably a good thing.

 

[Ulf5]

Lizotte went to school in the Midwest and not Boston. I mean you need to teach the guy a lesson if he is going to be that selfish.

EIGHT goals in ONE season? Quarter of a season? Unacceptable!!!
How the hell you gonna defend our net Lizzo if you're in the offensive zone? C'mon man, you're better than that.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Nah. We’ve gotten upset over way less before. We’re a fickle bunch

HEY WHADDA YA MEAN BY THAT?!?

 

[Ryder71]

You guys wanna hear something funny?
Nieto is getting more ice time on average than Lizotte, one of our very best players this year.
Lizotte's even better at the PK, which is supposed to be Nieto's calling card.

Good, so that level of ineptitude should (in theory anyhow) help lead this team down the standings.