Salary Cap: Pens 2024 Summer Thread: "Thus, knocking us out of these superior numbers when we emerge! Mr. President, we must not allow a non-playoff bound gap!"

[Pancakes]

Well, that would be the quickest way to assemble good enough prospects to be a contender again.

It’s all about if you want to watch a middling team for another 5 years or just rip the bandaid off.

As long as Sid remains here we aren't tanking. He's too good to let us. So you'd be stockpiling mid and late firsts and hoping for the best if you went that route.

 

[SomeDude]

As long as Sid remains here we aren't tanking. He's too good to let us. So you'd be stockpiling mid and late firsts and hoping for the best if you went that route.

We tanked with old Mario, we can tank with old Sid. He can just play 15 games a year and make it to 2 more Olympics.

 

[Pancakes]

Already made that comment in the coaching thread lol



Kyle Dubas' messaging is to mimic the LA Kings and New York Rangers model and be competitive, but get younger.

The successful way to do that is by dealing your valuable assets for picks and prospects and then using the cap space opened up to acquire youth.

Vegas and Boston have shown this format. You go into the season with cap space and use the trade deadline to make big swings.

You can open up that cap space by moving the Smiths and Rakells of the world. And the Jarrys

Let's start with that and see where it gets us imo.

 

[Empoleon8771]

They missed the playoffs bc their PP was shitty and they couldn't hold leads. The bottom 6 was way down the list of reasons for their season ended up like this.

Their bottom-6 wasn't 2022-2023 levels bad this year but I really can't agree with this.

I think the 3rd line was fine for most of the year but the 4th line was dreadful. I don't think it's the end of the world if they go into next year with O'Connor-Eller-Puustinen as L3, but the 4th line needs a lot of help that probably won't be able to be provided by just getting guys from WBS.

I think they need at minimum a 3C to push Eller to 4C, not because Eller as 3C is unacceptable but because I really think the 4th line needs Eller to anchor it. That would give them something like:

O'Connor-Wennberg-Puustinen
Nieto-Eller-Acciari
Poulin-Puljujarvi

 

[Gurglesons]

You can open up that cap space by moving the Smiths and Rakells of the world. And the Jarrys

Let's start with that and see where it gets us imo.

You can, but you are likely paying for it.

 

[Pancakes]

We tanked with old Mario, we can tank with old Sid. He can just play 15 games a year and make it to 2 more Olympics.

Lol Mario did love to say f*** it plating for those awful Pens teams and who could blame him.

Idk if Sid is willing to do the same tho

 

[SomeDude]

Lol Mario did love to say f*** it plating for those awful Pens teams and who could blame him.

Idk if Sid is willing to do the same tho

Probably not so he could retire or move on. I’d love to see the guy only play here but I’d also like to see a Penguins team that could legitimately win a Cup again before the death of the sun.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Their bottom-6 wasn't 2022-2023 levels bad this year but I really can't agree with this.

I think the 3rd line was fine for most of the year but the 4th line was dreadful. I don't think it's the end of the world if they go into next year with O'Connor-Eller-Puustinen as L3, but the 4th line needs a lot of help that probably won't be able to be provided by just getting guys from WBS.

I think they need at minimum a 3C to push Eller to 4C, not because Eller as 3C is unacceptable but because I really think the 4th line needs Eller to anchor it. That would give them something like:

O'Connor-Wennberg-Puustinen
Nieto-Eller-Acciari
Poulin-Puljujarvi

And that's why in my original response: give the 3/4 Lines a good C to anchor them, and let the WBS kids play defense to their hearts content. I mean they aren't getting scoring positions, so why pay premium prices for defense?

 

[Pancakes]

You can, but you are likely paying for it.

Perhaps. Not a problem if the cap space is used well in fa or trades though.

Given Dubas' track record last year though good luck to us with that...

Probably not so he could retire or move on. I’d love to see the guy only play here but I’d also like to see a Penguins team that could legitimately win a Cup again before the death of the sun.

Unless Dubas nails it we are probably about to see ten or more years of missing the playoffs. Look at the Wings and how they ended up.

 

[Gurglesons]

Perhaps. Not a problem if the cap space is used well in fa or trades though.

Given Dubas' track record last year though good luck to us with that...

Getting Rust's cap and term off the book is a win.

I don't think you can get Rakell's without paying.

Smith you probably are taking back cap or retaining.

I'd rather do Rust. Maybe package one of those pieces for a similar player that is younger.

Then use the cap space to take advantage of players that aren't QO'd, cap dumps, etc.

 

[SomeDude]

Unless Dubas nails it we are probably about to see ten or more years of missing the playoffs. Look at the Wings and how they ended up.

The only thing Dubas has ever nailed in his life is making some people think he is good at his job.

I would trust a 19 year old with a bottle of Jack and car keys more than Dubas with cap space.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Sid just had pretty much the best season a 36 year old's ever had and this team almost fell bass ackwards into a top-10 pick (before the lotto). They're absolutely capable of being complete dogshit with Sid around.

We need to stop parroting the bullshit PR garbage Dubas and the organization say about Sid being too good to prevent this team from bottoming out.

 

[Pancakes]

Sid just had pretty much the best season a 36 year old's ever had and this team almost fell bass ackwards into a top-10 pick (before the lotto). They're absolutely capable of being complete dogshit with Sid around.

We need to stop parroting the bullshit PR garbage Dubas and the organization say about Sid being too good to prevent this team from bottoming out.

They could end up in the top 10 but even before they decided to stop being babies and start trying to make the playoffs again they were still tracking to finish at worst 8th overall.

That would have given them a 6% chance at a lottery pick. Hardly compelling odds.

Getting Rust's cap and term off the book is a win.

I don't think you can get Rakell's without paying.

Smith you probably are taking back cap or retaining.

I'd rather do Rust. Maybe package one of those pieces for a similar player that is younger.

Then use the cap space to take advantage of players that aren't QO'd, cap dumps, etc.

You think we get anything good for Rust with his NMC? If you're getting him to waive that it would have to be to a team he wants to go to.

I know Detroit was interested so maybe that would have been a possibility. I doubt Detroit would be willing to deal a first though. Yzerman isn't ready to start moving out high picks yet I don't think.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

They could end up in the top 10 but even before they decided to stop being babies and start trying to make the playoffs again they were still tracking to finish at worst 8th overall.

That would have given them a 6% chance at a lottery pick. Hardly compelling odds.


You think we get anything good for Rust with his NMC? If you're getting him to waive that it would have to be to a team he wants to go to.

I know Detroit was interested so maybe that would have been a possibility. I doubt Detroit would be willing to deal a first though. Yzerman isn't ready to start moving out high picks yet I don't think.

I just mean the team's very flawed and while Sid's still good, he's not some juggernaut anymore. If they started to piece out the roster and sell, Sid's not gonna prevent them from bottoming out. That's nonsense, imo.

 

[Pancakes]

I just mean the team's very flawed and while Sid's still good, he's not some juggernaut anymore. If they started to piece out the roster and sell, Sid's not gonna prevent them from bottoming out. That's nonsense, imo.

If by "bottoming out" you mean entering the top 10, then I agree. They'd have to sell a ton of pieces for them to become a top 5 pick team (without winning the lotto) though.

Can you imagine a team with Sid on it being worse than this year's San Jose, Chicago, Columbus, Montreal, or Anaheim? I can't.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

If by "bottoming out" you mean entering the top 10, then I agree. They'd have to sell a ton of pieces for them to become a top 5 pick team (without winning the lotto) though.

Can you imagine a team with Sid on it being worse than this year's San Jose, Chicago, Columbus, Montreal, or Anaheim? I can't.

A ton of pieces? I don't agree with that. If you deal Petts you have a blueline with a grand total of zero defensively capable guys imo. That's a clusterf***. I'm not even really a Petts fan tbh. Ned went on like a 10 game run and sorta saved face for this organization imo.

They're not as bad as those teams, but they're also not miles different imo. A lotta recognizable names, but this team's a shitshow. Columbus and Chicago are gonna keep getting better. SJ is intentionally tanking, so is Anaheim. I dunno.

Sid's impressive, but this mystique that he alone is good enough to prevent this team from starting to collect top caliber prospects is silly imo. If Dubas had a change of heart and sold Petts and Rust, this team's for sure in the running for top-3 picks--particularly if age and injury find Sid.

 

[SomeDude]

If by "bottoming out" you mean entering the top 10, then I agree. They'd have to sell a ton of pieces for them to become a top 5 pick team (without winning the lotto) though.

Can you imagine a team with Sid on it being worse than this year's San Jose, Chicago, Columbus, Montreal, or Anaheim? I can't.

I mean, we saw it with Mario on a team that consisted of Lasse Pirjeta’s and Toby Petersen’s and Dan Focht’s.

Mario was 100% as good as Sid is now at the point.

 

[Pancakes]

A ton of pieces? I don't agree with that. If you deal Petts you have a blueline with a grand total of zero defensively capable guys imo. That's a clusterf***. I'm not even really a Petts fan tbh. Ned went on like a 10 game run and sorta saved face for this organization imo.

They're not as bad as those teams, but they're also not miles different imo. A lotta recognizable names, but this team's a shitshow. Columbus and Chicago are gonna keep getting better. SJ is intentionally tanking, so is Anaheim. I dunno.

Sid's impressive, but this mystique that he alone is good enough to prevent this team from starting to collect top caliber prospects is silly imo. If Dubas had a change of heart and sold Petts and Rust, this team's for sure in the running for top-3 picks--particularly if age and injury find Sid.

I think it would take more than just MP and Rust

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

I think it would take more than just MP and Rust

Well, agree to (vehemently) disagree.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I can see the logic for trading Rust to immediately use those assets to make a Hagel type of trade to get younger, but I don't really see any sort of logic for trading Pettersson right now. Defensemen age better than forwards, so you can probably trade Pettersson in 3 years and still get a strong return for him. He'd be 31 for the entirety of the 2027-2028 season, I figure you'd still get a haul for him if you traded him then.

Give him like a 5 year extension and then plan on trading him in like year 3 of that deal.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

I know Sid says he wants to keep playing and doofuses like Rossi and shit think he's gonna play until he's 40 but I genuinely see him hanging on to get one final shot at Olympic gold alongside MacKinnon and Marchand then he'll be done. This team's gonna be on like a near decade of ever-worsening decline, and he may never play another playoff game again. I get that he's only ever known hockey, but at some point he's gonna just get sick of this shit.

 

[Gurglesons]

I can see the logic for trading Rust to immediately use those assets to make a Hagel type of trade to get younger, but I don't really see any sort of logic for trading Pettersson right now. Defensemen age better than forwards, so you can probably trade Pettersson in 3 years and still get a strong return for him. He'd be 31 for the entirety of the 2027-2028 season, I figure you'd still get a haul for him if you traded him then.

Give him like a 5 year extension and then plan on trading him in like year 3 of that deal.

Pettersson won't return anything of value anyway. Two 2nds type player.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Pettersson won't return anything of value anyway. Two 2nds type player.

Yeah I was going to use the Chris Tanev trade as a type of return he'd bring back, and Tanev brought that back as a 34 year old rental. He'll bring back a B prospect and a 2nd if you trade him now, but he'll also bring back a B prospect and a 2nd if you trade him in 4 years at age 31.

If you can get the same return in 4 years as what you can get now, I don't see a reason to not just keep Pettersson for those 4 years and then move him for that return.

 

[Pancakes]

Pettersson won't return anything of value anyway. Two 2nds type player.

He's good enough to warrant a first as a return imo but I don't think a lot of gms are smart enough to realize his value

 

[Gurglesons]

He's good enough to warrant a first as a return imo but I don't think a lot of gms are smart enough to realize his value

Defensive 20-30 pt defensemen don't return 1sts that have Marcus Pettersson physical ability.