Salary Cap: Pens '24-'25 Salary Thread: The Crosbicles Volume XIX

[Gurglesons]

The goal is (as has been explained on numerous occasions) to compete as best we can now with minor trades and low-risk signings while collecting young players and draft picks for the future. Yes, it's a tough thing to balance and it's the best of neither world. But the fact is, the organization committed itself to trying to be competitive while Sid is here.

It's not a rebuild. It won't be a rebuild until Sid and Geno are retired. I guess you can call it a retool of sorts. Bringing in POJ, Glass, Tomasino, etc are in that mold. Fact is though, what's been done this year has cost us VERY little. If everyone performs at their average, it's a WC2 team that will likely get run over by New Jersey or they can be a big surprise if everyone heats up. Who knows. Likely they are where they were last year.

But that doesn't mean the overall goal of "compete now as best we can while building for the future" doesn't exist. Literally everything since the Guentzel has been geared to that specific goal.

I don't think there is any desire from Dubas to do a down to the studs rebuild following Crosby and Malkin's retirement.

 

[Luigi Lemieux]

I don't think there is any desire from Dubas to do a down to the studs rebuild following Crosby and Malkin's retirement.

Should probably try and do what the caps have done. I was totally wrong about them coming into the season, really underestimated what their GM has actually done. Looking closer at it they've retooled expertly and even have some high end pieces like Ryan Leonard and Cole Hutson (Lane's brother) coming soon.

Seems like in today's league having a strong organizational machine top to bottom is more important than bottoming out. Strong player development, pro scouting, solid drafting, identifying and picking up potential value at low cost. Still thinking about it but not so sure I'm on team scorched earth tank anymore. (Maybe just for one year to get McKenna)

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

With all the changes in the draft lottery along with overall team parity over the years I would suggest that it's dicey at best to attempt old school tanking. You can't run it back the way the team did things in 2001-2005 or whatever. Obviously you need franchise level pieces to compete but I don't know that intentionally trying to bottom out your team works all that well anymore.

I would also suggest that trying to "rebuild" with a doofus coach like Mike Sullivan and all the qualities that come with him is doomed from the word go but what do I know.

 

[SEALBound]

Every goalie signing makes Jarry's deal more and more moveable. It's insane.

f***ing horrid deal for Blackwood. Upsetting that the Avs chose to trade for him and give him that vs just taking Jarry for free from us. Not sure if the deal was ever there but whatever. I'm sick of GMs f***ing up the goalie market. You'd think guys like Sakic and Dubas would have learned by now.

I don't think there is any desire from Dubas to do a down to the studs rebuild following Crosby and Malkin's retirement.

I don't know if there needs to be a concerted effort. It's like going to happen naturally. I mean, what does a rebuild really mean? We want to trade away assets for draft capital. Be bad, get top 3ov picks to build around, then start putting together a competitive roster around them.

Once Sid and Geno retire, I don't think there's going to be anyone here that keeps from from bottom 5 finishes. I mean, I think Dubas could keep Rust, Rakell, Karlsson, etc and we'd still get there.

With all the changes in the draft lottery along with overall team parity over the years I would suggest that it's dicey at best to attempt old school tanking. You can't run it back the way the team did things in 2001-2005 or whatever. Obviously you need franchise level pieces to compete but I don't know that intentionally trying to bottom out your team works all that well anymore.

I would also suggest that trying to "rebuild" with a doofus coach like Mike Sullivan and all the qualities that come with him is doomed from the word go but what do I know.

I respect the Sharks for their route to where they are at now. They are in the 2006 Pens category. They got their Malkin and Sid in Smith and Celebrini. Another bad year and they get their Staal. They have their MAF. After that, they can start building.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I respect the Sharks for their route to where they are at now. They are in the 2006 Pens category. They got their Malkin and Sid in Smith and Celebrini. Another bad year and they get their Staal. They have their MAF. After that, they can start building.

Think they'd trade us Granlund?

Could really use him in the top six.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Every goalie signing makes Jarry's deal more and more moveable. It's insane.

There are legitimately more bad goalie contracts than good goalie contracts in the NHL at this point. It's wild.

Hellebuyck and Saros are like the only goalies left in the NHL that actually have what I'd call "good" contracts based on the market.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Pretty soon Jarry, and average starter with issues, is gonna be just another whatever goalie contract-wise. Might be able to get out from that deal yet.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

There are legitimately more bad goalie contracts than good goalie contracts in the NHL at this point. It's wild.

Hellebuyck and Saros are like the only goalies left in the NHL that actually have what I'd call "good" contracts based on the market.

Florida effect + rising cap + sweaty-handed NHL GMs = dumb stuff

Another inevitable round of buyouts in a year or two and/or pawning some of these contracts off on teams like the Penguins will SURELY teach them THIS time!

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

NHL GMs = dumb stuff

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

A very fair distillation of that overall point, yes.

 

[molon labe]

Pretty soon Jarry, and average starter with issues, is gonna be just another whatever goalie contract-wise. Might be able to get out from that deal yet.

By the time that happens -will it even matter if we do?

There's not even a hint that this org is looking to change anything. It's - watch amateur hockey - oh look a waiver claim or depth piece for a pick - and let it roll. The ship is just slowly fading and instead of course corrections we're just getting absolute ineptitude and half-ass talk. Not a single mention of needing more of anything up front, better goaltending, and defense. Just - the players we have need to do better lol. It's clear they truly think this is an 80M+ roster capable of....something. And it's sure as hell something.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

I'm still laughing at Drury giving Shesterkin $12M AAV through 2032 to basically seal the deal on that team's next decade.

By the time that happens -will it even matter if we do?

There's not even a hint that this org is looking to change anything. It's - watch amateur hockey - oh look a waiver claim or depth piece for a pick - and let it roll. The ship is just slowly fading and instead of course corrections we're just getting absolute ineptitude and half-ass talk. Not a single mention of needing more of anything up front, better goaltending, and defense. Just - the players we have need to do better lol. It's clear they truly think this is an 80M+ roster capable of....something. And it's sure as hell something.

It doesn't even really matter now tbh. I just can't f***ing stand Jarry's dumb face and whiny attitude. At least MAF was cool when he was a volatile shitshow.

 

[SEALBound]

I'm still laughing at Drury giving Shesterkin $12M AAV through 2032 to basically seal the deal on that team's next decade.

I mean, if you're going to go all in on a goalie, there are worst goalies to do that with than Shesterkin. He's one of the very few you can. Same thing with Price and to a lesser extent, Bobs. If you let Shesterkin go, you will spend the rest of your career as a GM finding another one. So I don't fault Drury for that contract.

The one thing these ridiculous goalie deals mean is that Jarry's is more palatable. "Hey, trade you Jarry for nothing. If you say no, you'll have to get the next McKenzie Blackwood and pay him $6mil. I hear Lankinen is available. Ooo! Maybe Georgiev or Scott Wedgewood! Or...Tristan Jarry..."

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Bob seems to be the exception for the most part.

Price never won anything arguably in part because he was sucking up too much salary. And he was legitimately incredible.

But I mean... it's goaltending. Can't live with 'em... can't just strap an old tire to the net. Yet. Cowards.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Like I mean... I get it. I was never much of a fan.

But to those that actually want them to try a little this year... that's about what you are looking at. Or nothing.

I'll take some Zucker calibre type over a retread. Or nothing

 

[Gurglesons]

I'll take some Zucker calibre type over a retread. Or nothing

You wouldn't take Zucker for a 6th if we are in playoff contention?

I don't really see the issue at all and honestly would welcome back Zucker. He's exactly what this team has been missing since we moved him.

 

[BusinessGoose]

Zucker did at least have energy when we had him last

The offense wasn't quite there, but he had "heart"

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I'll take some Zucker calibre type over a retread. Or nothing

Well... that's all I'm saying.

We're not REALLY expecting Dubas to bring in a REAL top six player are we?

I figure Zucker caliber for like a 4th or 5th or something is about as good as it's gonna get. It's certainly better than playing Cody Glass or friggin' DOC on L2.

 

[Andy99]

And this is why the coach has to go…we’re like 26th in finishing and don’t have a lot of depth scoring and yet this…just have to laugh, sad

Sullivan “also tries to work with him on the fly on “some of the intangibles with his game,” such as winning puck battles in all zones and his wall play on breakouts.

“[It is about] some of those thankless jobs that don’t show up on the score sheet but add up to winning,” the coach said. “Those are the things we value and those are the areas of the game that we’re trying to help Philip grow and hold him to account.”

https://www.post-gazette.com/sports/penguins/2024/12/27/philip-tomasino-trade-pittsburgh-nashville-predators-mike-sullivan-dubas/stories/202412230088

 

[OtherThingsILike]

Every goalie signing makes Jarry's deal more and more moveable. It's insane.

Jarry's deal is and always was a market-value deal. It's nice to see more signings to use as examples of this, though.

 

[TheGoldenJet]

Hard pass on Zucker.

Get Laine.

 

[Ulf5]

And this is why the coach has to go…we’re like 26th in finishing and don’t have a lot of depth scoring and yet this…just have to laugh, sad

Sullivan “also tries to work with him on the fly on “some of the intangibles with his game,” such as winning puck battles in all zones and his wall play on breakouts.

“[It is about] some of those thankless jobs that don’t show up on the score sheet but add up to winning,” the coach said. “Those are the things we value and those are the areas of the game that we’re trying to help Philip grow and hold him to account.”

https://www.post-gazette.com/sports/penguins/2024/12/27/philip-tomasino-trade-pittsburgh-nashville-predators-mike-sullivan-dubas/stories/202412230088

You know, some players just aren't made for and aren't meant for wall play. And that's OK. JFC.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

You wouldn't take Zucker for a 6th if we are in playoff contention?

I don't really see the issue at all and honestly would welcome back Zucker. He's exactly what this team has been missing since we moved him.

Is that the deal? Because I doubt he goes for so little.

Zucker had 1 solid year out of 3 for us. That was 2 years ago, and he didn't exactly set the world on fire last year.

I'd much rather look elsewhere unless the price is so preposterously low that it wouldn't happen. Like a 6th.

 

[Andy99]

You know, some players just aren't made for and aren't meant for wall play. And that's OK. JFC.

Exactly…why can’t you work with the kid’s strengths, improve those and put him in positions to succeed…instead, every player has to be made into a low event ZAR lol…I will be furious if Sullivan is here next season to work with our players coming up from Wilkes

 

[Gurglesons]

Is that the deal? Because I doubt he goes for so little.

Zucker had 1 solid year out of 3 for us. That was 2 years ago, and he didn't exactly set the world on fire last year.

I'd much rather look elsewhere unless the price is so preposterously low that it wouldn't happen. Like a 6th.

That's what he went for last year.